Ignoring or harming PvP in game design is contributing to ganking

If you want to stop ganking, well answer one is you can't, since someone has to die to set off the chain. But, you can make a criminals life harder by accruing more and more heat that does not go away.

We have weak sauce BH come after you, who need to be engineered and come in large numbers. They need to be annoying and a threat to work.

We need ATR that are persistent, and that follow you. I suggested this:


What this does is remove a killers shields wherever they go and are detected (but can be avoided with skill- i.e., if they lay low and stay away from trouble).

Lastly its on the individual to do as much as they can to be safe, 'git gud' is not an insult, but advice. Build better, fly smarter.

Notoriety has to act as a modifier, in that by being naughty it shuts you out of 'polite society' and opens up places like anarchies. Imagine there are systems that have roving bands of pirates in G5 ships, and the only way to get them to avoid you is to be feared via notoriety 10, 20 etc. In this way players who kill are encouraged away from law abiding systems which have the roving ATR on scan (as done above).

I really hate artificial clauses and would love something more organic like this, where the way you play shapes how the galaxy reacts to you that at the same time allows the norms to be protected but still allows killing.
Here we go again ...

I recently saw an interview of Braben saying that you can't keep 'tinkering' forever with the game as you will never finish, so we probably shouldn't hope too much for C&P changes any time soon.
 
Here we go again ...

I recently saw an interview of Braben saying that you can't keep 'tinkering' forever with the game as you will never finish, so we probably shouldn't hope too much for C&P changes any time soon.

Its why when I think of ideas they are as simplistic as possible- that one I suggested in that post is an example of that thinking, its a simple clause.

But as far as wholesale change, I think general C+P is now 'it'.
 
Its why when I think of ideas they are as simplistic as possible- that one I suggested in that post is an example of that thinking, its a simple clause.

But as far as wholesale change, I think general C+P is now 'it'.
I agree of course that plenty can be done just by adjusting a few weights and balances within the current structure. The only tricky one might be the persistent ATR that hunts you down.

I would love to see a global bounty board as well ..
 
A lot of the time people forget:

Skills
Ship build
Location

Most of ED space is 'safe' in that its not a place others go, but for CGs, engineering bases, PP areas, areas of interest (such as discovered sites, mat gathering holes) people rock up in silly ships and panic, and get blown up.

If more people learnt to evade and build better and plan better, gankers would have a much harder time and might actually become rarer naturally since the victims get away more.
But thats the problem. The victim gets nothing out of the encounter. You fan right back, give up or run. And even if you run/win against the enemy, It wont change anything, wont give the victim anything.
Only the attacker gets something out of killing/stealing from someone. The prey gets nothing if they win. Thus not many Players wants to be in open.
 
Most of ED space is 'safe' in that its not a place others go, but for CGs, engineering bases, PP areas, areas of interest (such as discovered sites, mat gathering holes) people rock up in silly ships and panic, and get blown up.

If more people learnt to evade and build better and plan better, gankers would have a much harder time and might actually become rarer naturally since the victims get away more.

Well its well known fact that unengineered ship whatever stuff it carries is just easy target for dedicated killing machines. How then one can engineer ship (if playing only in open) if conveniently located engineering places are full of trigger happy psychos? Or is answer that don't do your engineering in open?
 
But thats the problem. The victim gets nothing out of the encounter. You fan right back, give up or run. And even if you run/win against the enemy, It wont change anything, wont give the victim anything.
Only the attacker gets something out of killing/stealing from someone. The prey gets nothing if they win. Thus not many Players wants to be in open.
From the various sources I have seen, at least 30-40% are regularly in open: the prey gets an opportunity to do it better next time.
 
But thats the problem. The victim gets nothing out of the encounter. You fan right back, give up or run. And even if you run/win against the enemy, It wont change anything, wont give the victim anything.
Only the attacker gets something out of killing/stealing from someone. The prey gets nothing if they win. Thus not many Players wants to be in open.

To me its a matter of mass inoculation- the reason why gankers are revilled is because people let them get away with it through ignorance and a lack of learning. If 90% of people learnt to evade and build better ships, you'd have less ganking issues.
 
Well its well known fact that unengineered ship whatever stuff it carries is just easy target for dedicated killing machines. How then one can engineer ship (if playing only in open) if conveniently located engineering places are full of trigger happy psychos? Or is answer that don't do your engineering in open?
You can always just switch to solo when you go to the engineers, and stay in open otherwise.
 
Well its well known fact that unengineered ship whatever stuff it carries is just easy target for dedicated killing machines. How then one can engineer ship (if playing only in open) if conveniently located engineering places are full of trigger happy psychos? Or is answer that don't do your engineering in open?

Its a matter of luck sometimes, or temporal: just waiting for them to log off / move on. The other is to ask for help, or use an alternative engineer if you can.
 
To me its a matter of mass inoculation- the reason why gankers are revilled is because people let them get away with it through ignorance and a lack of learning. If 90% of people learnt to evade and build better ships, you'd have less ganking issues.
That's True. The reason, as to why People die is Because they spec their ships for mining, etc. You, get less if you, do t have x-equpiment. But then, they mostly Also, go to solo or PG, cuz there they fan get away, with it.
People would build better ships for open and would Also, fly in open, if the risk was Worth it, right?
 
That's True. The reason, as to why People die is Because they spec their ships for mining, etc. You, get less if you, do t have x-equpiment. But then, they mostly Also, go to solo or PG, cuz there they fan get away, with it.
People would build better ships for open and would Also, fly in open, if the risk was Worth it, right?
The 'reward' for playing in open could just be seeing a galaxy that seems more alive and varied (and risky). I can't see fdev rewarding open mode players in other ways.
 
Its a matter of luck sometimes, or temporal: just waiting for them to log off / move on. The other is to ask for help, or use an alternative engineer if you can.
Not evwryone will have the time or means to wait for the other person to log off.
And asking for help Also requires time. And trust that that person who is supposed to help you, won't Kill you. Also, its impossible to ask, for help in game. You can of course go to a discord, etc... But can you See how much of a Brother that, becomes? For someone with Little time it May be a problem.
 
I think I once heard fdev saying the vast majority of players play in Open.

Indeed, and it was meaningless because most players have used all or some of the modes at one stage or another despite grandiose proclamations to the contrary. You could spend 99% of your time in open, be classed as an 'Open' player by Frontier and switch to solo every single time you are at an engineer, Shan Dez, or 'hotspot' and nobody else may ever get a mark one eyeball on you.
 
The 'reward' for playing in open could just be seeing a galaxy that seems more alive and varied (and risky). I can't see fdev rewarding open mode players in other ways.
But they do!
When you are a pirate and you play in open, you get to steal from others. You have all that gameplay. And rewards for winning.
The prey gets nothing ^~^.
 
Its a matter of luck sometimes, or temporal: just waiting for them to log off / move on. The other is to ask for help, or use an alternative engineer if you can.
Of course going into engineering systems and getting ganked enough times gives option to block most those lulz shooters. There is after all limited number of them. Making open much more reasonable place for player.
 
But they do!
When you are a pirate and you play in open, you get to steal from others. You have all that gameplay. And rewards for winning.
The prey gets nothing ^~^.
Player piracy in my books is proper pvp and is part of open experience. And outside of popular mining areas quite rare experience.
 
But they do!
When you are a pirate and you play in open, you get to steal from others. You have all that gameplay. And rewards for winning.
The prey gets nothing ^~^.
The prey could get a lot of fun out of such an encounter as well: as a pirate I always try to engage in banter with the prey, and only steal a reasonable amount, probably 10 mins of mining.
 

Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
I think I once heard fdev saying the vast majority of players play in Open.
Sandro said something like that - with both Solo and Private Groups enjoying "significant portions" of the player-base.

Another Dev indicated that Frontier are "well aware" that the majority of players don't get involved in PvP.
 
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