So the next question is "Why don't players understand the game?"
It’s not a coding problem, Dev. designers don’t understand people. So they’re blindsided every time
- Thread starter Lee Archer
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So the next question is "Why don't players understand the game?"
Which content are you refering to and what 20% / 80% are you refering to.
they understand the game, and its lame. Doing the same over and over again, with the equal outcome is just unfun game design. It adds nothing to the games fun. but it is aneeded feature to progress. Hows that a fitting universe? Thats bad for a game of today.
Early old and good games weren't made by people who undertsand people, but they understood how to make a proper abtsracted model of the real worlds counterpart their game was supposed to be. And thats why these games were good. They also had a sufficient background as IT people or were nerdy enough to play their own game, and therefore made sure GUI and UI were sufficient. But what some devs today develop is often less efficient, and sometimes even far from usable at all.
Just take the settlers and see the games devlopment how how it went out of what it was and why people were unhappy with it.
or take other old titles like Transport tycoon, No other railroad or tycoon title has yet reached the depth of that games features. How cna that be? how is it that those newer games couldn't simply take the old mechanics and add something? Because devs were either unable to scope at the same level, or thought other mechanics would be more fun, while they weren't. Then you ahve all tiem classic games, Like Sims or Sim City, they never changed much about major core mechanics just gave us graphical upgrades. And oh wonder, these games are successfull through all their titles. (maybe excluding when EA decided to make SC an forced online version).
Maybe 80% of the playerbase enjoyed the Gnosis event?
I certainly did enjoy it, and I didn't even take part in it.
These would be the numbers he pulled out of his …
These magic number always agree with any argument you are making. Special numbers.
I don't think people do not understand game. They just don't 'feel' it. ED does allow you to get Anaconda in few weeks - if you really desire to. So many people think that's how it should be and then are left confused what really to do in this game. They never give game a time, because no one gives anything a time these days, because there are so much things to do, so much to check out, to play. It is a slow burner, which requires certain participation and role play. And that might depend on inividual caring about such element in such game. Also to be fair, ED role play elements were very lacklustre till avatars showed up.There's still lot of elements missing. Without role play, people try to play it as strategy, as meta game, as arcade shooter, etc. anything but space commander life sim which is kinda what FD aim for.
So long story short, there are lot of pieces missing, thankfully FD is getting there. I never think it is fault of any of players if they can't 'connect' with ED. However I am a bit sad of dismissal of having such experience in first place.
Simple answer is that the average human being is unable to see beyond the scope of their own wants and needs.
Ask a player what the game needs and you will find as many nuanced variations as players you've asked. If the 1/9/90% theory is accurate, it would likely require a perspective far greater than any player has access to.
Guess they could always put up a poll in-game to give equal opportunity to every player and have the question cycle each week to allow them to narrow down (as close to a majority as possible) design changes. Better than them dredging the forums as while a great number of decent players and good ideas reside here, we are in no way a majority.
Just my 3.141592 cents...
That's irrelevant to my response. I'm pointing out that this thread doesn't make a specific suggestion.
No need to repeat them. However, the point I made still stands. If you complain without making a specific suggestion, then your complaint is useless. The existence of specific fix suggestions elsewhere (which you allege, but bother to don't link to) is irrelevant.
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As I suspected.
Working in infrastructure (for far too long), this has been my experience of a majority of coders I've had to support/work with - they don't understand users. At all. I don't think this is just a game development thing.
giving the game time? The game asks for way too much time, there would be SOO many funny builds to test, and I had a lot of fun tinkering in the ED shipyard online. but at them moment i relaised most of these builds would take me like 100+hours of plain dedicated grind, I just accepted that the fun about those builds ended there.
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Easy Columbo... squint any harder and your glass eye will pop out.
FDev:Elite Dangerous is like George Lucas: Star Wars
thats nonsense, why would someone being mad about his mobile phone constabntly crashing need any suggestion to make except "fix it". It's neither i his expertise to do more than a complaint, nor his job. Except you set your own company standards so low, you expect a working product to be an unusual request. that doesn't makes his complaint useless. he only needs to tell you whats wrong and not state the fix.
Thats really weird basic broken logic you deliver there.
It's easy, if I was in a bad mood I'd say tell them no, was supposed to be locked off, choose somewhere else. If I'd had my coffee, then sure, let them jump into a dead sector of space and fly around bored for a month (cause there's [redacted] all in those permit locked areas). If I felt particularly evil I'd let 'em jump and turn it into the firefight of the century (ensuring the No Fire Zone and kicked to Prison ship were turned off)...
But, if I was a decent lead designer (with a month to play with), I'd set the system up with some easter eggs, an alien base, some floating alien ruins, war zones (USS but near points of interest not just dead space), and new information to discover (DBraben supposedly has a bible sized printout of stuff concerning the Thargoids).
Have the Gnosis be damaged exiting warp with some mining required to CG fix it within the month. I might even, devs willing, get some stellar anomalies in there and maybe beta test some of the new exploration tools coming in 3.3 with the 11000 players participating, maybe open up a temporary forum for that group to discuss issues and ideas (and would respond to them). I would also have a troubleshooter on board for the first 24 hours so any unforeseen issues could be addressed as quickly as possible.
So, miners, explorers, beta testers, fighters would all enjoy the experience. Traders... well, maybe have a way for players to buy and sell ship bits to each other, so those with no anti thargoid weapons could buy them from other players, so yep, even traders would be happy
I'm sorry but your post is just a huge non sequitur.
+1 Repped.
Starting in the early days of WoW, a fundamental shift occurred in online games where game developers began sacrificing vision for the placating of those unhappy with parts of the game. Of course it’s not a bad thing for a developer to carefully consider feedback from paying customers, but it began to go to an extreme. In the old days, if you didn’t like what an online game offered you simply moved on to one you enjoyed better, there wasn’t this great expectation or “pressure” to hold the developers hostage into designing the game you wanted.
The problem here is Frontier is a very old school developer and Elite has a more oldschool approach in a lot of things and for gamers in 2018 accustomed to pressuring devs into making changes they want, it’s almost a system shock that a developer is daring to hold out and make the game their way, regardless.
To reiterate, there is a place for listening to feedback and making changes, but if you carefully read these forums and Reddit, were quite a bit beyond feedback and into “I want the game overhauled to something I’ll enjoy better.”
Quite simply, I have a ton of respect for Frontier for making the game as best they can according to their vision, despite the loud complaints from people the game may not be quite suited for. They’re not caving to a subset of players that probably shouldn’t be here and are instead continuing on a path that will be baffling to gamers that expect a developer to cave to whining. It’s not working and these people are at a loss for words and conclude FDev must be incompetent.
It’s actually pretty crazy, we’re so conditioned to getting what WE want we don’t know what to do with a developer that’s making the game according to what THEY want, for better or worse.
Given the sustained popularity of Elite, to reiterate, they’re not doing quite as bad a job as the vocal forum critics would have you believe.
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Not to go off topic but if I was in charge, I'd take the same code that was used to procedurally generate the Milky Way, and I'd use it to procedurally generate Andromeda. Then I'd make the Thargoids literally unbeatable. Furthermore, I'd have them start "glassing" earth-like worlds. The whole game would be about retreating from the invasion.
First we'd retreat to Colonia. Over the course of perhaps a year or two, the entire bubble would be overrun with Thargoids and a wasteland of destroyed earth-likes. There'd be missions to go behind the lines for salvage and rescue, but if you run into a thargoid, you'd know you have to run for your life.
The amount of salt from this would be enormous. "This game sucks because you can't beat the aliens!" And I'd just say, "yes - your assumption that you must be able to win is false."
But then eventually, I'd introduce a Guardian transporter device that would let us escape to Andromeda. There'd be a huge community goal lasting months to get it repaired and powered up - right as the Thargoids start destroying Colonia too.
The transporter is a one way trip. You can choose to take your character and one ship into it, but you can never come back to the Milky Way. Also, it transmits you to Andromeda at the speed of light. When you arrive, it's not 3304, it's the year 2,540,304. You're in a completely new (and larger) galaxy. There will be community goals to build stations and colonies (just like how Colonia is growing).
The Milky Way will hang in the sky - humanity's home, but now Thargoid territory.
Justified criticism aside (=the criticism I agree with), that's because they bought the wrong game. You just need to take a look at steam reviews to find out. The majority of bad reviews is written by people who struggled to create a game account and if they succeeded they failed to launch their ship even though the game tells them how.
Long gone are the days where games didn't hold their players hands, like Jagged Alliance, the first Rainbow Six games, etc. People expect their games to be like Call of Duty. They need a tutorial that shows them how to run forward. Elite is a niche game for players of the past and that's a good thing since there are plenty of alternatives for people who are easily satisfied.
That said, the game is still far from perfect and it sometimes does seem like FDEV doesn't manage to understand their players.
Yeah just try to dodge the logic if you can't logically argue with to anymore GG.
Do you even know why there is somehting called suggestion and something complaint? Because thats 2 different things. But I guess at this point you are anyways only trolling anymore.
Sorry but the intro missions are pure garbage, And no thats not about handholding. Even the superold games bakc in the 90's had a proper Tutorial. But ED's tutorial is out of coding lazyness a series of videos. And that is really bad.
And yes even as stupid as it sounds, a tutorial that shwos you how to run forward belongs in a proper tutorial. Sure the standard game nowdays may know WASD is very much the walking standard, but still some gamers may have their "first time" with the genre and so this definately belongs into a proper tutorial. Ee even had manuals describing this, but today you may find this only in the settings of the controls (which sucks as it constantly breaks the game badly). So please lets not justify lazy tutorial avoidance of even basic commands with "expecting to hold hands"
https://archive.org/details/Half-Life_Manual
back then when manuals even explained every settings point. EVERY.
And nowdays? Many games rely on a playermade wiki to explain the basics. Which is far from how it should be.
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