Less than 5k cmdrs logging in now.
- Thread starter Dragsham
- Start date
This post declares it was done at 2:30 am. I'm in the central time zone. That indicates to me that a large section of the global population is asleep rather than logged into elite.
Yes, because Australia, North and South America go to bed at the same time as we do, despite it being broad daylight.
How are those data collected ? Isn't it from EDDN ? If it is, it doesn't even include all players since not everybody uses it.
That "dead horse" sounds very Yamiks to me, and we know what it means... My two cents, from my very narrow point of view, roughly all of my contact list logs in pretty much every day.
Fair enough, but what exactly would you like to see then? And to get that, you would need another business model with a yearly subscription, not a mere "prizetag"...Well, that doesn't mean much, really. I had stopped playing Elite on 30th June because of Odyssey and only recently came back to see what has improved since then. Over the last few weeks I have engaged with Odyssey content mostly because I have already done everything Horizons has to offer. I have done some small exobio exploration, participated in two CGs, I tried to grind mats for some gear engineering (but stopped again, because it's just so atrocious)... I already feel like I'm done again. Odyssey just doesn't bring anything fun or exciting enough to the table to keep me engaged like Horizons did (most certainly not for the prizetag FDev demanded). Last weekend a few friends and me started with Valheim again and I'm already more interested in that game than continuing with Elite
One might be tempted to say "So, just go and play Horizons then. It's still there.". Well, I already own a FC filled with all the ships and money I'll ever need. I don't care much for any BGS or PP shenanigans. When FC interiors come, I might head out for another FC based expedition later this year/early next year. But FDev treats exploration really like the unwanted step-child at the moment. I don't know if picking space flowers provides enough "new" content to keep me engaged for a few more months.
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What Elite needs is something like a clear statement of intent and a clearly defined vision for the future of the game. Initially during Kickstarter, there was this ten year period mentioned and that timeframe is almost over. Does FDev even want to continue supporting this game after those ten years? Which direction is the game supposed to take? More action oriented shooter gameplay like Odyssey indicates? Back to the roots of a more balanced approach with properly developed content for all ingame "professions"?
I'm not really interested in details like "ship interiors", "VR support" or "Thargoid FPS" here. I want to see an ambitious vision for the future of Elite, because this game still has a lot of potential and could live as long as EVE Online or World of Warcraft.
I play games since I'm a child: there is no game (NO game) that I used to play as a child that I still play today. I've played different games at every age of my life. I come back to most of them from time to time, and that's it. But it has noting to do with devs or updates or anything like that: it's just inevitable, we evolve, we change, we get tired of things, we want to try new things... Whatever Frontier does, at some point we will get tired of Elite and others who will get tired of other games will come to it. As an example, I used to play WoW or its spinoff Hearthstone: these two games have had very strong updates, new stuff, new mecanics, constant evolution, but I some point I moved to new thing. There was nothing wrong with them, I just had enough. It's just life, I mean. Myself, for the time being I'm not tired of Elite simple because I love how the game disconnects me from the real world, I don't even need to do things or "play", I just like to fly around, land, fly again, drive my SRV, etc, and dream about the Universe. But if I didn't have that approach, I know that at some point I would have got bored, it's simply the way things are.
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What a wonderful image that leaves me with before I go to sleep! Thanks!
Considering the horse, it may not be fancy and may make odd noises from time to time, even fail me sometimes, but it's kind of my horse since 5+ years and I love it just because of being so. I definitely could drop CP 2077 (see my pic, that was the inspiration for it) long before that. Luckily, I'm the proud member of a top squad (just kidding) which keeps me going through the hard times, but there are sprinkles of fresh green on the landscape here and there, lo! hope is here! Plus riddles, let's hope they get the story right. And I look forward to raising a glass to all Good People once they already fit the scenery window into my FC
O7,
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that's not what they were suggesting. The statement was in reference to what comes after odyssey.So if the stock had crashed it would have been ... good for odyssey?
So if the numbers were bad and they still wanted to continue at all, it would have likely resulted in a change in direction / process to avoid a similar fate next time.
Instead, the numbers have been still fairly decent, so likely no change will be made. And so everyone who looks at odyssey like a flop, will be in for more of the same next time.
The statement had nothing to do with changing odyssey itself, which is obviously being portrayed as unwanted or negative in one or more important ways that is desired to be changed/avoided. No troubled eye look memes needed, it's pretty straight forward.
I reckon most would have got bored with whatever was in the release, no matter how fully-featured, and would now be asking for more or playing something else.
Elite is almost unique in that people pay about the same price as a AAA title, but expect it to keep them entertained forever. Most other games have a burst at launch then vanish a few weeks later.
The fact we get a trickle of new stuff, which is enough (afaik) to keep me looking forwards and enjoying each update... well, that's a positive to me.
I play Elite but not through Steam, so presumably any figures from Steam don't include players like me.
I will continue to play ED and have no interest in going to another game, especially ones like SC.
I will continue to play ED and have no interest in going to another game, especially ones like SC.
There are plenty of things that could be done. Just some random thoughts for exploration: There could be Guardian and Thargoid structures tailored towards Space Legs gameplay. There could be Generation Ship interiors to explore, where you find have to find out what had happened to the crew (similar to the current "just scan the audio logs"). There could be derelict settlements (not the "mission based" settlements in the bubble) to explore, where you have to cut your way through obstacles or around automated defenses and scavengers. There could be an entirely new alien species, either alive and friendly (for a change) - or extinct with ruins to explore on foot.
For a very long term and ambitious concept: Take a look at EVE Online and player run empires. There are 400 billion star systems in Elite. Why not develop a game loop where squadrons can purchase colonization licenses to settle and develop a star system of their own. You need construction material (like the current "build a star port" CGs) and potentially have to ferry the mats over thousands of lightyears with FCs (or Panther Clippers?). You could build star ports and surface settlements, set up production chains from raw material extraction to the production of commodities needed to expand your settlements. You could link some sort of "research" gameplay to it by delivering tissue samples of space and surface organisms to your research settlements. You could actually work on terraforming those "terraforming candidates" in your system. You could pledge yourself to a superpower or become an anarchy pirate haven etc.
Those are of course just some rough ideas and suggestions for short and long term development.
You kinda are.
(TL;DR? As if, wall'o'text inc, you know me, this is my process
)Many players warned the community beforehand, because they started playing Elite for the main reason of flying a space ship. Not some bizarre loot and shoot "Settlement Raider" or "Domination" mode. I did too, I very well remember, made a thread on reddit where I stated that it's a really bad idea to switch development resources onto implementing a different game genre to Elite.
- Space sim players probably wont like FPS gameplay, if they did they wouldn't be playing Elite
- It's a humongous task to use the same engine for 2 game genres and a massive undertaking in terms of coding and networking
- There are already tons of top quality FPS games out there, if Odyssey doesn't offer something on par, unique or better, why bother playing it at all?
- Frontier has no previous experience with FPS games what so ever
^ These are not good signs for a successful outcome and anyone with common sense would have seen that miles away. But instead I got banned from reddit for "dooming".
Would you hire a guy that builds playgrounds to transform your car into a amphibious car-boat if he has no previous experience in designing and building boats?
I love Clarkson, Hammond and May as much as the next guy, but seriously... would you?
Frontier caved in to the fanboys that wanted on foot gameplay at 30 frames pr. sec. subpar to that of 30 year old arcade shooters.
The constant yapping about a competitors bare bone early access alpha still years away from release also contributed to this.
So we got Odyssey which was supposed to broaden the audience and genre, but instead we lost players as the product was barely functional, below industry standards and still isn't available on consoles due to investor greed.
Look, I'm not saying that Frontier devs didn't give it their best, I know they did. If you look at the details in settlements, you can clearly see that a lot of passion, time and effort went into creating it. They truly gave it everything they had and it shows. They just... didn't know... that FPS games aren't about the visuals
They are about the gun gameplay.
Frontier instead basically copied the ship framework onto a FPS and thought it would work... kinetic/thermal/absolute etc.
...it doesn't. I highly doubt anyone at Frontier plays any FPS game at least at even Gold or Diamond rank, it would have been obvious if they did.
It's been almost 3 years now since the release of a new ship. The last 2 ships (Mamba and Phantom) released on December 11th 2018.
... frikken 2018 ... but hey, we are getting new SRV's... who knows what for.
Anything you can think of has been mentioned a thousand times over on the forums and content creators with thousands of followers have been trying to make them listen before. But... they are listening now! Well kinda... we've been telling them about engineering issues since 2017 and even 2016... still, yay?
I feel as if there is a feedback bottleneck. I wouldn't be surprised if Elite has a pipeline where a group of fanboys consistently offer feedback to the community managers, which in return leads to the developers as this is how most companies in the industry work this out. The problem often stems from the feedback by the select group being incorrect or developers directly ignoring it, or both which is what happened at Blizzard and now World of Warcraft retail has lost 80% of its players. Which is bonkers...
Or developers are just adding content that they like, think is cool and right for the game in no particular order. That's what most developers do. You gotta remember that developers want the game to be as best as it can be but within their vision. We as individual gamers aren't game directors. And sometimes this leads to the development of a game alienating the majority of its player base with the developers being happy with the outcome. It's their vision, their perfect game and the few remaining fanboys will praise the game for supposedly being in its best iteration ever.
Btw, usually at this point the publisher steps in and fires the game director along with any accomplices that caused the financial disaster. May even sue them.
So Dragsham, here's the deal... don't trouble yourself with the direction or development of the game, that's not your problem. Like at all, it's not any players problem. Drop some feedback in the suggestions box and leave it at that. If Elite lives forever or shuts down tomorrow, it doesn't matter.
Enjoy the game for what it is or was, and if you cannot then simply follow those that quit and play something more fun and better
Don't ever force yourself into gameplay that you don't enjoy. If you do, you'll end up frustrated and depressed.Taking breaks from the game is also fine, I just recently returned after being gone for over a year. I quit immediately after they announced Odyssey was in the making as I had no faith in the product. Doesn't mean that 7 updates later when I came back, I didn't have a good time with it. It was short and I certainly didn't bother getting G5 Suit/weapons when I realized there is no point to it. But I still had some fun moments and I do see the potential it can have down the road. Personally I think they will abandon it once it reaches a stable console release, it's just logical from a business perspective. Product failed, quickly cash in on consoles then onto the next project.
I play Elite for the space ships... crazy, I know
I even use a joystick. A lot of players that have quit do too and they will return once they announce new ships.I feel like I might take another break soon as I have no interest in the new SRV('s), fleet carriers or any related gameplay to it. I've skipped plenty of updates and expansions in other games whenever I've felt I wasn't part of the target audience.
Absolutely am not going to bother with any engineering until that new update goes live either. But I still enjoy Elite spaceship gameplay... for now
What a surprise, because that's a bunch of prejudiced and poorly argumented gibberish if I ever read any. Maybe you stick to one genre for whatever reason, but plenty of people enjoy multiple genres in no particular order and see no reason why one would exclude the other. There are also plenty of games who successfully merge genres as well. Any limitations now exposed of the Cobra Engine would've been exposed in due time anyway, even if they solely focused on "space simulation".
And who are these mysterious fanboys who are surrepticiously directing FDev? Basically everybody who doesn't share your opinion?
I have little interest in new ships. Either...
a) they're better than something we already have (e.g. a Python with a fighter bay, a Corvette with even more hardpoints, T9 with another size 7 hold) in which case the ship they replace immediately becomes obsolete and the game becomes easier.
b) they're no better than something we already have in which case they're pointless.
The new SRV does have a role though. Two seater. The number of times I've been in a team and someone arrives in a small ship with no SRV, then has to walk and jump all the way to the settlement... now I can pick them up.
a) they're better than something we already have (e.g. a Python with a fighter bay, a Corvette with even more hardpoints, T9 with another size 7 hold) in which case the ship they replace immediately becomes obsolete and the game becomes easier.
b) they're no better than something we already have in which case they're pointless.
The new SRV does have a role though. Two seater. The number of times I've been in a team and someone arrives in a small ship with no SRV, then has to walk and jump all the way to the settlement... now I can pick them up.
The Truth unfortunately really is that the Game has Lost a Crabton of Players.
steamcharts.com
The Userbase on Steam has Halfed itself after the Odyssey Failure.
The Joke is. Its not so much Odyssey itself. After all its not like it makes the Game worse.
What Killed the Playerbase is the Shattered Trust.
Frontier has heavily Distanced itself from the Promises of the Past. And instead Delivered something that was just Horrible.
1.
Its fairly Normal that the Delivered Result will often not Check all Expectations. Especially not if it was Hyped before.
But Frontier not only cut some Features from Odyssey itself. They went ahead and Scratched alot of heavy Demanded Features for the Future of the List.
Thus heavily Dissappointing alot of Players that stayed around Waiting for stuff like Ship Interiors.
2.
Something already worse is that Odyssey not only Failed Expectations but also completely Failed the Promised Features.
Odyssey just did not Deliver what it Promised. From the Armstrong Moment that has become a laughingstock in the Community. Down to the complete lack of Planetary Variety.
Therefore heavily Dissappointing alot of Players that really looked forward to it and Paid Money for the Privilege.
3.
And then there Finally is the absurd amount of bad Game Design Decisions and Lazy Content Creation.
The FPS Gameplay is not just Laggy and the AI more matching of a Zombie Game than a Space Sim.
The Weapons look Stupid and the System of Damage creates a Situation where the Game feels more like an RPG where Enemies are Damage Sponges Requiring a whole Clip of Ammo and often even more than that.
A Handweapon costs as much as smaller Spaceships and instead of actual Gameplayloops. We got another Material Grind for Engineering with no meaning beyond Grind, Grind and more Grind.
There is alot of things the Game seriously needs.
A Better Gameplay Loop with less Grind and more Variable Gameplay. Mostly by reducing the Grind and starting to add more Variation on Planets, Missions and Stations.
A Better System for FPS Weapons which does not rely on Damage Sponges and instead creates a Situations where Weapons may have a Bonus against a certain Defense but are not so Bad against it that you need 2-3 Clips for a Kill.
And a complete Rework of the Engineering and Economy. Allowing Materials and other things to be Bought with Credits. As well Prices actually Representing something more than just a Bigger Ship thats barely stronger than the smaller one.
But most of all. What needs to happen is a Revival of the Vision of this Game.
There needs to be a Clear Commitment from Frontier towards Development.
A Roadmap that makes absolutely Clear that Development Continues and that certain Features are Planned at some Time.
These Features can be Bigger Ships like Frigates or Destroyers (Next Bigger step after Corvettes) which might be Armed with T4 and T5 Weapons including Turret Mounts. And which might have a Landing Pad for a Small or even Medium Ship.
They can be Ship Interiors and Atmospheric Planets with actual Cities and possibly with actual non Sentient Alien Life. (Plants and Animals)
Or Ownable or even Constructable Stations that can Produce and Sell Goods and hire NPC Pilots to Buy/Mine Ressources for such Goods over Preset Time
What exactly it is doesnt matter that much. So dont take that List too Seriously.
But it should be something making Clear that the Vision still Lives and that Frontier is still Willing to Develop this Game.
Because right now.
I cant exactly Blame anyone for being unsure if its still worth Investing Time into this Game.
Over the last few Years it unfortunately has been looking more and more like Frontier has no Desire to Commit to the Vision they Presented us in the Past.
Mostly just delivering a Lazy and Sloppy Product that seems to be more Focused on being Cheap and easy to Produce rather than Delivering the Promised Features.
And thus seems to mostly Aim towards Milking the Remaining Players for Money by Hype and Marketing rather than Attracting Players for a long Future of the Game.
Just my 2 Cents as someone who Quit after Odyssey.
Greetz.
Elite Dangerous - Steam Charts
An ongoing analysis of Steam's player numbers, seeing what's been played the most.
The Userbase on Steam has Halfed itself after the Odyssey Failure.
The Joke is. Its not so much Odyssey itself. After all its not like it makes the Game worse.
What Killed the Playerbase is the Shattered Trust.
Frontier has heavily Distanced itself from the Promises of the Past. And instead Delivered something that was just Horrible.
1.
Its fairly Normal that the Delivered Result will often not Check all Expectations. Especially not if it was Hyped before.
But Frontier not only cut some Features from Odyssey itself. They went ahead and Scratched alot of heavy Demanded Features for the Future of the List.
Thus heavily Dissappointing alot of Players that stayed around Waiting for stuff like Ship Interiors.
2.
Something already worse is that Odyssey not only Failed Expectations but also completely Failed the Promised Features.
Odyssey just did not Deliver what it Promised. From the Armstrong Moment that has become a laughingstock in the Community. Down to the complete lack of Planetary Variety.
Therefore heavily Dissappointing alot of Players that really looked forward to it and Paid Money for the Privilege.
3.
And then there Finally is the absurd amount of bad Game Design Decisions and Lazy Content Creation.
The FPS Gameplay is not just Laggy and the AI more matching of a Zombie Game than a Space Sim.
The Weapons look Stupid and the System of Damage creates a Situation where the Game feels more like an RPG where Enemies are Damage Sponges Requiring a whole Clip of Ammo and often even more than that.
A Handweapon costs as much as smaller Spaceships and instead of actual Gameplayloops. We got another Material Grind for Engineering with no meaning beyond Grind, Grind and more Grind.
There is alot of things the Game seriously needs.
A Better Gameplay Loop with less Grind and more Variable Gameplay. Mostly by reducing the Grind and starting to add more Variation on Planets, Missions and Stations.
A Better System for FPS Weapons which does not rely on Damage Sponges and instead creates a Situations where Weapons may have a Bonus against a certain Defense but are not so Bad against it that you need 2-3 Clips for a Kill.
And a complete Rework of the Engineering and Economy. Allowing Materials and other things to be Bought with Credits. As well Prices actually Representing something more than just a Bigger Ship thats barely stronger than the smaller one.
But most of all. What needs to happen is a Revival of the Vision of this Game.
There needs to be a Clear Commitment from Frontier towards Development.
A Roadmap that makes absolutely Clear that Development Continues and that certain Features are Planned at some Time.
These Features can be Bigger Ships like Frigates or Destroyers (Next Bigger step after Corvettes) which might be Armed with T4 and T5 Weapons including Turret Mounts. And which might have a Landing Pad for a Small or even Medium Ship.
They can be Ship Interiors and Atmospheric Planets with actual Cities and possibly with actual non Sentient Alien Life. (Plants and Animals)
Or Ownable or even Constructable Stations that can Produce and Sell Goods and hire NPC Pilots to Buy/Mine Ressources for such Goods over Preset Time
What exactly it is doesnt matter that much. So dont take that List too Seriously.
But it should be something making Clear that the Vision still Lives and that Frontier is still Willing to Develop this Game.
Because right now.
I cant exactly Blame anyone for being unsure if its still worth Investing Time into this Game.
Over the last few Years it unfortunately has been looking more and more like Frontier has no Desire to Commit to the Vision they Presented us in the Past.
Mostly just delivering a Lazy and Sloppy Product that seems to be more Focused on being Cheap and easy to Produce rather than Delivering the Promised Features.
And thus seems to mostly Aim towards Milking the Remaining Players for Money by Hype and Marketing rather than Attracting Players for a long Future of the Game.
Just my 2 Cents as someone who Quit after Odyssey.
Greetz.