I agree that design management and park management are two sides of the same coin. I absolutely want my park design to be a big influence on how successful the park is. Classics in the genre like Theme Hospital or Prison Architect were awesome about this and the idea of it in a theme park game? *Swoon*
Management Matters
- Thread starter Bo Marit
- Start date
I agree that design management and park management are two sides of the same coin. I absolutely want my park design to be a big influence on how successful the park is. Classics in the genre like Theme Hospital or Prison Architect were awesome about this and the idea of it in a theme park game? *Swoon*
Okie dokie, that is undestandable.
What I would say about training individual staff is that it feels repetitive and monotonous because it is just click and repeat. There is no decision on how to improve your employee. For instance;
The Janitor could of had;
- Speed of work
- Du diligence at work
- Waste Management
- Health & Safety Trained
Each one could be out of say 8 points and each Janitor you hire has a mix of these states (with a max of say 16 points) which give a base rate of their pay.
You could then decide how best to train these janitors to get the best result for your park. It could be as I said that say you have 6 points under waste management that the janitor can use a specific tool/item and so it is worth the cost of training them accordingly to have that available.
At the moment, you wait till they grumble and you just click the button and pay the money and it's done, you rinse and repeat accordingly at moment. This is not fun gameplay, it wasn't in RCT3 and yet they have kept the same principles here just with a new facelift to try and get us interested. It isn't working for me and that is part of my grumble.
If I Recall Correctly...
In RCT3 if you wanted to change how must salt you put on fries, you clicked on the fries stall itself, it wasn't in the main management menu itself
Same with all the other stalls, however you could check a box [x] make changes to all like this - that changed all your fry stalls in the park, etc
In RCT3 if you wanted to change how must salt you put on fries, you clicked on the fries stall itself, it wasn't in the main management menu itself
Same with all the other stalls, however you could check a box [x] make changes to all like this - that changed all your fry stalls in the park, etc
Since people keep wanting to compare PC games to Prison Architect/Civilization/Football manager lets stop and take a look at those games for a second.......
They are not even in the same galaxy as PC is right now, the graphics in these games look like they are from 5+ years ago significantly freeing up time to go in depth in other aspects of the game. In prison architect you dont have to try and build a cell and wonder if they are going to like the cell or not or worry about how much guests are willing to pay for something or making sure people know how to navigate your prison by placing information booths.
These games were built with management specifically in mind since they lack depth in other areas, PC you can play the game from multiple angels such as someone who wants to build a park that is heavy on scenery and making things look good but does not really care about the management side or someone who does not care about scenery and just wants to make a park with rides, make sure guests are happy by finding their needs/wants, clean up after them.
Weather you agree or not all that is management in some for or another.
They are not even in the same galaxy as PC is right now, the graphics in these games look like they are from 5+ years ago significantly freeing up time to go in depth in other aspects of the game. In prison architect you dont have to try and build a cell and wonder if they are going to like the cell or not or worry about how much guests are willing to pay for something or making sure people know how to navigate your prison by placing information booths.
These games were built with management specifically in mind since they lack depth in other areas, PC you can play the game from multiple angels such as someone who wants to build a park that is heavy on scenery and making things look good but does not really care about the management side or someone who does not care about scenery and just wants to make a park with rides, make sure guests are happy by finding their needs/wants, clean up after them.
Weather you agree or not all that is management in some for or another.
Bummer. I for one can't wait. As i mentioned previously, a lot of management type games have a lot of chore-like actions to complete, which drives me away. I want depth of gameplay and micromanaging, sure - Prison Architrct and Dwarf Fortress are my two favourite games, and i consider them both to be masterpieces. However, i would rather have a feature taken away because the implementation wasnt fun, rather than having a load of pain to deal with, that is either poorly implemented, or just plain isn't a fun game mechanic.
Also it's madness to criticise what the game has and doesn't, when yiu haven't even played the final build. There are a good few little features i wish the game had (some of which have been fixed in all fairness), but as a complete product I am beyond excited at what they are offering, and am bloody grateful anyone in this crazy world is still making decent theme park games. Let's try to avoid reviewing the game before it's released?
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For me personally, I don't want to micromanage things if it's not really impact the game...
Like I already said, I search for management feeling and challenges.
For example, if staff training really impact performance and guests happiness, it could be interesting. It seems to be there, but does it really impact guest happiness? Because in previous RCT, I find the game too easy. The guests can complain about toilets for months without never really be angry about that. It's true about many things. That's why difficulty levels could be great. At expert difficulty level, the guests react faster to this kind of things.
Another example in previous game, you hire someone, you train him to the latest level and pay them well and bang, he's always happy... forever. He's never bored, he's always at work, etc. It doesn't seem like it's real people working.
Kind of random events could be fun... just an example: one staff member could ask for vacations (you decide if you let him take it or not and sometimes, he could continue to be happy so you're lucky, but sometimes not)... just an example. Mechanics goes to a ride and asking: I'm not sure about safety of this part: to be sure, I can change it for 1000$, do you want me to change it? (if you change it, everything stays the same, if you decide to not change it, it's possible if you're lucky that it will not have impact, but it's possible to not be the case ;-)
I would like to feel that the decisions I take really impact the game.
Also, I would like to manage stocks for stalls as I personally think it adds to immersion of management feeling. If someone don't like it, turn on auto-stock management.
Another example, admin buildings could be interesting but only if it really impact the guests (if we have to really hide the buildings). Janitors could bring the garbage to this building, but I don't search to micromanage the number of bags he can carry in the cart. I don't think it would really add fun to micromanage at this point of details. But having to train him so he's more efficient... yeah if we really see impact in the game.
It's this kind of things I mostly hope in the game.
Like I already said, I search for management feeling and challenges.
For example, if staff training really impact performance and guests happiness, it could be interesting. It seems to be there, but does it really impact guest happiness? Because in previous RCT, I find the game too easy. The guests can complain about toilets for months without never really be angry about that. It's true about many things. That's why difficulty levels could be great. At expert difficulty level, the guests react faster to this kind of things.
Another example in previous game, you hire someone, you train him to the latest level and pay them well and bang, he's always happy... forever. He's never bored, he's always at work, etc. It doesn't seem like it's real people working.
Kind of random events could be fun... just an example: one staff member could ask for vacations (you decide if you let him take it or not and sometimes, he could continue to be happy so you're lucky, but sometimes not)... just an example. Mechanics goes to a ride and asking: I'm not sure about safety of this part: to be sure, I can change it for 1000$, do you want me to change it? (if you change it, everything stays the same, if you decide to not change it, it's possible if you're lucky that it will not have impact, but it's possible to not be the case ;-)
I would like to feel that the decisions I take really impact the game.
Also, I would like to manage stocks for stalls as I personally think it adds to immersion of management feeling. If someone don't like it, turn on auto-stock management.
Another example, admin buildings could be interesting but only if it really impact the guests (if we have to really hide the buildings). Janitors could bring the garbage to this building, but I don't search to micromanage the number of bags he can carry in the cart. I don't think it would really add fun to micromanage at this point of details. But having to train him so he's more efficient... yeah if we really see impact in the game.
It's this kind of things I mostly hope in the game.
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This all sounds good really. It is clearly something that won't be happening mind. The training here certainly appears to be the same as before with a new gloss of paint because it's not new and it certainly hasn't evolved.
The idea that staff request holiday and you have to deal with people away or denying it etc is part of management I would like to see as it affects the game. What happens if the staff members stays but is disgruntled and so makes everyone around unhappy. What if they are your best worker and they decide to hand their notice in because you denied them their holiday.
These are things managers want to detail and play to affect their game and to work through.
The idea that you have the inspection complete by an engineer and they give you a cost of what needs to be fixed and then you can decide if you want to repair it at that time or hope it lasts longer etc. I know these are kind of in so will be interesting to see how that works and this is some good management that we can see from what has been shown.
I would like to see what your credit score as a company is based on your previous debts, repayments, missed payments and if your loan options change because of this? I think the basics of the loan system is good and will hope that there is also a little more to this as we play.
Oh, I must have missed that humor, it just came across as patronizing or ignorant.
My bad, obviously
tyczj, the cells in PA actually do have a rating based on how you build them.
And Civilization 5 and particularly 6 has beautiful graphics.
It was an example. No need to be condescending about it tbh.
+1.
I've said it in this thread and others that management/simulation was the feature set I was looking forward to the most. The Devs have never given us ALL the goodies in the basket during a livestream so I didn't expect any less in yesterday's stream. Part of the fun with each build has been looking around and seeing what they didn't tell us. I'll reserve speculation on the topic until November 9th when the Beta goes live. I'm REALLY not trying to step on any toes here but it seems to me that some people are bent out of shape because the live stream didn't meet or exceed their expectations about management. We don't know what's in store for us in a week. Until then I'll keep my fingers crossed.
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yes they have a rating and if they are too nice all you have to do is build a small cell with a bed and toilet, not that difficult to do compared to building a coaster
Civilizations graphics still are not anywhere near PC's
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Have you ever played Prison Architecture, you have to worry if the cell keeps them happy otherwise they will riot, if you give them extras it keeps them in check easier but can also lead to other things. There is a lot of depth with managing your prisoners and their AI is actually pretty good. Yeah it may not be at PC level but it is still impressive and they actually use a similar system to pathing the AI from place to place like when they are hungry and need to shower etc.
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There is more to it than that though, stop talking rubbish. Yeah you can build a small cell with a bed and a toilet to get the basics needs but you can add more and it does make a difference to their stats in happiness and what they may do within the prison.
I think people are getting more bent out of shape at the reaction of some in dismissing concerns or being condescending. Looking back through the thread it was very peaceful and civil in mentioning expectations don't look like being met. A couple of posters have taken it upon themselves to be less than helpful which has stirred the pot unecassarily.
One problem is, you can't make a management game that will make everyone happy all the time.
Maybe you don't want to manage how many bags a janitor can carry. Maybe someone else does.
Maybe you don't want to manage how many twirls the princess can do. Maybe someone else does.
Maybe you want to have an exhaustion level in Gulpee's costume tied to outside temperature, relative humidity, the season, tilt of the earth, number of stairs climbed, number of stops for entertainment, body fat % of entertainer in costume, etc. etc. etc.
We're not all going to agree on what is "fun" to manage, and what is tedious. Planet Coaster, like all games, needs to make compromises. We don't know what made the cut and what didn't. For all we know, there is research tied to "things a performer can do" or "things available on hot dogs". We just don't know. Regardless, we all want different things, different levels of management, and different things to manage.
Make your suggestions. Say your piece. Frontier will evaluate it. Personally, I really like what I've seen so far. I think it strikes a good balance. Sure, we could get customizable levels of management to suit more people, but there are only so many days in a year. You either like what you get, or you make suggestions to cater to your individual tastes.
Just remember that suggestions are simply that. Anyone who tries to bully their way through with "Frontier MUST do this", or "The game is garbage because it doesn't have X" are very likely to be ignored (or worse, depending on behavior). It's a game, folks. Getting all bent out of shape because it doesn't cater to how you want to do things is ridiculous.
Maybe you don't want to manage how many bags a janitor can carry. Maybe someone else does.
Maybe you don't want to manage how many twirls the princess can do. Maybe someone else does.
Maybe you want to have an exhaustion level in Gulpee's costume tied to outside temperature, relative humidity, the season, tilt of the earth, number of stairs climbed, number of stops for entertainment, body fat % of entertainer in costume, etc. etc. etc.
We're not all going to agree on what is "fun" to manage, and what is tedious. Planet Coaster, like all games, needs to make compromises. We don't know what made the cut and what didn't. For all we know, there is research tied to "things a performer can do" or "things available on hot dogs". We just don't know. Regardless, we all want different things, different levels of management, and different things to manage.
Make your suggestions. Say your piece. Frontier will evaluate it. Personally, I really like what I've seen so far. I think it strikes a good balance. Sure, we could get customizable levels of management to suit more people, but there are only so many days in a year. You either like what you get, or you make suggestions to cater to your individual tastes.
Just remember that suggestions are simply that. Anyone who tries to bully their way through with "Frontier MUST do this", or "The game is garbage because it doesn't have X" are very likely to be ignored (or worse, depending on behavior). It's a game, folks. Getting all bent out of shape because it doesn't cater to how you want to do things is ridiculous.
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Graphics =/= Gameplay
Artist =/= Programmer
What i'm trying to say is, great graphics and great gameplay can co-exist in the same game.
This is why I talk of "shortcuts". I'm all for adding choice and customisation to the management aspects, as long as it can safely be ignored by those people who aren't interested by it.