Many Guests are Thirsty... AGAIN!

This drives me absolutely bonkers in my parks. Its so frustrating to keep getting the pop up message or seeing it in notifications. I have talked about it before in various threads.. And saw others discuss it as well. It would be really nice if we could get a devs answer on this and how to fix it ourselves.. What causes it.. And if it can be patched.

Ok so basically every park I make.. Challenge mode or sandbox i keep getting the message every few minutes that "many guests are thirsty". There are a ton of drink shops around the park placed in strategic spots to try to limit it but it doesnt matter I keep getting the message.and really just want them to shut up if they are thirsty.. Go buy a drink! Most recently this is getting under my skin because I started a brand new park. I have like two coasters a couple of flat rides. In the front of the park they arent to far apart. Basically left and right sides of entrance so far is all i have done. Theres a drink shop on each side of park as well located fairly close to the rides. Theres only about 1500 guests and the message ia just constant and annoying.

Ok. So placing more drink shops isnt going to help in my experience because most likely they wont even use them and the vendors keep quitting because no one visits.. I have heard some speculation thats its because of que lines people in line get thirsty.. Well technically yeah this would happen.. But why do i need to to keep getting a notification about it in a game. Its not something that can be fixed by placing a shop or something so its not like a management issue. It seems to me its just an annoyance and one we have complained about for awhile with no fix.. And no answer. All we can do is speculate. I have heard some people say they dont have this issue.. And others who agree with me.. So if its something i. And othwrs.. Are doing wrong.. What is it? This topic may get lots of replies but it seems that once again a lot of it is going to be speculation. Could a dev please look into this and give an answer to why this happens? Could we please get a fix. Its been sugested previoulsy that if its the guests in que lines that needs should be "off" while in line because its really not something we can anything about while they are in line. Once out of line.. They can go grab a drink or whatever they need at the time.. I barely ever hear many guests are hunfgry.. Why is thirsty so bugged.
 
Just have to wait for the anniversary update, big changes will occur with vendors now leaving shops. I wonder how this will play out, like what if a shop has a big line of guests waiting and the employee decides its time for their break? Will staff wait to leave the shop until somebody else is there to fill the position? Will a tired employee cause guests to get unhappy?

What about ride operators and ticket booth employees? This means were going to need to hire twice as many employees otherwise vandalism will increase... This is going to bring even more notifications, so maybe the devs have also reworked the AI and notification systems
 
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I have the thirsty issues as well. My guests are never happy no matter how mush I soak them in drinks. [mouth shut]
 
its absolutely the guests in queues. If you click the notify and jump to the guest complaining, you will see they are in a queue
 
This is absaloutly an issue. 100%. It’s been around for over a year, with zero patching done or acknowledgement by the PC team. I live with it now but even o seeing so many guests thirsty is a PITA.

This could be resolved by the addition of vending machines into que spaces or turning off guest needs whilst queuing. Not fond of the second idea. I too would love to hear from the Devs on this long standing issue.
 
As long as the queue does not take too long, the thirst of guests should not get fully depleted. This must be either a problem of guests becoming too thirsty too quickly, or guests deciding to enter a queue just before they will start to complain about their needs (or a combination of both). I think guests should take into account to fulfill their needs before entering a long queue if there are any shops nearby, although I am not sure if they do this already.

Another 'fix' would be to nerf the needs development while queueing, eg slow down rising of the thirst. Not sure how fond I am about that though. I think managing the needs of queuing guests can stil make for an interesting game mechanic, but the current situation is bad since you can't fix the problem without closing the ride and emptying the queue. Maybe a 'mobile vendor' can help solve this issue by offering some small snacks and/or drinks by walking through the queue line, like is often done in busy areas. (like this or this)

Otherwise, a dirty fix for the notification spam would just be to not count guests that are queueing towards the number of thirsty guest count. Receiving notifications about stuff you can't control but also don't convey useful information or are downright misleading are simply useless and annoying. That same problem shows with the security notifications IMO.
 
Well even though you won't count guest in queues they will be systematically pooped out from that ride, still as thirsty as when they were inside the queue. [uhh]

How about make a more innovative management of this? In addition to the suggestion of vending machine in the queues. How about adding shadow and spray fans along the queue would degree the thirst as a thing? [big grin]

Or, they should just slow down the thirst meter drops during queuing. [sulk]
 
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I think if we get the possibility to place Shops within the cues the "Drink"-Problem could be solved. That's not unrealistic. Often in parks in longer cues there are placed shops which offer Drinks. But that could only work if we also get the possibilty to place trash cans within the cue and the street cleaner get Access to the cues. I think that is a lot of work for the devs.
 

WingardiumLevicoaster

Volunteer Moderator
I think if we get the possibility to place Shops within the cues the "Drink"-Problem could be solved. That's not unrealistic. Often in parks in longer cues there are placed shops which offer Drinks. But that could only work if we also get the possibilty to place trash cans within the cue and the street cleaner get Access to the cues. I think that is a lot of work for the devs.
I have seen this in parks across the UK and in mainland Europe. It is not uncommon.
 
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In real life, guest solve this problem by getting some drinks out of their "inventory" and consume it while standing in line. That drink was either purchased from a in-park shop or brought from home. Now there's an idea. [yesnod]
 
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Mid Queue vending machine and shop?

Some shops selling bottles which can be put in their pocket and have a sip for a thirst boost at any time.

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I think if we get the possibility to place Shops within the cues the "Drink"-Problem could be solved. That's not unrealistic. Often in parks in longer cues there are placed shops which offer Drinks. But that could only work if we also get the possibilty to place trash cans within the cue and the street cleaner get Access to the cues. I think that is a lot of work for the devs.
I'd be fine with them just throwing the litter near the exit if it made things easier. It would be a challenge getting the janitors down the queue lines).
 
This is absaloutly an issue. 100%. It’s been around for over a year, with zero patching done or acknowledgement by the PC team. I live with it now but even o seeing so many guests thirsty is a PITA.

This could be resolved by the addition of vending machines into que spaces or turning off guest needs whilst queuing. Not fond of the second idea. I too would love to hear from the Devs on this long standing issue.
At it's core this is a design flaw, not the only one. It's not like this was a simple bugfix, to really solve this they'd have to re-think the concept of guest needs, queues and queue times...
 
I'm not that fond of pop up screens every second myself, but as far as i can remember you can switch notifications on and off, i did point this out after the security agent update in some topic about it...

some tips..., depending on the type of guests they ask/need another type of drink/food, as example teenagers more often will ask/ buy /need soda and energy drinks... can't say for sure for adults and family...
Anyway, try to even the drink/food shops out, and be smart on their location... a coaster for only teens and adults won't need family food/drinks (milkshake, icecream,juice,...) near it... or a teacup ride won't need soda and energy...
Most of it is written in the discription of the shops, or the comments of the guests...


To be honest, i never had a big issue with drinks or food before...

I do look forward to all the extra management stuff comming in the anniversary update :D
 
Yeah, it seems to be complicated to solve, as many others AI things like guests not entering queue because some entered at the same time or staff leaving for no obvious reason even if they're pay well, workload is ok and training is at max or too much vandalism even if they're a lot of cameras and security guards.

They're adjustments to make and I'll looking forward to be solve before seeing any new gameplay feature.
 
OK.. well lot's of speculation.. lots of conversation.. and yet nothing from the devs yet... still.. on this issue. My question to everyone is this. How come we keep seeing many guests are thirsty.. but never many guests are hungry.. obviously the "thirst meter" seems to run faster than hunger.


I don't know if I care for the idea of in line shops.. that is just more to worry about when designing ques that I personally don't want to mess with. i jsut want them to stop complaining when there is nothing that can be done about it. Some of you say you see these types of things in your parks.. I have never seen a shop in the que line for any coaster i've ever been on. Not saying it doesn't exist.. just saying I've never seen it, so it's not realistic to me. Does any park do this in the US? The best fix would be that the peeps get their drinks before getting in line.. or when they get off the ride within a certain time limit. you don't want to get that opinion as soon as they get off because its going to tell you they are still thirsty. but maybe start measuring that guests needs within so much time after they exit the que.

And someone said just turn the notification off.. OK.. well then when i click the notifications tab.. the issue is still staring me right in the face right there.. it just didn't pop up and tell me.. its still a problem that needs to be fixed.. not ignored by turning it off.
 
And someone said just turn the notification off.. OK.. well then when i click the notifications tab.. the issue is still staring me right in the face right there.. it just didn't pop up and tell me.. its still a problem that needs to be fixed.. not ignored by turning it off.
Decision making in general is a problem. Looks like AI completely ignores travel distance, so to the guest brain walking to the other side of the park for Pipshot Water 304 seems like a good idea. AI is treating every destination the same, only that coasters/water rides take priority. And peeps don't consider filling up need meters when it's convenient. They'll wait until the last minute before they go looking for a toilet, something to drink etc. Going on big rides consistently overrides satisfaction of other needs so they'll queue even if they could and should have filled up other needs first.
 
In-queue stalls or vending machines are definitely a thing in Europe, at least Europa-Park and Efteling feature them, and I'm sure some British parks do too. But implementing that doesn't fix the issue in my opinion, the thing is that peeps in tycoon games always fully consume their drinks and foods right after purchasing them, and they start looking for a place to purchase it when they really, really need it. Real park guests plan a bit ahead, they often buy food and drinks in packages that can be re-sealed and they will carry that around for later usage; Or they will visit the toilet way beforehand, knowing they'll be unable to do so while standing in the next queue.

It's a shame Frontier just implemented the defacto behaviour of guests in pretty much every simulation, instead of reconsidering how a real theme park guest actually behaves.
 
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Maybe this is an AI-Problem somewhat related to the size of the park. I read somewhere that the game is designed to lighten the CPU's load by scaling down it's "power thirst". For examply by increasing the time between AI-Updates, if the park is about to exceed the limit's of the given hardware. If the guests start to get "more stupid" if the park grows, this may cause problems.

Once i followed a couple of guests during the park and checked their behaviour. Their initial target was abandoned most of the time after comming close to another. The group walked into a Shop-Hup while searching for something to drink. The first shop, they came close to, was a Chief Beef, and so they changed their mind and head there. After buying food, they decided to ride a ride but came close to the toilet, and went there. Than they decided to getting something to drink, came close to a merchandise shop, and bought something. After leaving, they finally head for the nearest coaster and left the shop-hub without drinking something, even if this was the initial reason for entering it.

However, on small parks with clear pathing and just a few guests, i never encountered such a strange behaviour. And was also never anoyed by the constant popping up of the "Thirsty" message.
 
Decision making in general is a problem. Looks like AI completely ignores travel distance, so to the guest brain walking to the other side of the park for Pipshot Water 304 seems like a good idea. AI is treating every destination the same, only that coasters/water rides take priority. And peeps don't consider filling up need meters when it's convenient. They'll wait until the last minute before they go looking for a toilet, something to drink etc. Going on big rides consistently overrides satisfaction of other needs so they'll queue even if they could and should have filled up other needs first.
In a nutshell Seeker says it all AI needs to work better the guest brain needs to change priority to drink and food prior to getting on coasters and alike. Another base game issue which (a year later) alas has not been fixed :(
 

WingardiumLevicoaster

Volunteer Moderator
In-queue stalls or vending machines are definitely a thing in Europe, at least Europa-Park and Efteling feature them, and I'm sure some British parks do too. But implementing that doesn't fix the issue in my opinion, the thing is that peeps in tycoon games always fully consume their drinks and foods right after purchasing them, and they start looking for a place to purchase it when they really, really need it. Real park guests plan a bit ahead, they often buy food and drinks in packages that can be re-sealed and they will carry that around for later usage; Or they will visit the toilet way beforehand, knowing they'll be unable to do so while standing in the next queue.

It's a shame Frontier just implemented the defacto behaviour of guests in pretty much every simulation, instead of reconsidering how a real theme park guest actually behaves.
yep, Alton Towers and Thorpe Park for sure. Plus I did see a stall selling ice cream on the Jurassic Park ride at Universal Hollywood.
 
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