General Materials amount at High Grade Emissions in the upcoming update - it broke everything!

[Darkfyre99]

In fact every commander has some amount of time, and this time depends of they enery, real life etc. It is obvious. If you need less time for collecting mats, you have more time for other activites. It is simple. If someone enjoying missions, HGEs, anything, they still can do it. More mats doesn't change it. My last example. I spent one day for collecting mats and engineering, and second day for fighting thargoids. After this update I could spend half day for engineering and more time with fightng thargoids. Thargoids are funnier than collecing mats (but still i like collecting mats), so this reabalnce is really good for me. Of course it is totally my case, so I undersnad that somoeone else could say they doesn't need it.

This is my problem with this game’s development in a nutshell: I’m having my most fun when what I’m doing requires making interesting decisions with meaningful consequences. I’ve also been playing this game since the original Alpha. For just about every “game loop” I’ve enjoyed playing, there’s always been at least two options to engage in it:

• Skill Based - requires understanding the game, personal skills, sacrificing some ship specialization, and can be done alongside other game loops. Personally, I find this way to be a lot of fun, and it’s always kept me competitive with players with a lot more raw hours in the game.
• “This One Weird Trick” - requires little understanding of the game, is easy to do, a specialized ship, and can’t be done alongside other game loops. And those who use this method inevitably complain about the grind.

There are several ways of fixing a complaint about the “grind”. Frontier could address the underling cause of the complaint, which is inevitably a mismatch between effort and returns. They could also introduce additional options for players to engage with a game loop.

Frontier inevitably chooses to drastically boost the results of “This One Weird Trick” option, and they do so to such a degree that it inevitably obviates the skill based option. Which makes the game less interesting to me.

I want to play a struggling Commander, who needs to be sharp to get ahead while fighting a private was against the Evil Galactic Federation. Instead, I’m playing a wealthy dilettante, and that is not a state she should be in.

Caesar
Let me have men about me that are fat,
Sleek-headed men and such as sleep a-nights.
Yond Cassius has a lean and hungry look,
He thinks too much; such men are dangerous.
Mark Antony
Fear him not, Caesar, he's not dangerous,
He is a noble Roman, and well given.
Julius Caesar
Would he were fatter! But I fear him not.
Yet if my name were liable to fear,
I do not know the man I should avoid
So soon as that spare Cassius. He reads much,
He is a great observer, and he looks
Quite through the deeds of men. He loves no plays,
As thou dost, Antony; he hears no music;
Seldom he smiles, and smiles in such a sort
As if he mock'd himself, and scorn'd his spirit
That could be mov'd to smile at any thing.
Such men as he be never at heart's ease
Whiles they behold a greater than themselves,
And therefore are they very dangerous.
I rather tell thee what is to be fear'd
Than what I fear; for always I am Caesar.

 

[Darkfyre99]

People that play golf are weird.

I resemble that remark!

 

[metatheurgist]

Not strictly opposed, but then you need a solution for the fact that Guardian materials are required for ammo synthesis of Guardian weapons as well as the unlocks, while those sites are then going to become a limited resource and run out eventually. (Nobody will fly to the distant deep space ones just to do AX when there is no station available for rearm/repair.)

… I wouldn’t mind getting those materials added to the list for material traders, mind you. At least the manufactured ones.

Ammo synth is such a terrible idea though. This is the problem, bad ideas on top of bad ideas.

 

[Doctor Dread]

• 1 - Eliminate ALL re-logging methods. Each HGE, crash sites, Guardian sites, etc.. allows a cmdr to collect only once.

Why?

If you don't like it, then don't do it.
If I like it as a way to save time and do it, what it has to do with you ??!!

Play the game the way you like it, and don't ask ED to eliminate all different ways for other people. You're not so important.

 

[Greasetrap42]

Why?

If you don't like it, then don't do it.
If I like it as a way to save time and do it, what it has to do with you ??!!

Play the game the way you like it, and don't ask ED to eliminate all different ways for other people. You're not so important.

IMO it is self evident why a game designed with re-logging as a feature for repeatedly respawning game items for character advancement is a terrible idea.

If you don't understand why... that's fine.

 

[Doctor Dread]

...and ready for insults if one questions your perceived importance over all other players.

It fits.

 

[Shadowsnog]

game designed with re-logging as a feature

i think game design and people bypassing that design are fairly different things.
you can always pack your things after farming through a site and go visit another. ive done so more than once. but sure is nice to have a shortcut for when i dont have the time.

 

[Greasetrap42]

...and ready for insults if one questions your perceived importance over all other players.

Staying on topic, do you really not understand why a game that allows player to respawn stuff is a terrible design?

Would you like:

• When playing Chess you get an extra chess piece every time you yell "extra!"
• When playing Poker, every time your chips run low you just grab a bunch more?
• When playing Monoploy you can grab some extra houses and hotels to put on your properties.
• When playing Scrabble, if you don't have good letters you can just grab some more?
• When playing WoW, when the dungeon is complete to get more boss drops you just relog before exiting the dungeon? Until your inventory is full?
• When playing DnD you can re-roll the dice until you get the result you want?

Great for self gratification, but makes a lousy game.

 

[Dillon Fallon]

We can debate specifics of how we would have an alternative to relogging and certainly we will disagree, but there's certainly no denying that any game where a viable (or worse, the most efficient) route of doing something involves turning the game off is doing something wrong somewhere.

 

[Darkfyre99]

There is something subjective about it. And it is simple maths. When I buy a ship and I realise that I don't have enough mats to upgrade its shield boosters or the shield itself (for example), I'll find the nearest relevant HGE and relog until I have enough or until it times out. I can then continue with my goal. If I say "nah, I'll just have different fun, and if I manage to come across relevant HGEs in the next month, I can have my new ship engineered, and if the context I want to use it for is still available (like a vulnerable titan) I can have some of the remaining fun I initially wanted".

Weirdly enough, I’ve yet to have had that problem. I’ve always had more than enough materials to G5 a ship by the time I have enough credits to buy it. And right now, I’m sitting on enough credits and materials for my inevitable Imperial Cutter. Which I’d probably have right now if I put as much effort working for the Empire as I do messing with the Federation.

 

[Doctor Dread]

Staying on topic, do you really not understand why a game that allows player to respawn stuff is a terrible design?

Would you like:

• When playing Chess you get an extra chess piece every time you yell "extra!"
• When playing Poker, every time your chips run low you just grab a bunch more?
• When playing Monoploy you can grab some extra houses and hotels to put on your properties.
• When playing Scrabble, if you don't have good letters you can just grab some more?
• When playing WoW, when the dungeon is complete to get more boss drops you just relog before exiting the dungeon? Until your inventory is full?
• When playing DnD you can re-roll the dice until you get the result you want?

Great for self gratification, but makes a lousy game.

They are not the same games, nor the same situations. All your examples are not applicable here.

Using the respawning ability trick here was players' solution to excruciating grind forced on us. You may find it dishonest, exploit, whatever... but it's using the basic trait of human intelligence, noticing the patterns and finding the ways to simplify/ease it a bit.

One can claim it low, can choose to avoid using it, but one has no right asking it to be denied for others.

 

[Martind Forlon]

well ... Buur Pit had few minutes ago short news with "numbers" about incoming changes ... example of one of them is below

Spoiler

 

[Greasetrap42]

Using the respawning ability trick here was players' solution to excruciating grind forced on us. You may find it dishonest, exploit, whatever... but it's using the basic trait of human intelligence, noticing the patterns and finding the ways to simplify/ease it a bit.

One can claim it low, can choose to avoid using it, but one has no right asking for others to be denied it.

I have every right on these forums to ask for it to be replaced with actual meaningful gameplay. Which is the post you are criticising.

From your responses I gather you rather keep reloging for items than have the game improved with proper gameplay.


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Edit:

They are not the same games, nor the same situations. All your examples are not applicable here.

All of my examples involve a player spawning stuff into a game whenever they like. So they can have more items. So they can advance their character. It might be fine for a solo game, but in not in a game that involves other players. Hence: terrible game design. ---> I am not criticizing the players. I am criticizing the game. <---

 

[Dillon Fallon]

well ... Buur Pit had few minutes ago short news with "numbers" about incoming changes ... example of one of them is below

Spoiler

View attachment 398592

That's interesting. Although it certainly doesn't reduce the effort to zero, it should make it feel a lot less like you're repeating gameplay loops just for material gathering.

 

[Michael Ryan]

I very much agree what they need to is make actual game improvements. Hopefully that is what we will see next week. Not just tweek numbers.

• 2 - Allow tear-down of engineered items. You lose the module credit value, but you regain the eng mats. Or a percentage. Both Horizons & Odessey items. Cmdr only gets back eng mats they put into the item (nothing that was pre-engineered). Yes, this means Frontier would need to program items to track the mats a cmdr added to an item. Good thing Frontier employs programmers. They should have thought about this originally.
• (...)

Edit: - 9 - Balance the difficulty of a activities with the reward. The time & effort of visiting an HGE site and collecting G5 mats should absolutely not be better than missions. Rewards should be relative to the risk, skill, or effort of the activity.

2. I like it, but I don't want it, because of it is illogical for me
9. I have one little problem with that. When I play with friends we have different experience about what activity needs better skill.

You play it wrong. I got each of my ships when I had ALL ready (except 1st) for upgrades. I.e. 1st you prepare yourself by collecting things during couple days, then you buy the ship.
I had ruined fun of preparation already because all was maxed, now it will be ruined even more, because can be restored in 20 mins.

Last time I checked Frontier said: "There is no one correct way to play ED, you can play own way"

Weirdly enough, I’ve yet to have had that problem. I’ve always had more than enough materials to G5 a ship by the time I have enough credits to buy it. And right now, I’m sitting on enough credits and materials for my inevitable Imperial Cutter. Which I’d probably have right now if I put as much effort working for the Empire as I do messing with the Federation.

Oh no! Empire and Federation made pece during thargoid war!

 

[SergMx]

Not strictly opposed, but then you need a solution for the fact that Guardian materials are required for ammo synthesis of Guardian weapons as well as the unlocks, while those sites are then going to become a limited resource and run out eventually. (Nobody will fly to the distant deep space ones just to do AX when there is no station available for rearm/repair.)

… I wouldn’t mind getting those materials added to the list for material traders, mind you. At least the manufactured ones.

Why do we have extra fuel tanks for fuel but not the same containers for ammunition resources ?

 

[SergMx]

You are being premature and assuming that because the base storage of your suit will be increased your modification will be removed when it is much more likely that it will as now be an addition to the base value. If the backpack storage mod is a percentage based boost you will gain even more storage.

It was the translator that malfunctioned.
I wrote - since the size is now doubled, for me the mod - backpack expansion is not relevant. How do I remove it ?
I put it, as the previous figures did not suit me. The new ones suit me, but I can not remove this mod.

 

[IstvaanDCIV]

Ammo synth is such a terrible idea though. This is the problem, bad ideas on top of bad ideas.

Why is the idea of ammo synthesis a bad one, as opposed to its implementation?

 

[yianniv]

Weirdly enough, I’ve yet to have had that problem. I’ve always had more than enough materials to G5 a ship by the time I have enough credits to buy it. And right now, I’m sitting on enough credits and materials for my inevitable Imperial Cutter. Which I’d probably have right now if I put as much effort working for the Empire as I do messing with the Federation.

I try to keep my material stocks as full as possible, but when I started taking part in the thargoid war, the various different ship roles I engineered depleted some of them. So, here we are.

 

[SergMx]

Why is the idea of ammo synthesis a bad one, as opposed to its implementation?

For example, the same guardian weapons. There is no exchange of guardian components, and you have to fly far away and farm guardian settlements.
That's why people like to fight off a port more than just a conflict zone in space where there is no resupply.