Work In Progress Matryoshka doll (nesting dolls)

I am working on a giant set of 5 matryoshka dolls. Giant as in tall props, largest size is 4 meter and smallest 1,2 meter high.

I am drawing the texture in a vector software, CorelDraw because that's what I am comfortable with, I have been using that since mid 90s. ;)

I want every size to be somewhat authentic to real life matryoshskas so I have to simplify the artwork for every iteration. I am still in progress on that.

I exported a mockup of the largest size to TMT to see how it would be in game. It is actually my first proper TMT item and I am new to blender as well, as you might know, I begun with Blender when TMT came out. :)



Remember, this was the mockup to see how things work (btw the two in background are non-flexicolor versions). I am in constant learning process about every part of the making. I am going to adjust some of the fields for flexicolor, I have new ideas.

File size is going to be a killer, though. I TRIED to make smaller graphic but it looked TOO pixelated. But the smaller size of the doll can have smaller size of texture, I will try to weigh what's best for every iteration.

It contains 1 normal map, 1 base color texture, 4 flexicolor textures (scarf, hair, blouse/outlining, skirt) and 1 material.

Here's a work in progess of my texturing the iterations. :)
It is going to be 5 sizes. 3 largest shown.

iterations.png

Hooray, uploader worked today!

Ok, just wanted to share. Thanks for reading. :)
 
They are gorgeous, really great design work! I love them!

If I may - as Jonti at Geekism is fond of pointing out, no one is going to be viewing the models super close once they're part of a park. Please do compromise the image quality a little to get a workable file size. I'm an artist too, I know how hard it is to see it pixelated and not so pretty right up close! But it's worth it for peoples' parks to run smoothly. Since it's a large, focal point item, I don't think a 10mb file size would be unreasonable, but I've seen things in the workshop up near 20mb or even more. As much as I think those workshop items look beautiful, I tend to skip subscribing because I don't want to compromise the play-ability of my parks. That's just my take on it, though. :)
 
Really nice.
But i have a Question to your UI. How do you do that that you does not have the Text at the Bottom Navigation Items?
 
Going very well. Original idea too. [happy]


As much as I think those workshop items look beautiful, I tend to skip subscribing because I don't want to compromise the play-ability of my parks. That's just my take on it, though. :)
I do that too. As a matter of fact I think I haven't downloaded anything above 3 mb because I don't understand quite yet what size is considered normal for what items.
I've read a very interesting post on Steam about the regular blueprints being so much lower in size because they are text files; but that still doesn't answer that question.
 
I really like the pink frame around your pictures, apart frioom that I like that doll too very much. Both together is sooo ... girlie. Can't help myself, I love it. [yesnod]
 
Thank you all for the sweet words! :)

Regarding the file sizes.
The regular (blueprint) workshop items are just text files because the graphic (the assets) are already on our hard disks. Planet coaster take 8.25 GB (gigabytes) disk space. Much of that is textures. And it is those textures the "tiny sized" blue prints are referencing to. I do not know how big texture size the indiviudal objects are because it is all packed together into large files (probably to lessen risk of hacking) but I suspect it is rather large files.

Maybe Frontier dev can reply and give in their 10 pennies worth about this subject?

I can also take screenshots of the smaller file size version I did, and you can make a comparison and say what you think.

I also understand that it is not so fun to download big hefty files, and in some cases the concern is valid, for example when someone use 1024 or 2048 pixel texture file for something tiny, or if it is for solid color.

I think I am going to make a wiki entiry LATER on about "reasonable" file sizes for object types to have something to refer to. Primarily for TMT workshop creators, but also for you people who want to subcribe.

So, one small object of solid color should be down at max 500 kb at most, while a tall object (that is, ingame tall) must be large file because of pixelated. And then multiplied by every layer of image file, for normal map (to give 3d effect shadows on a low poly item) for material file (to make object shiny, matte, metallic, glassy, emissive, translucent, etc etc, may need more than one!) and one for every flexicolor color. So it easily get quite large at the end. flexicolor is popular, but it is also eating space.
People dislike the usual super smooth finish, for example on something that should be rough and matte - image of material needs to be added. Low poly wanted for lower fps? then normal map image is a must.

so for a good object playwise, it might be heavy on the disk space.

Or you can stick to have pixelated non-flexicolor, super shiny object with high poly eating fps.

Ok, now that was a quick text on this matter.

I understand otherwise, it is not easy thing this one, the games are growing and growing. I mean, look at the little more than 8 gigabyte space needed for the game. :) but that's the draw of wanting "omg beautiful AAA game".

haha. Sorry. [heart]

SarrahW: True! some pixelating is needed, but I am going to adhere to Frontier's suggestion: "The ideal texel rate for Planet Coaster is 256x256 pixels per square metre" Matryoshska at largest size has 1024 px texture. That largest size is 4 meter tall. So it is about correct for that size. (I think, trying to wrap my mind around the 3d-ness of it.. :D)
I will use smaller texture size for the smaller versions. Of course. :)

As for playability, fps wise high polygon is worse than extra texture for UV map "simulating" high poly item. At least that's my impression.


EDIT: With the text wall above said, I am going to make a couple of versions of the largest size and see if I can try to shrink it down. I will also show the scale of it in relation to other objects. Here it is by itself so it is not so much to compare with. But maybe if comparing with other objects it can be easier to figure if it is good or not. It is after all still work in progress. :)
 
Really nice.
But i have a Question to your UI. How do you do that that you does not have the Text at the Bottom Navigation Items?
Which ui, Planet coaster or Blender? If it is Planet Coaster, that's how it looks like after the last update (TMT-update) to my game. I did not touch the settings. Maybe it is the screen size/resolution? I have a rather square monitor (1280x1024 pixels 5:4 ratio) so maybe it is a thing for that to save on screen space?
 

heatherg23

Volunteer Moderator
Going very well. Original idea too. [happy]
I've read a very interesting post on Steam about the regular blueprints being so much lower in size because they are text files; but that still doesn't answer that question.
one thing I did when I saw the file size of a TMT item (5mb) I saved an empty park, with and without the item, to steam and the file size difference was .007. It’s not much at all which was a relief.
 
Another thing to consider about the sizes. If you are making object that is foliage, rocks, building pieces or other piece that might be used many times over in one single park then the smaller and lower poly as possible is good. I think it is more ok to go larger if you want to make object that is centerpiece. Statue, large object that is "singular" by its usage and such. Things that get noticed. By then it is good to stick to Frontier's suggestion of texel rate. But for example bushes and grass, and maybe wood planks, as low as possible is better.

Again me rambling away. Sorry. [heart]
 
Has anyone tested different texture sizes on the same object and which effect this have on the object in game and the object size in MB?
 
Another thing to consider about the sizes. If you are making object that is foliage, rocks, building pieces or other piece that might be used many times over in one single park then the smaller and lower poly as possible is good. I think it is more ok to go larger if you want to make object that is centerpiece. Statue, large object that is "singular" by its usage and such. Things that get noticed. By then it is good to stick to Frontier's suggestion of texel rate. But for example bushes and grass, and maybe wood planks, as low as possible is better.
Exactly, I would not expect a large, detailed centerpiece item to be half a meg! A piece like this would make sense at closer to 10mb. Kind of like Castaway's lovely dinosaurs - they're relatively large on file size too, but they are big items and not expected to be repeated dozens or hundreds of times in a park.

The main thing I wanted to express was to judge it from about 20 meters away rather than up close. That pixelation disappears very quickly!

My hope is when they are able to release the sample files, we can use those to more accurately judge the file sizes Frontier themselves are making, and get a good baseline. We're mostly guessing, aside from the 256 per meter texel rate you mentioned.
 
Yes! I am also not entirely sure how to calculate texel rate either, ha ha. Easiest is of course 1m plane (with same on both sides) 256 px. :[haha] But an object uv unwrapped with lots of "empty areas" due to intricateness of shape and reduction of visible seams - whoops, not as easy. hmm. Interesting indeed.

Another way to figure might be to put a few of ingame objects with similar detailed (painted) surface beside the TMT object and look at it. Of course not a fair thing because the devs are professionals with knowing how to do the most effective way and (many of us) are amateurs at various levels.

It would be nice to see some example objects from them! I know risk of it will be copied and all that, so maybe something that is not very branded, something purposed for this.
 
Helena's wall of text [happy]
Interesting read, thanks for explaining!! :)

This is also why others were asking for sets/sharing of textures to be made possible right (if you have 5 objects with the same texture, the texture file size is in game not once, but 5 times right - or not because it shares the same name and thus overwrites ?)
Hope they manage to implement that somewhere down the line.
 
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Yes, it is hard to share texture across objects as we can't link the textures between them, which is unfortunate. It is the nature of the very simple way of TMT.

As for my dolls though I do them unique every size, so I can't link even if I could. Maybe the material!


And stuk71 thank you!

Right now I am working on the 2 smallest sizes. :)
 
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