Mines, Mines, Mines... Can Frontier explain this to me?

Echo Wake

Echo Wake
So something does not seem quite right here...

You cannot detect a silent running ship on your radar even though they're generating heat.

I would expect a lot people to say, "well that's because the heat vanes are closed on the ship which keeps all the heat internally."

Okay, yes, I understand this concept but there is also a lot of glass canopies on these ships. And to my knowledge, glass is not a very good insulator. So would the the cockpit be a beacon of heat sensing radars shouting to everyone else that, Hey the cockpit/bridge is right --> here <--

Okay... to get back on topic here. Mines. What on earth are on these mines that they generate more heat than a silent running ship?

I use mines primarily as a defensive measure with engineered effects... But they are damn useless when their location shows up as a white blip on everyone's radar, as if to say "Hey!! Don't run into me, I'm a mine that could potentially ruin your day."

The same could be said about cargo. But cargo could be discarded with a transmitter to give it's position away. But you would not do this to a mine... Why would you broadcast the location of your own mines? Perhaps give mines a friend or foe functionality?

What does everyone else think? Am I crazy?
 

EValve

E
I vote mines to only come with a wing-enabled transponder :)

And for the rest to only be detected in very close proximity.

If you follow the target dead ahead it should already be too late for you to escape them by visual detection.
They should oblige you to be preemptive not be a visual distraction.
 
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Drelthar

Drelthar
I agree with you, however, I think it's just gameplay reasons, Mines would probably be VERY powerful if you had to eyeball them to dodge them!

It'd also require some serious AI tweaking to make them simulate eyeballing mines....
 

Bunkerkind Anni

Bunkerkind Anni
the mines have thrusters to stabilise their position in space, or else we could use them as bombs at longer range, and they would just drift in all directions after deploying them.

this heats them up good enough to be visible on the scanner :D
 

Echo Wake

Echo Wake
Bunkerkind Anni said:
the mines have thrusters to stabilise their position in space, or else we could use them as bombs at longer range, and they would just drift in all directions after deploying them.

this heats them up good enough to be visible on the scanner :D
Click to expand...

Okay but a ships thrusters generate heat do they not? But we can not see them in silent running. My bet is those engines run hotter than positioning thrusters on mines. They could use some form of gas (not a combustible form of thrust) for positioning and once in place they wouldn't need to move.
 

Cervantes01

Cervantes01
Mines used to be a really good weapon choice for traders like me but thanks to FD's nerf bat they are now almost useless.

The question you need to ask yourself is, is your enemy hot enough for a weapon's lock, ships that run silent can still be hit with un targeted gimbals or fixed weapons. Mines might be hot because they are armed and primed to blow.
 

Cmdr Tel

Cmdr Tel
I thought that was the purpose of mines, you don't know you are in a minefield until something goes boom! Otherwise what is the point if you can simply fly around them. Perhaps the ADS could pick them up or even the basic but it would take time after all it takes several seconds to even pick up a star you are about to fly into.
 

[Diplomacy] Carnegie

[Diplomacy] Carnegie
Cervantes01 said:
Mines used to be a really good weapon choice for traders like me but thanks to FD's nerf bat they are now almost useless.
Click to expand...

To be fair, they were a bit silly at one point - I destroyed a Deadly FdL with my T6 simply by flying in a straight line just out of laser range and spamming mines.

I think we should get cluster mines - lots of little minelets that don't do much damage individually but spread out over a large area. That'll deter pursuit.
 

EValve

E
DrewCarnegie said:
To be fair, they were a bit silly at one point - I destroyed a Deadly FdL with my T6 simply by flying in a straight line just out of laser range and spamming mines.

I think we should get cluster mines - lots of little minelets that don't do much damage individually but spread out over a large area. That'll deter pursuit.
Click to expand...

I remember suggesting that already somewhere old post. Didn't catch on.

I'm wondering... how one could conclude from your first statement that nerfing the mines would be a good idea?
Isn't it obvious maybe just maybe there's something wrong with AI?
 

Crimson Kaim

Crimson Kaim
Mines should work like missiles (slow ones) when being close enough. Say they start tracking hostile ships within 500 meters and explode when being close to 200 meters. Simple.
 

[Diplomacy] Carnegie

[Diplomacy] Carnegie
EValve said:
I remember suggesting that already somewhere old post. Didn't catch on.

I'm wondering... how one could conclude from your first statement that nerfing the mines would be a good idea?
Isn't it obvious maybe just maybe there's something wrong with AI?
Click to expand...

Well yes, it was the AI that was the problem - and the AI behavior was (as far as I know) the only thing that was changed.
I'm not aware of any change to the mine damage.
 

DNA-Decay

DNA-Decay
I love mines, but I agree they need a tweak.
What I have been trying to do lately is dump ten cargo and a handful of mines mixed in. So they're part of the radar clutter.
But it hasn't proved useful yet.

Maybe if chaff had an additional function of creating ghosts in the Scanner.
Fire chaff and more "targets" appear in the Scanner but as you resolve them they disappear.

Too few hits. Too easy to avoid, but they feel like they should be a good thing.
 
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Tarman

Tarman
I'm going off topic with OP's off-topic by saying that the canopies are probably not made of standard glass as we know it. The Remlok protects us from emergency space vacuum and it's stored in a collar on your neck and deploys over, turning into a transparent or translucent shell, so at least one kind of future magic glass going on there.
 

Bunkerkind Anni

Bunkerkind Anni
if i had a wish regarding the mines -
i would love to have an option for a large variant,
and a different behaviour of mines within planets gravity:

1. a different HUD that shows trajectory
2. deactivated stabilizer thruster on the mines to have them behave like bombs

regarding realism of mines:
i hate the the T9's forward small slots eject mines upwards and as such make the mines explode against the hull. they can only be used in reverse of lateral thrust situations :(

Tarman said:
I'm going off topic with OP's off-topic by saying that the canopies are probably not made of standard glass as we know it. The Remlok protects us from emergency space vacuum and it's stored in a collar on your neck and deploys over, turning into a transparent or translucent shell, so at least one kind of future magic glass going on there.
Click to expand...

the whole pilot seat of pilot federation ships is an escape pod with a micro-hyperjump device, able to warp you through the whole galaxy.
i have noticed that occupied escape pods look a bit similar to the pilot seat.

i wonder if there are imperial escape pods out there.
 
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Echo Wake

Echo Wake
I like the idea of some sort of diversionary mine field made up of a lot of smaller mines. It would be like a frag canon but with mines instead.

This way you could almost be guaranteed hits with your mines but at a reduced damage compared to standard mines that we have now. Also remove them from sensors, except for the ship that luanched it and wing mates.

This could be a new mine type. Slightly larger shells, and because of the larger shell that drops say... 8 baby mines, you'd have reduced ammo capacity. A medium mine launcher can hold 72 mines. Make these new mines with only 48 on a medium luancher.

Perhaps make large mine launchers for people that like flying pythons... Just a thought.
 
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