Missions should NOT fail upon death - feedback requested

As I'm finding this to be the most frustrating and problematic issue in all of Odyssey Alpha 1 I decided to share my thoughts in video form.

tl;dr - the time required between death/failing a mission and retrying it, minimum 10 minutes and in many cases far more, is unacceptable and ruins the flow of gameplay. There should be significant reputation, influence and credit penalties but my time should not be one of them. There may be some mission types that would fail, perhaps assassination mission, but even for those shouldn't I be able to retry the mission without a 10-20 minute or more delay? Can you name any other shooter, especially stealth shooters with such a huge delay between failing and retrying a mission.

Do you agree? Am I missing something where this makes sense?

Source: https://youtu.be/RHf4HWN6TiY


~Exigeous
 
Two times I made the mistake to take 10+ missions only to die to a fire the first time and heavy npc fire in the second, losing them all, both finished and to be attempted. I dunno, it just doesn't make sense to me to fail a mission that is not even on the same planet as the one I died at. I fully agree on this one.
 
Some fail-on-death bits make sense - if you get killed on a reactivate mission while you have the power regulator in inventory, if you get killed on a transport mission after picking up the item, if you get killed on a covert mission while in the relevant base someone's going to catch on. But as a blanket thing, that's way harsher than the existing missions are. Having to be rescued from a completely different base on a completely different mission while having no mission-critical items on hand, shouldn't cause a mission failure.

(Though, I guess it's one way to discourage - or at least add risk to - stacking too many missions together. If we died in Odyssey at a similar rate to the rate in Horizons, of course, it'd be much less of a big deal: perhaps once we have access to the combat suit, and maybe some upgrades, and a bit more practice, it'll not be an issue anyway)
 
The 'fail all missions on death' seems like a simple oversight and wrong - fail the missions because you fail them, not because you die on a random other mission.

Not sure what all the text in the OP is about, sounds more like the Apex rant - which I have less of a problem with (especially once we get the distance in the mission descriptions).
 
A very scant few missions taken from the mission board in your own ship fail upon death (mission-specific cargo, for example: unrecoverable on ship loss, and most notably passenger missions). This should extend to on-foot as well. There's no reason for everything to unilaterally fail upon "critical injury". You should simply be allowed to try again just like most every other mission in the live game. Massacre missions don't fail on destruction. Source and return missions don't either. Same with courier/data delivery missions.

Not sure I agree with the proposed penalties of credits/rep/inf. That also doesn't happen in game already unless you outright fail. Now if a target on foot were to escape somehow, then MAYBE I can see an argument, but then that also is counter to the live build. Assassination in ships, you can follow wakes if they run or just jump out and back in and the signal respawns.

Having everything fail on death is highly inconsistent logic. I don't believe there is any excuse at all that wouldn't contradict some other rule that's already in Beyond.
 
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I don't mind failing my current mission. Once you've blown your cover on an assassination mission you're not going to get a second chance.

But losing completed mission, or missions you've not even attempted seems a little odd and is not in keeping with the current mission system in EDH.
 
I don't mind failing my current mission. Once you've blown your cover on an assassination mission you're not going to get a second chance.

But losing completed mission, or missions you've not even attempted seems a little odd and is not in keeping with the current mission system in EDH.
I was just going to say in ED when you lose your ship you lose your transactions and missions correct?

Or has that changed? I haven't lost a ship in a long time (knocking on wood!)
 
I was just going to say in ED when you lose your ship you lose your transactions and missions correct?

Or has that changed? I haven't lost a ship in a long time (knocking on wood!)

You lose your bounties and exploration data - even if your exploration ship is perfectly safe in a station - but not your missions. Obviously, if you're carrying mission-specific cargos, that's gone.
 
Yep. Completing missions without dying was often a bonus criteria for ship based missions (and probably should be here, too). Losing recovered goods should probably fail, as mentioned earlier in the thread, and possibly some covert missions, too but otherwise I think the time loss and any accrued bounties is punishment enough.

I do think, like many things in the alpha, we have a force multiplication of issues: initially a lack of clue of what we're doing, missing keybinds, lack of info on equipment and behaviour, bugged missions, APEX + huge trinary system and no in-game feature of filtering for distance and very harsh death penalties. Multiply that little lot and you get a lot of frustration. I suspect most of that will not make the final cut though.
 
Some fail-on-death bits make sense - if you get killed on a reactivate mission while you have the power regulator in inventory, if you get killed on a transport mission after picking up the item, if you get killed on a covert mission while in the relevant base someone's going to catch on. But as a blanket thing, that's way harsher than the existing missions are. Having to be rescued from a completely different base on a completely different mission while having no mission-critical items on hand, shouldn't cause a mission failure.

(Though, I guess it's one way to discourage - or at least add risk to - stacking too many missions together. If we died in Odyssey at a similar rate to the rate in Horizons, of course, it'd be much less of a big deal: perhaps once we have access to the combat suit, and maybe some upgrades, and a bit more practice, it'll not be an issue anyway)
This, with the additional caveat it should be possible to obtain power regulators elsewhere, maybe even on site.
The 'fail all missions on death' seems like a simple oversight and wrong - fail the missions because you fail them, not because you die on a random other mission.
And this.
 
I am not that concerned about current failing status, but more on bugs, like the power regulator not being added to your inventory, not having distances in the mission board and more.

Anyhow, I wouldn't mind either if some change to this mechanics is applied.

I wonder if in the end we'll ever do missions once we have the complete game, as it's already clear you can do money without having a mission, plus materials for engineering and upgrades. At least, I do missions only to grow reputation/ranks on a faction/superpower.

I think the best for FDEV would be to wait at least until phase 3 to make this kind of changes.
 
I agree, and with teeth above, too.

But are you suggesting here that the player should be able to retry the mission, i.e. respawn outside of the settlement, and just lose money/rep/inf?
Yes, absolutely 100% that's exactly what I'm suggesting - do you know of any other games, especially first person shooters, where you have to wait 10-20 minutes or more between failing a mission and retrying it? I'm very open to other suggestions of penalty for failing but what I am NOT okay with is the penalty being my time. Sorry, but my time is WAY too valuable to me to sit and wait 10-20 minutes or much more before I can retry a mission, IF I can even get the same mission again.
 
In the lore, we never really die, do we? In Odyssey we get "critically injured" so yeah, I don't think any missions not started yet should be voided. And for the missions where it makes sense, we should respawn in a medical ship in orbit. Just slap a Ambulance sign on a adder, put it in orbit and make a retry mission / new destination gui.
 
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