Modern HOTAS Options?.
- Thread starter Saltyseadog
- Start date
For the money, if you can still get it at a similar price(£40),I'd say buy another, there's nothing wrong with what you have.
But if you want more buttons, you'll have to pay more (£100 - £200).
Frankly I'm not convinced build quality of alternatives is that much better. If you go for a £300+ option, is it worth it, will it last 30 years?
I mean 5 years out of a £40 joystick is pretty good.
My point was that you made a remark "This is the only throttle I could find with full 6 direction thruster axis ..." (more than once) - but it wasn't correct, that's all. (BTW You don't need fore and aft thrusters at the same time as you need your main throttle - so 6 axes plus throttle isn't really valid.)
Logitech 3D Pro.
With a Saitek throttle quad.
Even after I bought a Warthog.
Swapped the stick out straight away - 'Hog stick.is very good
But it was only this year that I finally put the throttle quad in storage, and set up the Warthog throttle.
"But muh axes"
- you know the way I roll, I still had a spare axis on the 'quad.
With a Saitek throttle quad.
Even after I bought a Warthog.
Swapped the stick out straight away - 'Hog stick.is very good
But it was only this year that I finally put the throttle quad in storage, and set up the Warthog throttle.
"But muh axes"
- you know the way I roll, I still had a spare axis on the 'quad.
Well, you might not personally want separate axis for throttle and fore/aft thrusters, but I did; and the controller I picked literally has those while others don't.
Should we break out the dictionary and define "correct"? Or would you kindly stop trolling me while I contribute to this controller advise thread and what I like and why I like it?
I started with Logitech Extreme 3D Pro - good and reliable stick, tho very basic. Wide base, fairly heavy so quick maneuvers were stable - no issues from moving your stick on the desk. Drawbacks - small movement range of throttle (mounted on base) so it feels bit weird to control big ship with it (I have G13 and I bound 0-25-50-75-100% throttle there). Also have issues with input drift - stick sits in neutral but game receives slight input so your ship rolls or turns slightly. At least mine did. Software is very limited.
After over 2 years of use I switched to Logitech X52 Pro.
Although I aimed for X56 Rhino finally I decided to get X52. X56 had bad rep over low assembly quality, ghosting or not working buttons, throttle issues. Logitech made some mumbo jumbo and released v2 - gray one. Ambiguous reviews of neww version, pretty much unavailable on my market + high price and I took X52 Pro instead.
Massive improvement and upgrade - unlike X56 mine requires just one USB slot, no external power supply needed. Dedicated software (tho some functions are not present and need to be set via Windows USB controller - namely button color change and LED intensity) so you can tweak it to your liking. Lots of buttons and switches, dual stage main trigger, smooth movement. And separate throttle.
What I miss is stick thumb analog stick (X56 has it) and I could use more switches on throttle handle. But it's just my nitpicking - overall I can wholeheathedly suggest X52.
After over 2 years of use I switched to Logitech X52 Pro.
Although I aimed for X56 Rhino finally I decided to get X52. X56 had bad rep over low assembly quality, ghosting or not working buttons, throttle issues. Logitech made some mumbo jumbo and released v2 - gray one. Ambiguous reviews of neww version, pretty much unavailable on my market + high price and I took X52 Pro instead.
Massive improvement and upgrade - unlike X56 mine requires just one USB slot, no external power supply needed. Dedicated software (tho some functions are not present and need to be set via Windows USB controller - namely button color change and LED intensity) so you can tweak it to your liking. Lots of buttons and switches, dual stage main trigger, smooth movement. And separate throttle.
What I miss is stick thumb analog stick (X56 has it) and I could use more switches on throttle handle. But it's just my nitpicking - overall I can wholeheathedly suggest X52.
.... deleted my content ..... life's too short to waste pixels
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When I tried to move from an XBOX Controller to the HOTAS-X, I found it just didn't have enough buttons.
Moving to the T16000M HOTAS, while I would like to have more buttons on the Stick itself (I don't use the ones on the base,) the Throttle does have enough buttons and "hats" that a single "shift" key worked great.
Still, it took quite some time to map everything to my liking, and I miss the popups you get with default context when holding a "shift" key down (like a, b, x, or y)
Moving to the T16000M HOTAS, while I would like to have more buttons on the Stick itself (I don't use the ones on the base,) the Throttle does have enough buttons and "hats" that a single "shift" key worked great.
Still, it took quite some time to map everything to my liking, and I miss the popups you get with default context when holding a "shift" key down (like a, b, x, or y)
I used a Hotas X for over 2 years but it stopped working after I moved house, so I bought the 16000 stick and throttle. It's good, but.......
It's got a great range of options and I had buttons to spare, but it just didn't work for me. The throttle was ok, but the buttons on the top of the stick are set up in a way that I kept hitting one by accident (usually the centre one). It may be because my hands are fairly small. In the end I gave up and bought another Hotas X.
16000 is a good stick, just not for me.
I just joined the Warthog club and I love it
Logitech/Saitek X56 has 12/13 analogue axis
- Main Stick - 5 analogue axis
- Stick X
- Stick Y
- Stick Twist
- Thumb Stick X
- Thumb Stick Y
- Throttle - 7/8 analogue axis
- Throttle - which has a split L/R throttle mode
- Thumb Stick X
- Thumb Stick Y
- Rotary 1 - with a centre point, thumb position on top of RH Thottle
- Rotary 2 - with a centre point, thumb position below top part of RH Thottle
- Rotary 3 - on base, no centre point
- Rotary 4 - on base, no centre point
The Thrustmaster 16000m HOTAS set has one advantage though - it is about half the price of the X56.
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X-56 is the coolest looking Hotas. Spent a long time considering it before settling for the T16000M
Customer reviews on the other hand... https://www.amazon.com/Logitech-Pro-Flight-Rhino-HOTAS/dp/B01LX398IE#customerReviews
Given that "peace of mind" is the most important quality of any mechanical product I purchase, I decided for the T16000M for the plug&play and "it just works" factor. Like motorcycles, I may drool over Aprilia beautiful looking motorcycles but in the end I always buy a trusty Suzuki.
Customer reviews on the other hand... https://www.amazon.com/Logitech-Pro-Flight-Rhino-HOTAS/dp/B01LX398IE#customerReviews
Given that "peace of mind" is the most important quality of any mechanical product I purchase, I decided for the T16000M for the plug&play and "it just works" factor. Like motorcycles, I may drool over Aprilia beautiful looking motorcycles but in the end I always buy a trusty Suzuki.
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If you go Saitek then X52 Pro is really the best one I have had one for years as a warranty replacement for an X55 which lasted 9 months,
Not sure if they are still available though (X52 Pro)
Not sure if they are still available though (X52 Pro)
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The only innovators nowadays are Virpil. They come out with new designs frequently. That said, CH products and Thrustmaster Warthog are tried and tested, but by no means modern.
See what I wrote above. The old Saitek-built X-55/56 were crap. I had them, I replaced them several times on warranty. They just kept failing. A while ago, when my Saitek-built X-56 failed yet once again, I got the new Logitech-built X-56 as replacement.
Most obvious difference: the markings are not yellow or blue any more but grey. Less obvious: since I have the Logitech version, I haven't had any technical problems any more. Logitech claims to have solved a number of technical problems. Perhaps I am just lucky. Perhaps I now jinx it and my HOTAS will break next week. But at least according to my experience with the grey X-56, it is the first version of this HOTAS which has good quality and doesn't fail quickly.
I know the Amazon reviews of the X-55/56. I have written one of the many "it's a piece of garbage and fails all of the time" reviews. Maybe I should take the time and update that one. I am way more happy with the grey X-56 after all. (Somebody really curious could also go back through my post history. I've added my point of view on the X-56 in several threads in the past, where I always warned about its shoddy quality. I wasn't holding back there, either. I just really have a much better experience with the Logitech model than I ever had with any of the previous models built by Saitek. )
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The X-56 and X-52 were Saitek products originally until Logitech bought out Saitek from Mad Catz in 2016 - Saitek have the worst reputation with me (both during and before the Mad Catz ownership era) but Logitech has a much better rep overall. The version of the X56 I have has grey detailing except for the Throttle markings.
The grey version would appear to be Logitech's "fix" for the original Saitek design. Given askavir's observation, I would ensure you get Logitech's version of the X56 if you opt for it.
Saitek devices are now Logitech in effect, just make sure if you get one of the Logitech/Saitek devices that you get the newer Logitech version as opposed to a refurbished (or legacy) Saitek device.
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A really long time ago (over 20 years) Saitek products actually were rather good. I had a Saitek Cyborg force feedback at some time. It was an amazing product for that time. (I was able to play with a single digit deadzone. Where other joysticks wanted one of 50 or higher right out of the box. ) Of course, not having contactless sensors (no joystick had them at that time) it wore down. But still, for it's time it was great.
I also had a Saitek mouse and it also did well, for several years. So really, in a distant past Saitek actually produced quality goods.
That's why I got the X-55 without further considerations, only to then find out that since MadCatz was involved, quality was not on their todo list any more.
[The button layout and exterior design of the X-55/56 is great for ED. All in all I find it better than most other HOTAS options out there, Warthog included. Only the low quality internals were a big issue. And they actually could have avoided a lot of bad rep by just investing like 15 cent more per HOTAS into slightly better quality wires. ]
Absolutely! If you open the box and it still has blue detailing, scream and run! (And send it back. You were cheated, you ordered the Logitech version, don't accept the old Saitek one. )
I definitely find it handy to have a forward/reverse thruster override in addition to the main throttle. It's not critical, but it does help. This is what my toe breaks do.
I feel like I'm in the twilight zone right now.
Everybody keeps saying things specifically to me about axis counts like I misunderstood something... So maybe I wasn't clear; I'll try again.
I didn't say Thrustmaster has the most axis on the throttle. Many controllers have more axis than the TM 16000m system. I also didn't say that every player needs to have all 6 thrusters plus a throttle axis without using landing mode overrides. I said it's the only throttle with enough CENTERING axis to do all directions of thrust plus throttle axis because it's the only one with a stick, AND another self centering axis (the paddle) and it still has a throttle. I said I, personally, prefer that and I was happy to not have to spend more since I think this controller is better for me than the more expensive ones.
A center detent on a rotary axis doesn't mean it works like a centering axis, so it doesn't work right to control a thruster.
If you don't care about using fore/aft thrust at the same time as the throttle axis, then maybe an x56 or one of the cousins will be for you. Most of those have more buttons and rotary axis and are very fancy. They're also all more expensive than a 16000m system. It's all up to you!
I hope this makes it clear what I'm saying. TM TWCS has the paddle as well as the stick and throttle. For me this is a killer feature because I like having all thrusters and throttle at the same time.