PvP Need help - Fer-de-Lance build

Labladorite

L
I need a PvP Fer-de-Lance weapon build for assassinating single targets.

My current loadout is the following:
4xC2 Torpedo launchers with reverberating cascade
1xC4 Plasma accelerator

This build is very effective for PvE assassination missions, as almost every ship loses its shields when hit by eight reverb cascade torpedoes.
However, I've tried this build in PvP against some shield tanks, thinking it would be effective, but I noticed that my build is very easily countered since almost all commanders have ships that can outrun and shoot the torpedoes.
Which is why I need a build for my de-Lance.

I have already tried 3x Plasma accelerators along with 2x Rail guns, but that build fries my ship so badly.
Running more than 1 Plasma accelerator at a time makes the heat unbearable because due to my play style, I constantly boost which prevents the ship from cooling down.
I also tried full Multi-cannon builds, but they don't seem to be very effective against shield tanks, especially when they have strong shield cell banks.

TL;DR
gib fdl build, kthx
 
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Feros-da-Grundig

Feros-da-Grundig
Labladorite said:
I have already tried 3x Plasma accelerators along with 2x Rail guns, but that build fries my ship so badly.
Running more than 1 Plasma accelerator at a time makes the heat unbearable because due to my play style, I constantly boost which prevents the ship from cooling down.
Click to expand...


ryan_m's guide, go to "Meta FDL" section: https://docs.google.com/document/d/108hNUfUZJuAgCNQrjmpX14j7qv4k3TloETnwhzIMwLk

You're overheating with PAs due to not using efficient engineering mod, running an OC powerplant, or both.


Labladorite said:
p.s. I use Drive Distributors instead of Drag Drives in order to prevent heat issues.
Click to expand...

Didn't look at your build before above suggestion. Turned out to be the case. You have power to spare. Armoring your PP rather than OC is a much better solution. Swap long range for efficient on the PA and put some more of them on. Swap drive distro for drag. Etc. Just follow the guide above.
 
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Labladorite

L
FerosFerioGTR said:
Swap long range for efficient on the PA and put some more of them on.
Click to expand...

Are efficient plasma accelerators really that useful in PvP combat? I feel like the shot speed is so low that it's near impossible to hit people above ~2km range.
They can just simply maneuver out of the way of the plasma shot...
 

Moriarte

Moriarte
I have already tried 3x Plasma accelerators along with 2x Rail guns, but that build fries my ship so badly.
Click to expand...

That's one of the most effective PvPvE builds out there. Efficient plasma + feedback rails.

Mod them.

EDIT: you can go full wacko with 4 plasma and a hammer/5 PA, but that's trickier to execute.
 
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Feros-da-Grundig

Feros-da-Grundig
Labladorite said:
Are efficient plasma accelerators really that useful in PvP combat? I feel like the shot speed is so low that it's near impossible to hit people above ~2km range.
They can just simply maneuver out of the way of the plasma shot...
Click to expand...

Efficient PAs are generally fired closer than 2km. It is by far the most common engr mod for PvP PAs.

Note even with LR/focused, a good pilot will evade at >= 2km range.

You may be underestimating the PvP learning curve. One doesn't go straight from PvE assassin missions to killing skilled CMDRs in well shielded ships just by changing loadout.

In any case, as noted, the information and build in that guide is very effective. You should try it.
 

Labladorite

L
Alright. I will try different weapon loadouts and see what works best for me.

The guide you sent me helped me realize that the problem with my de-Lance wasn't in the weapons, but rather the core modules.
As I am typing this, I am fixing my core modules. I'm sure I will get something great out of this.

Here is the build I'm currently working on:
https://coriolis.edcd.io/outfit/fer...AvY6hv0pAwAA.EweloBhAOEoUwIYHMA28QgIwV3fEQA==

Let me know what you think about it.
Thanks in advance.
 

Feros-da-Grundig

Feros-da-Grundig
Labladorite said:
Alright. I will try different weapon loadouts and see what works best for me.

The guide you sent me helped me realize that the problem with my de-Lance wasn't in the weapons, but rather the core modules.
As I am typing this, I am fixing my core modules. I'm sure I will get something great out of this.

Here is the build I'm currently working on:
https://coriolis.edcd.io/outfit/fer...AvY6hv0pAwAA.EweloBhAOEoUwIYHMA28QgIwV3fEQA==

Let me know what you think about it.
Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...

Your thermal resists are extremely vulnerable. Change the engineering on your bulkheads and two shield boosters to improve thermal resistance.

Overcharged over efficient for the MC.

Are you carrying the single gimbal MC for small ships, or occasional PvE or for corrrosive to help the lasers or...? Are you having two separate firegroups or are you going to put it on the same fire button as the lasers or hammer?

In any case if you are going for PvP I suggest to just do exactly what the guide says. In particular, if you are having trouble landing efficient PAs in your PvP encounters so far, you will certainly have more difficulty maintaining the ToT (time on target) required for fixed pulse lasers to be effective against those same CMDRs.
 
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Labladorite

L
-I hate Bi-Weave shields. I absolutely loathe them. I'm sticking to my Prismatic shields.
-I don't worry too much about having weak thermal resistance since most commanders use plasma accelerators and rail guns anyway. Those things ignore resistance.
-I'm carrying the MC for the corrosive effect for fighting hull-tanks in short distance. I made it efficient so it wouldn't take up too much distributor draw.
-I am good at aiming lasers. Trust me.
 

Bob Lighthouse

Banned
Bob Lighthouse
Labladorite said:
I need a PvP Fer-de-Lance weapon build for assassinating single targets.

My current loadout is the following:
4xC2 Torpedo launchers with reverberating cascade
1xC4 Plasma accelerator

This build is very effective for PvE assassination missions, as almost every ship loses its shields when hit by eight reverb cascade torpedoes.
However, I've tried this build in PvP against some shield tanks, thinking it would be effective, but I noticed that my build is very easily countered since almost all commanders have ships that can outrun and shoot the torpedoes.
Which is why I need a build for my de-Lance.

I have already tried 3x Plasma accelerators along with 2x Rail guns, but that build fries my ship so badly.
Running more than 1 Plasma accelerator at a time makes the heat unbearable because due to my play style, I constantly boost which prevents the ship from cooling down.
I also tried full Multi-cannon builds, but they don't seem to be very effective against shield tanks, especially when they have strong shield cell banks.

TL;DR
gib fdl build, kthx
Click to expand...



Regarding the heat, sounds like you are running an OC powerplant.
Permaboost + PAs/rails is standard practice for the FDL.
 

Bob Lighthouse

Banned
Bob Lighthouse
Labladorite said:
-I hate Bi-Weave shields. I absolutely loathe them. I'm sticking to my Prismatic shields.
-I don't worry too much about having weak thermal resistance since most commanders use plasma accelerators and rail guns anyway. Those things ignore resistance.
-I'm carrying the MC for the corrosive effect for fighting hull-tanks in short distance. I made it efficient so it wouldn't take up too much distributor draw.
-I am good at aiming lasers. Trust me.
Click to expand...

Not exactly.

Regarding rail gun damage, I believe this is still accurate:
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...ts-No-2-Rail-gun-thermic-kinetic-damage-split

PAs do 60% absolute, with the rest split thermal/kinetic iirc.

I thought you wanted help?
 

Feros-da-Grundig

Feros-da-Grundig
Labladorite said:
-I hate Bi-Weave shields. I absolutely loathe them. I'm sticking to my Prismatic shields.
-I don't worry too much about having weak thermal resistance since most commanders use plasma accelerators and rail guns anyway. Those things ignore resistance.
-I'm carrying the MC for the corrosive effect for fighting hull-tanks in short distance. I made it efficient so it wouldn't take up too much distributor draw.
-I am good at aiming lasers. Trust me.
Click to expand...

Rails don't ignore resistance. They are thermal/kinetic weighted towards the former. So your thermal resists matter for 2/3rds of their damage, as well as for 15% of PA damage (only 60% is absolute).

As far as trust you, well you are asking for advice and we are giving it. It's as simple as that. Given how much useful advice has been given so far, perhaps consider trusting us.

I feel prismatics are a fine alternative and am actually considering switching to them myself for some of my biweave builds. I was more referring to weapons and should have been more specific.
 
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Treptower Park

T
Labladorite said:
-I don't worry too much about having weak thermal resistance since most commanders use plasma accelerators and rail guns anyway. Those things ignore resistance.
Click to expand...

In the context of this thread that can only be an assumption. And a false one at that. People already commented on PAs and Rails and their relevance regarding resistances. Also, you will encounter pretty much every thinkable combination of weaponry. The builds you have in mind are sporty top-tier endgame PvP ships. There´s a huge variety of players of all skill levels and preferences tho. You will be up against gimballed-beamlazor warriors. Do you really want to have your hardcore monster PvP FDL melted by a PvE loadout?

Reminds me of an episode at the last CG: Guy gets cocky in his mighty Cutter. We start a fight and I dont even think of using my 2 medium OC MCs. Hit the fire button accidentally and see guys Prismatics start to melt. 2 mins later they´re gone and guy limps out with 23 hull because Phasing Bursts. I message him commenting on his kinetic resistances but he´s obviously enganging n PvP for ages and just "testing builds". Yeah right.. If I just had pressed a tiny little bit more this would have been a 50 millionen credits test. Dont be that guy. Dont ignore resistances!
 
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Bob Lighthouse

Banned
Bob Lighthouse
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