New C&P. An Explanation. It's not that hard I promise.

[Hevak]

Edited it for readability and to clean up the post a bit.

I really don't get all the confusion around this, except for some bugs, it really is pretty easy though people, just a bit more involved. This is by no means a complete and thorough explanation. Just what is needed to deal with the new system.

The below aspects apply to CRIMES ONLY, Powerplay is handled separately under its own bounty system and IS NOT considered criminal acts IF BOTH PLAYERS/SHIPS ARE PLEDGED TO DIFFERENT FACTIONS.

If any thing here is wrong, and you are SURE on the correct way it is, please let me know and I will update this post. Some of this is only found through doing it in game right now, and I haven't done it all. This is a new system, the information here is based on Dev posts, in game experiences, and posts/info from other players and threads.

It is a "to the best of our knowledge" deal right now. hopefully the unkown, unsure bits will get clarified, verified, or debunked as we go. I will do my best to note what is unsure, or needs more verification, and also note how things *should* work based on devs posts/confirmed mechanics.

I don't intend this to be a comprehensive c&p explanation. My intent is to make a clear guide on understanding the basics of how it will affect players now, and how to deal with the new systems. The cost of bounties and some of the under the hood changes are a bit more convoluted and ambiguous and not worth discussing in this explanation.

If you feel I should add something let me know I will update the op.

 

[Hevak]

New C&P. An Explanation.

What is the same?

Spoiler

First off, except for the new weapons discharge threshold, I believe every single crime is the same as it was pre 3.0. If it was a bounty before it still is, if it was a fine it still is. And YES this includes planetary scan missions, which will say this mission could be considered illegal at the location (or something like that) in the mission description. You have a choice to make on these when you get there. Private beacons will incur a bounty, and trespass will start as a fine and increase to a bounty if you stay in any red exclusion zones.

Ramming people, weapons discharge in the nfz, friendly fire on npcs (except as noted above), scanning private beacons, trespass and every other crime in the game carries the same penalty it always did before 3.0. YOU JUST CANT IGNORE THE PENALTY FOREVER NOW!

If you are getting fines and bounties now, you would have had them in pre 3.0 too.

The weapons discharge fine threshold may either be bugged, or way too low. It seems few are getting fines, and just receiving bounties for any friendly fire. It may need some tweaking.

What's New?

Spoiler

Well there is quite a bit of new stuff, but its still pretty similar to the pre 3.0 system, just a few tweaks. It is mostly about HOW YOU PAY OFF YOUR CRIMES.

There are a few new ways penalties are applied, and some things that could be considered NEW penalties. The main change is that you can NO LONGER IGNORE ANY PENALTIES, they all have lasting consequences.

Also the JURISDICTION of the space you are in matters a lot more now.

If you get a fine it will never go away, it will also never mature into a bounty and If you get a bounty it will never go away, until you pay them off, or get killed. (more explained below.)

JURSIDICTION? HUH, WHA?

Spoiler

One bit of change is that now the JURISDICTION of the space you are in matters. This means that your WANTED status COULD CHANGE EVEN WITHIN ONE SYSTEM.

The Jurisdiction you are in is essentially which minor faction controls the station and space surrounding it, or else whichever faction controls the system when no stations are near. The minor faction whose jurisdiction you are in could possibly change several times in systems that have many stations and many minor factions in it. You should keep aware of this if you have any bounties on you.

When you travel in Supercruise you will see on the left side of your hud your location (i.E. Shipping Lane, Planet A1, Deep space etc.), and which faction controls it, if you are in occupied space, ( I.E. Sirius Corp. Eurybia Blue Mafia etc.) This means Sirius Corp, or Blue Mafia controls the Jurisdiction you are currently in. Crimes commited in this part of space are fines/bounties with this faction, and you need to pay your FINES here. Bounties are paid at any IF

This is what determines your wanted status. If you fly to another station controlled by the Blue Mafia, then you may now be considered clean if you have no bounties or fines for them While having bounties in the Same system from Sirius corp. No matter what at all times if you are WANTED you should see WANTED on your hud. Just be aware this status can change while flying through a single star system.

This important to remember for attacking ships as well. This jurisdication can change with in a system between you interdicting a WANTED ship and dropping out of SC. If you drop out in another Jurisdiction they may be clean now even though they were wanted before. So BE CAREFUL and pay attention if you are bounty hunting. Always best to scan after dropping out, EVEN IF YOU ARE THE ONE WHO GOT INTERDICTED.

What Happens when I get a Bounty/Fine?

Spoiler

Hot Ships & Modules.

Well in the basic sense the same thing happens as before. You are either considered wanted, or simply have fines. The same mechanics as pre 3.0 are involved. If you are WANTED in a jurisdiction ( WANTED is in red on your hud) and you get scanned then you will be attacked as you were before. Having fines only should not result in anyone opening fire upon you LEGALLY. Everything below applies to Bounties and fines, except where noted. Also Murder crimes carry some additional penalties including those listed here that will be covered in the murder section.

All fines and bounties are attached to the ship you had when you committed the crimes making it "hot" You MUST be in this ship to pay off fines/bounties incurred while in it. You can sell "hot" ships, but you will do so at an extra loss compared to normal.

You can remove modules from these ships but they are considered "hot" as well and has been reported they must be "cleaned" (paid off) before you can place then on any* ship. You can sell them but at a loss of value.

You can not transfer a hot ship to a jurisdiction it is considered "hot" or "wanted" in by the controlling minor faction. Transfer costs will be increased for any other port you wish to transfer a "hot ship" to.

*(Some reports are you can't even place the "hot module" back in the "hot" ship you removed it from. This May be a bug not sure. There may possibly be a bug with paying off, or the costs of it when you remove modules and pay ship bounty and module cleaning costs separately, possibly resulting in larger than intended costs.

Just Be aware any modules removed will have to be cleaned with a separate payment (in outfitting/stored modules) on top of the bounties paid for "cleaning" your SHIP at the Interstellar Factor. )

Thanks to CMDR Phisto Sobanii for the info below (post #18 pg.2)

You absolutely can mod a hot ship. Yesterday morning I killed a Commander illegally and then proceeded to mod my FDL across several engineers. I was converting legacy mods to the new system and then maxing them out. Only issue was taking a multicannon off so I could grind up reputation with Mr. The Blaster on a newly purchased weapon. Outfitting would not refit the original module, so I had to do some travelling around to get it clean and put back on my ship.

What about MURDER!?

In the new system there is an extra penalty associated with murder.

If you commit murder against an npc/or player, a couple of things happen now.

For every murder offence you will receive a bounty* just like you did pre 3.0. (*more below on new murder bounties)

For EVERY ship you murder you will receive 1 POINT of NOTORIETY*. (more in the notoriety section.)

New Murder bounties. (not a thorough explanation.)

When you commit a murder offense against another CMDR ( fellow players) you will receive an extra bounty based on a few factors now. This can substantially increase your bounties now so be aware. This will depend on your Notoriety level, the difference between the Attackers rebuy costs (including engineering) and the Victims rebuy costs. If the attacker rebuy is less than the victim the attacker will incur no extra bounty. Frontier has said they plan to watch these bounty amounts and tweak them, so if you see some outrageous bounties do report them to Fdev.

What is Notoriety and why should I care?

Spoiler

As noted in the above section, when you commit any Murder crimes, no matter if its an npc or fellow CMDR you will gain 1 point of NOTORIETY. This has an impact on your bounties and ability to "clean" your "hot" ship.

You can have a MAXIMUM of 10 notoriety.

Notoriety *should* decay at a rate of 1 point per 2 hours. It will ONLY DECAY WHILE YOU ARE LOGGED IN AND IN THE GAME. It will not decay while you are not playing.

If you have any notoriety (more than 0) YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO PAY OFF YOUR CRIMES or "clean" your "hot" ships at the interstellar Factor.

The Notoriety affect on Bounty amounts.

Every point of notoriety you have while committing another murder crime against another CMDR (players only) will add 10% of the difference between the rebuy of the attacker compared to the victim to the attackers standard murder bounty. This is the same as noted in the murder bounty part of the previous section. This is Fdevs attempt to try and curtail attacks against players in smaller/weaker ships, as well as to encourage attacking of larger/equal/or more powerful ships. This amount takes into account the ship cost, modules and engineering. The actual amounts these factors contribute is unknown. If you experience any single extremely high bounties then report them to Fdev so they can look into possible adjustments. Bounties are cumulative so you could rack up an overall large bounty tab if you attack a lot of weak ships compared to yours. Remember bounties never expire, they only go away once paid at an IF or upon the rebuy of the ship you commited the crimes in.

I'm WANTED, or Have fines. Now what?

Spoiler

Paying off fines or bounties have their own distinct systems now. It is similar to pre 3.0 with a few changes. Biggest of all is they never go away until paid or bounties are "collected"

Remember You MUST be in your "hot" or wanted ship to pay off any fines or bounties. The are attached to the ship, not the CMDR now

If you have any fines or bounties then you can still dock at any star port your ship is able to, unless the controlling minor faction is hostile (attack on sight) to you. If you are friendly with the minor faction but show as wanted in their jurisdiction, then just like pre 3.0, if you get scanned you will be attacked.

When you do dock at ANY star port with either fines or bounties your ship will dock in a mode called ANONYMOUS ACCESS MODE. This limits your ability to use station services and is covered below for fines and bounties.

FINES

If you ONLY have fines in your current jursidiction then you*should* be able to dock at any star port that the controlling faction is not hostile towards you. This *should* include the one you have the fines with. You can then pay of your fines with the old Authority Contact like you did pre 3.0. Fines can only be paid in the jurisdiction they were incurred, or at an IF elsewhere

Your ship will dock in the ANONYMOUS ACCESS mode. With ONLY fines you will only be allowed to access certain station services. You can access the mission board ONLY TO TURN IN CURRENT IN-PROGRESS MISSIONS. You can not take any new missions until your fine is paid.

You can also ONLY accss the following services, the Authority contact ( to pay fines), Interstellar Factors and the black markets.

If for some reason you can't dock in the jurisdiction you have the fines in, you *should* be able to pay them at any IF, but at a markup.

BOUNTIES

If you have any bounties in the current jurisdiction the same docking rules apply as above. Except if you get scanned you will get attacked. You will also again dock in ANONYMOUS ACCESS mode. You can now pay off your bounties at the old Interstellar Factor from pre 3.0, ONLY IF YOUR NOTORIETY IS 0. The IF *should* be found in all LOW SECURITY systems or lower.

With bounties, ANONYMOUS ACCESS will limit you only to turning in in-progess missions, the IF and black markets. You must clear your bounties with the IF, then you can clear fines with the Authority Contact.

You may have noticed, and YES its true, YOU WILL HAVE NO ACCESS TO THE FOLLOWING STATION SERVICES WHILE IN ANONYMOUS ACCESS. Refuel, Restock, Repair, Outfitting, Shipyard and any new missions or cartographics. AND YES YOU MAY GET STUCK IN A SYSTEM IF YOU SHIP A LOW JUMP RANGE SHIP IN. BEWARE!!!

There is a great post and thread started by CMDR DaveB discussing how you can effectively get yourself trapped by transferring ships around in the new c&p system. It here and I recommend giving it a read. https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...-cannot-leave-the-jurisdiction-unaided-in-3-0

Thanks again to CMDR Vindelanos for this bit.

P.S. There is a shipyard at the detention center I'm at, and from the looks of things you can transfer ships here. So for all of the reports of people unable to escape detention centers due to jump range, it's probably worth it to keep a taxi available that you can call in when you need it.

What about ANARCHY SYSTEMS?

Spoiler

Thanks to CMDR Vindelanos for bringing this up. (post#19 pg.2)

For those above questioning Anarchy - note that legal jurisdictions can exist inside Anarchy systems, and Anarchy jurisdictions can exist inside systems of Law, so you have to be mindful of where you commit your crimes.

No actions taken by you in an Anarchy jurisdiction should be registering as crime, i.e. you should be incurring neither fines, bounties, nor notoriety. If you have been penalized with any of these while in an Anarchy jurisdiction, it is a bug and you should report it.

To clarify the first bit of his post, In an ANARCHY SYSTEM you may or may not be in an ANARCHY JURISDICTION. It is possible you may end up in the jurisdiction of a Lawful minor faction, inside an anarchy system. It is believed that only in this case will you get crime penalties only, otherwise you should not get any crimes in anarchy space.

More thanks to CMDR Vindelanos who did some testing. I don't want to add too much to this section, So check out their whole post from the quote below.The Short of it is, Anarachy Systems are a bit of an unknown and possibly very wonky or just flat out bugged. Hopefully we can get some clarification on how Fdev intends this to work.

...snipped a bit out.

Anarchy systems and jurisdictions seem to have all kinds of issues, from Authority ships that shouldn't be there, to missing black markets, to bounties that can be farmed (there shouldn't be).
My suggestion is any time a player triggers crimes or bounty claims while in an Anarchy jursidiction, they file a bug report. Likewise, if they are in a Lawful Jurisdiction and do not trigger crimes, file a bug report as well.
Anarchies seem to be plagued by inconsistent mechanics.

..

But I just want to have some fun PVP among friends

Spoiler

You can, Just make sure both of you TURN OFF "REPORT CRIMES" in the Right hand panel of your ship.
It's also advisable that you go to an anarachy or lawless system as well.
This *should* result in no crimes being reported and therefore none committed.

But I want to play a criminal, pirate, murder (er) hobo etc.

Spoiler

Well you still can, and honestly I don't think a whole lot has changed. This life may not be as easy as it once was for every player ED that chooses to play in these ways. You will probably be incurring and surely paying higher bounties, and Fdev has or will be closing most tricks you can, or were using to sidestep your bounties.

Bounties and Notoriety could make your life a bit more difficult if you are really good at being a criminal and escaping justice. You may find many systems/stations you cant refuel/restock/repair at.
There are also some tougher police forces that show up if you murder a lot of ships in one area now. These may or may not be difficult/deadly for you depending on your skill level.
You may experience some pretty high rebuys upon death if you are killed by a ship that scans you, as any bounty claimed by that scan will be applied to your rebuy now.
It may be best to designate a ship (or more than one) as a "hot" criminal ship for your dastardly deeds, while having a few clean ones for hiding out or doing other things.

Ive never played on the wrong side of the law, so I cant really say for sure. But so far it seems that there hasn't been an extremely large amount of complaints about these activities being impossible now.

 

[Hevak]

New C&P. An Explanation.

Now in 3.0 when you die with bounties that's where things get tricky. You may/most likely will be sent to a different system to a detention center. Whatever bounties claimed on you will be added to your ship rebuy, this may or may not clear all your bounties depending how many you had and in how many factions. and again as long as you have 0 notoriety you can pay off any remaining bounties at an IF same as above. there are various things and conditions on where you respwan and how much rebuy you have to pay, depending on where and how you die. I'm not going to get into that here as it is not important for this discussion. It is somewhat convoluted, but you should never ever end up paying ALL your fines or bounties on one death.

If you experience a bug or weirdness or problems Sandro said they would love all the reports you can give so they can fine tune the system and work out kinks. If you think it might be a bug REPORT IT [up]

If you really feel there are issues that could be tweaked a bit then post constructive suggestions in the suggestion/feedback thread for beyond, or c&p and maybe they will look into some of them.

Pretty sure it was Sandro who said they are open to looking into things and certainly want to fix any issues. Its a new system and some big changes to the game, some settling time is needed, and constructive discussions can hopefully help to tweak it to make it better. Also please be aware the sometime "soon" we are supposed to get galaxy wide Interstellar Bounties, as well as some pretty substantial changes to the Kill Warrant Scanner module. I will upate this post with any new information these changes bring. And maybe once the dust settles on these changes and more is confirmed, known and fixed, I will redo this a bit as an overall C&P guide for new and returning players.

 

[Chorda]

A warning message when you attempt to place a hot module in a clean ship wouldn't go amiss. Otherwise, seems generally fine so far.

 

[operant]

Do I have to be in the wanted ship to pay-off the bounty at an interstellar factors, or can I be any ship i.e. one that is not wanted.

 

[Hevak]

Do I have to be in the wanted ship to pay-off the bounty at an interstellar factors, or can I be any ship i.e. one that is not wanted.

Yes in the wanted ship, all fines are attached to the ship I forgot that Important bit. Ty.

 

[operant]

Yes in the wanted ship, all fines are attached to the ship I forgot that Important bit. Ty.

Well that could be interesting, because it has a very short jump range............

 

[Straker]

I mostly agree with the OP. The situation with the bugs is perhaps contributing to people's confusion.

I know I was confused at first after looking at my crime stats and got a nasty surprise seeing my notoriety was 10! (yes 10!) when the only thing I had done was destroy a few ships at an anarchy system for mats. I also had a couple of fines for recklessly hitting other ships while docking, which shouldn't contribute to notoriety.

We need to let everything settle for a bit and hope that bugs get fixed before the next major point release.

 

[Hevak]

Well that could be interesting, because it has a very short jump range............

Yes, there have been reports of people being stuck because of such issues. Ship size and jump range matters especially if you are in fringe areas of occupied systems.

There is another thread discussing that issue as well. That may be something they could look into, but it also may have areas there isn't much they can do about it.

 

[GJ51]

I mostly agree with the OP. The situation with the bugs is perhaps contributing to people's confusion.

I know I was confused at first after looking at my crime stats and got a nasty surprise seeing my notoriety was 10! (yes 10!) when the only thing I had done was destroy a few ships at an anarchy system for mats. I also had a couple of fines for recklessly hitting other ships while docking, which shouldn't contribute to notoriety.

We need to let everything settle for a bit and hope that bugs get fixed before the next major point release.

I'm not sure I'm seeing the "logic" behind accumulating notoriety in an Anarchy system. I would have thought that would have been set aside as the one area where there wouldn't be any consequences for "criminal" behavior, i.e. where PvP could take place without consequences.

Seems a bit odd

 

[Straker]

I'm not sure I'm seeing the "logic" behind accumulating notoriety in an Anarchy system. I would have thought that would have been set aside as the one area where there wouldn't be any consequences for "criminal" behavior, i.e. where PvP could take place without consequences.

Seems a bit odd

Yes, totally agree with you. Hence my confusion.

 

[Hevak]

I'm not sure I'm seeing the "logic" behind accumulating notoriety in an Anarchy system. I would have thought that would have been set aside as the one area where there wouldn't be any consequences for "criminal" behavior, i.e. where PvP could take place without consequences.

Seems a bit odd

I mostly agree with the OP. The situation with the bugs is perhaps contributing to people's confusion.

I know I was confused at first after looking at my crime stats and got a nasty surprise seeing my notoriety was 10! (yes 10!) when the only thing I had done was destroy a few ships at an anarchy system for mats. I also had a couple of fines for recklessly hitting other ships while docking, which shouldn't contribute to notoriety.

We need to let everything settle for a bit and hope that bugs get fixed before the next major point release.

Yes I'm fairly certain there should not have been notoriety for anarchy systems. But I can not find actual proof it should work either way. There is confusion on how anarchy systems should operate. If any on has a link to a dev saying one way or another please share. This is one aspect that should be clarified and possibly discussed and maybe tweaked. I agree it shouldn't have notoriety or crimes as secured space.

Also I intentionally left out, for clarity, the increase and decrease to rebuy when pvp murder is committed.

Also "soon" we will have interstellar bounties and KWS changes coming as well.

 

[GG7]

Yes I'm fairly certain there should not have been notoriety for anarchy systems. But I can not find actual proof it should work either way. There is confusion on how anarchy systems should operate. If any on has a link to a dev saying one way or another please share.

Also I intentionally left out, for clarity, the increase and decrease to rebuy when pvp murder is committed.

If memory serves, Sandy S. stated in one of the Beyond Q&A Live Streams that Anarchy systems are supposed to be excluded from all of this stuff.

 

[Hevak]

If memory serves, Sandy S. stated in one of the Beyond Q&A Live Streams that Anarchy systems are supposed to be excluded from all of this stuff.

Yes I'm fairly sure I saw/heard it from one of them somewhere before it went live.

Also I want to point out a few issues I've seen reported.

If you get interdicted and attacked when clean, you still need to scan the ship before firing. It was Sandro I think in one thread that said being interdicted doesn't always mean the ship becomes wanted when you drop out SC, and scanning in SC and seeing wanted as well could change when you drop. Depending on jurisdictions.

Also some reports show a bug, or just lag where you scan a ship, see wanted then fire and still get crimes triggered. One post they said their log showed the scan/wanted status showing after the first shot by the player. Now these are player reports and are only as accurate as the info provided. But I have seen a number of reports that crimes are being given for wanted ships. So maybe give it a few secs after scans, or pay attention and report any issues.

 

[Ra'Kaan]

shamelessly copypaste a quote from another thread =P because you didnt mention the authority contact in the OP.

quote (can't find brackets on mobile)
-----------------------
I think some folks see all the red symbols in their cockpit and never actually go check the authority contact.

This aspect of the game is exaclty the way local fines were handled prior to 3.0.

Get a local fine, go pay authority.

And it's immediate! you don't even have to wait for H-Jump!

Except your dashboard is all lit up in red hehe

If it gets bigger than ... is it still 6000cr ?? Then it turns bounty and you have to get the broker network involved.
/quote
--------------------

(ps maybe its 1000cr when it turns from fine to bounty?)

 

[Stealthie]

Suppose this is as good a place as any to ask...

Anybody know if engineers will still do mod's on hot modules?

I was thinking of buying a ship specifically for some furtive outlawing but I was wondering if I'd have to finish upgrading it before I started using it for dirty deeds.

 

[Hevak]

shamelessly copypaste a quote from another thread =P because you didnt mention the authority contact in the OP.

quote (can't find brackets on mobile)
-----------------------
I think some folks see all the red symbols in their cockpit and never actually go check the authority contact.

This aspect of the game is exaclty the way local fines were handled prior to 3.0.

Get a local fine, go pay authority.

And it's immediate! you don't even have to wait for H-Jump!

Except your dashboard is all lit up in red hehe

If it gets bigger than ... is it still 6000cr ?? Then it turns bounty and you have to get the broker network involved.
/quote
--------------------

(ps maybe its 1000cr when it turns from fine to bounty?)

Under the new system fines will never turn into a bounty. Only crimes that result in bounties will give them. I saw no mention from any dev saying a certain amount of fines turn into a bounty. Crimes are either fine or bounty level offenses. Thing like trespass friendly fire can be both, they start as fines, and if you keep going it turns to a bounty. But if you were to friendly fire or trespass, get a fine and leave, than do it again over and over they would all be fines no matter how much $$ you rack up in fines. at least that is how it should work from my understanding of how the devs put it.

Suppose this is as good a place as any to ask...

Anybody know if engineers will still do mod's on hot modules?

I was thinking of buying a ship specifically for some furtive outlawing but I was wondering if I'd have to finish upgrading it before I started using it for dirty deeds.

I was wrong so edited out my answer as there is a better answer from someone who has tried it on the next page. I also updated my op, under the what happens when I get a bounty/fine section.

 

[CMDR Dumbfries]

The new C&P isn't that hard, so I'm going to explain it using this ginormous wall of text...

 

[Hooplah]

Thanks for an understandable general description of C&P. Hours of live streams and your description is better! Your thread should have been titled 'The Idiot's Guide to C&P'. Have some rep.

 

[Phisto Sobanii]

Suppose this is as good a place as any to ask...

Anybody know if engineers will still do mod's on hot modules?

I was thinking of buying a ship specifically for some furtive outlawing but I was wondering if I'd have to finish upgrading it before I started using it for dirty deeds.

You absolutely can mod a hot ship. Yesterday morning I killed a Commander illegally and then proceeded to mod my FDL across several engineers. I was converting legacy mods to the new system and then maxing them out. Only issue was taking a multicannon off so I could grind up reputation with Mr. The Blaster on a newly purchased weapon. Outfitting would not refit the original module, so I had to do some travelling around to get it clean and put back on my ship.