No Single Player offline Mode then?

[Zedrick]

I had to register here just to be a part of this historical longest rage-thread ever.

My 2 cents:

I totally understand people who are disapointed. I dislike MMO's as much as the next sane grownup (only play World of Tanks, which is full of 13 year old trolls), I've spent countless hours playing Elite on the C64 and Frontier on the Amiga (+ I have an Acorn with the original elite next to me) so I totally understand why people want a modern version to recrate those wonderful childhood memories. But come on, this is 2014. If you want an Elite game that runs 100% on your own computer, try Oolite or something. Trying to make Elite Dangerous - which has become a massive thing - into a standalone game would be pointless. It would have to be totally butchered to even fit on a blueray-disk.

Secondly, single player mode is still there. If you can post on this forum, you have enough bandwidth to run it.

And lastly, a lot of people are dead sure David Braben is evil and that this (the "promise" of a 100% offline standalone single player game) is some kind of conspiracy to get more money. Really? Really?

Anyway, first post - hope I don't get negrepped to death (if such a thing exists on this forum) for this.

 

[DaveS1]

Your post is true, but the fact remains that those "very VERY few" are still AFFECTED. They should be offered a full refund by Frontier Developments, even if they were online and playing for every minute of the alpha and beta phases. The fact that it seems like they won't (going by the FD responses people have quoted on these forums), is not on, because it means that they have apparently been suckered into paying to be testers for a product they will not be able to use.

But that is the real meat isn't it? If it truly is a "very VERY few" then FD can afford to give refunds and everyone can move on. Some of us who are complaining won't even take the refund - some like me because although this is not what we want out of Elite 4, we are willing to gamble the money we have already spent on it being worthwhile, and others because they aren't themselves interested in offline but they see the injustice and are concerned both for those affected now and the likelihood they themselves will be affected later on if FD are allowed to get away with removing key features with no consequences.

If, however, the number of people who are unhappy with the lack of offline to the point where they actually want their cash back is enough to materially affect FD's cashflow, or indeed existence then the argument for delivering offline is overwhelming.

 

[Armour]

but that's the point - the majority of them can use it.

We don't have the exact figures to say that for sure though, do we?

I don't care too much for offline in the case of this game, but I can see the attractions....

• Being able to pause mid-fight and go for a wee.
• Being able to play on the move without suffering repeated connection losses and crashes whilst travelling between Lower Fartsmouth and East Dingleton (or pick your own 2 fictitious locations) because the coverage is so spotty.
• Being able to play without worrying about the impact on your mobile data allowance.
• Being able to leave the game alone for 2 months whilst you live it up in the Costa Del Lots, then come back and find it in the same state you left it in (or even not, there's no reason that the game has to remain static even offline, PG algorithms can generate 4-dimensional data after all).

Besides, let the majority be damned in this case. The promised something specifically to cater for the minority, then pulled it. The fact that a some of that minority appear to have pledged lots of cash that probably didn't hurt the perceived momentum of the funding campaign when it was going through it's mid-life crisis is irrelevant, but interesting.

 

[DraigUK]

I think you'll find that this description fits just about everyone who "grew up" on the original games. Not all of course, and you're right that most people were / are excited for the multiplayer aspects of it - but at the back of everyone's mind at least was the promise of offline. To be able to play E: D like an updated version of FFE.

Basically, that's what we pledged for. It's why it was so important during the KS campaign.

I'm part of the KS myself. It was an important part of the KS campaign for you maybe. Not for me.
The important part of the KS campaign for me was actually getting the game made in the first place.
The second major point for me was that it was an on-line multiplayer experience.
anything else was just a bonus.

 

[Juniper]

Yup, because people are totally not responsible for their own behaviour.

Of course they are and I'm not condoning it. I'm just saying I understand it.

 

[nexxo]

This some of the ugliest facets of humanity on display. Starting with FD. If they handled this situation like a reasonable company who cared what their backers and supporters wish we wouldn't be here... would we?

Yup, because people are totally not responsible for their own behaviour.

- - - - - Additional Content Posted / Auto Merge - - - - -

Of course they are and I'm not condoning it. I'm just saying I understand it.

I understand it too --as dysfunctional behaviour.

 

[jhondidfool]

I'm part of the KS myself. It was an important part of the KS campaign for you maybe. Not for me.
The important part of the KS campaign for me was actually getting the game made in the first place.
The second major point for me was that it was an on-line multiplayer experience.
anything else was just a bonus.

Hear hear!

 

[Deleted member 47764]

We don't have the exact figures to say that for sure though, do we?

I don't care too much for offline in the case of this game, but I can see the attractions....

• Being able to pause mid-fight and go for a wee.
• Being able to play on the move without suffering repeated connection losses and crashes whilst travelling between Lower Fartsmouth and East Dingleton (or pick your own 2 fictitious locations) because the coverage is so spotty.
• Being able to play without worrying about the impact on your mobile data allowance.
• Being able to leave the game alone for 2 months whilst you live it up in the Costa Del Lots, then come back and find it in the same state you left it in (or even not, there's no reason that the game has to remain static even offline, PG algorithms can generate 4-dimensional data after all).

Besides, let the majority be damned in this case. The promised something specifically to cater for the minority, then pulled it. The fact that a some of that minority appear to have pledged lots of cash that probably didn't hurt the perceived momentum of the funding campaign when it was going through it's mid-life crisis is irrelevant, but interesting.

Two things are missing here I think
The possibilities of modding, which will be impossible with a in essence Online DRM game.
When DLC sales stop and they shut down the servers due to costs, the game will stop functioning, cease to exist, we will never be able to play it again.

 

[Vargur]

Take a good look people. Is this reaction and solution what you identify with?

Is this really how you deal with things, and how you feel adults should behave? DhuAlan wants to make everybody pay, to go full griefer on everybody he sees has somehow personally wronged him.

This some of the ugliest facets of humanity on display. He could decide to sell the game and never look back. He clearly can play online just fine, but because he feels wronged, he will now do his best to be a virtual terrorist in the game and on the forums.

Nice guy. I wonder how many here think this is a noble, heroic stand.

Noble? Heroic? No not at all.

He is acting by the same morale standards as FD currently are.

By not refunding people they are keeping these people unwillingly tied in this newly created MMO community.

 

[Juniper]

I'm part of the KS myself. It was an important part of the KS campaign for you maybe. Not for me.
The important part of the KS campaign for me was actually getting the game made in the first place.
The second major point for me was that it was an on-line multiplayer experience.
anything else was just a bonus.

As I said, not everybody. But I lived on the comments pages of that KS for 58 days and that was the firm impression I got. The people who I convinced to back only backed when offline was confirmed, because it was critical to their enjoyment. Not that they couldn't play online (although there were certainly a fair number of those as I recall, mostly Aussies and military types) but because they didn't want to. An MMO with microtransactions wasn't the Elite they, nor I, wanted.

So you get what you want, and I lose money on a game that isn't what I backed and have no wish to play. Sucks to be me, eh?

 

[Thomsi]

\i for one am not really bothered about the off-line mode not being implemented. Who wants to fly around space on there own. If people look at the kick-starter page they will also see this quote as well, so people you don't have a leg to stand on for a refund im afraid in my opinion anyway.

" Risks and challenges

Stating the obvious, all projects, whether building a bridge, making a film, studying for an exam or whatever, carry risk. Projects can run out of time or money, people can leave, assumptions that were made at the start may prove to be mistaken, or the results may simply not be as good as expected. Games development is no different."

 

[Hermit]

And lastly, a lot of people are dead sure David Braben is evil and that this (the "promise" of a 100% offline standalone single player game) is some kind of conspiracy to get more money. Really? Really?

Who's saying he's evil? Not me. And the offline game was promised and expected (read the link on my sig). As for your other comments. Well, Josh Parnell seems to be doing a good job with it.

 

[Armour]

Two things are missing here I think
The possibilities of modding, which will be impossible with a in essence Online DRM game.
When DLC sales stop and they shut down the servers due to costs, the game will stop functioning, cease to exist, we will never be able to play it again.

Both good points too. Have a biscuit:

 

[jhondidfool]

Newly created? It's been an MMO all along!

 

[Papa Smurf]

You are allowed to your opinion. Yet mine differs a lot from yours.

<I need to start word document and copy my posts there to make reposting easier! >

They can't have it both ways. Either stick to your campaign promises (which are what compelled people to fund the project), or offer refunds to those who ask for it when you bail on those promises.

Bail early if you have to, so you shed the people for whom the game you're now making isn't the game they want to fund/play. But you don't get to rattle off a list of stuff, each of which motivates different people to different degrees to decide to fund you, and then just ditch parts of that list at the end.

And I get that development can't be 100% predicted. That's why I'm saying they have to be proactive about these decisions AND allow for KS/store refunds when requested.

You either allow for refunds, or you make damn sure you only promise things in your KS/store campaign that you're actually doing to deliver, so that those who fund your project can trust that they're not standing on a rug that's going to get yanked out from under them at the end.

And for those who say, "but this isn't a store, it's an investor platform". That's disingenuous. Investors get to influence, if not outright dictate, business decisions. At no point was I or any other KS backer (the 'investors') consulted about whether they should drop offline support or soften their DRM-free commitment.

THERE IS AN EASY SOLUTION TO THIS PROBLEM... REFUND INTEREST FREE MONEY you got year + ago to UNHAPPY supporters!!!

I'm part of the KS myself. It was an important part of the KS campaign for you maybe. Not for me.
The important part of the KS campaign for me was actually getting the game made in the first place.
The second major point for me was that it was an on-line multiplayer experience.
anything else was just a bonus.

 

[Vargur]

Newly created? It's been an MMO all along!

Yea probably, they only forgot to tell us until friday.

 

[DraigUK]

So basically you are saying, we got your money and there is nothing you can do about it, sucks to be you. Is that about right?

Yup pretty much. That's the reality of the situation as I see it, pending the strap line of them looking into individual cases claiming refunds etc
I appreciate you won't like that viewpoint, but, well. Not much else for me to say really.
Best of luck with your endeavours.

 

[Thomsi]

The same for me as well, I just wanted the game made in what ever form it came out in.

 

[withnail]

Shuffles in with a sense of deja vu.


Is this the Newtonian flight thread?

 

[Juniper]

Who wants to fly around space on there own.

"Their" own, and the answer is me, along with a number of other people who feel the same way. That's why the thread is as big as it is, and why it's a big deal.

Glad it's not a big deal for you and you're getting the game that the "offliners" helped fund to fruition.

Enjoy it. Your empathy is astounding, btw.