No Single Player offline Mode then?

[Aldric]

Beta, and indeed, alpha. It's never worked properly.

My solace was offline - and why I defended Frontier to the hilt when the forums exploded at each stage and they discovered that the network stack was simply broken. Because, y'know, there's always offline mode...

Anyway, this conversation has again become circular so I'm out. It's nobody's business to anyone else why offline is important to a player. Accept it as the case, and leave it at that.

It could be that what you call "it never working properly" is the same that all of us have experianced ? i have a mega fast BB connection but i had crashes/stuttering/disconnects/ etc that i reported, we are after all testing a Beta phase ? so might not be just your connection cuasing you problems ?

 

[phlOgistOn]

I wonder if it could get to a point where it would be cheaper to invest a small team in a single player standalone version ( like frontier )
than give refunds ?

I guess it depends on how generous they feel with refunds - legally imo I think the KS investors are actually entitled to pretty much nothing IF FD can/decide to show that they've already spent the invested funds on current progress. People who purchased products directly from FD however should be covered by trading standards wherever...

Of course it would be a good will gesture for them to partially/fully refund the affected KS players BUT that's basically spending money from other investors that would have been put towards future development. So how far would they want to sacrifice their future visions of the game to satisfy people that aren't going to play the game (but will cry lots of internet tears and potentially dissuade other investors)?

 

[Colonel Kenney]

I think a PROMISE needs to be made that should Elite ever need to shut down its servers - it will make publicly available the server and content so others could continue to run their own servers. Maybe even sell the server module itself so others could run their own private galaxy. That way like Elite and other similar games have been preserved and are still playable via emulators and such.

Going to this cloud based type of gaming is going to destroy any ability in the future to preserve history.

 

[jamotide]

Sorry to say this and i honestly am not trying to be harsh but you sound childish here and its such a pointless post, why even bother?

pot...kettle?

 

[Binerexis]

I notice you keep repeating that, but Michael Brookes said on at least one occasion that it wasn't impossible. In the absence of a full and appropriate statement from FD it seems to me that an artistic decision has been made, its just a shame that this decision means that they have broken the word they gave during and after the Kickstarter process. It makes me sad to say that, but I believe its simply a statement of the facts.

Perhaps there were circumstances that made it necessary, but when integrity is brought into question, I think a proper statement should be made on the issue - the glossed over mention in the newsletter and the forum comments, in my view, fall short of the mark.

And Michael Brookes has said in this thread that with the game in its current state, it isn't possible. It may have been possible in the past but that is no longer the case.

 

[Only]

It's hardly the fault of anyone at Frontier that a number of customers are choosing to rant in this thread without even looking for the one I keep linking. It's not even difficult to find. If anything, Frontier should be commended for assuming their community is smart enough to look for such threads.

Well you clearly don't understand the point I was making but nevermind.

 

[Ttaskmaster]

I will stick with Star Citizen because at least Chris Roberts knows how to make a game.

Really?
I gave up on all the Star Citizen crew backslapping eachother and making HUGE announcements every time they managed to implement a towel or a jukebox into the hangar module, all while missing promised deadlines by weeks and taking months just to patch a small facet of the full game. I won't even mention the huge sums of money, blatant funding drives and "One Time Only" offers that get repeatedly offered far more often than once!

 

[jamotide]

You don't. You took the same risk everybody takes with KS.

The risk that the company goes belly up, yeah, not the risk that the deliver something other than the rewards we pledged for.

 

[charognard]

Well clearly he doesn't know everything and is a stooge. Anyways enjoy being stolen from by these frauds. I will stick with Star Citizen because at least Chris Roberts knows how to make a game. EVE Online will also profit from Frontier screwing the people who helped fund their game.

You re talking about the 2 famous offline games ever no ?

 

[mbpoblet]

This is how it should have been done:

Once the decision had been made (which must have been some time ago);

1. Email to all customers from Braben sincerely apologising (I'd do a video as well)
2. Offer a full quibble-free refund of backer and any other purchase costs.
3. Issue categoric assurances that should the servers be shut down for commercial reasons an offline patch or other arrangement would be made so we'll always be able to play.
4. In recognition of this change offer details of meaningful in-game benefits rather than vaguely alluding to a free ship. Give details. Come up with a more attractive package.
5. If indeed the data exchanges needed to play solo are as low as people say - have an android and ipad app that enable people to easily make and keep the necessary connection to play via 3g on phones
6. Simultaneously issue a press release and have people, including Braben himself, available for journalists to talk to. Keep ahead of and in control of the story. Make your case on the major game forums.
7. I'd tell forum mods here to tell the self-appointed White Knights 'we don't need your help. Please shut up. You're making us look callous and indifferent.'
8. Apologise again.

If it had been done this way I'd still feel sad and disappointed, but not angry and betrayed.

 

[Vlodec]

Yes they admit they said that, and now they are saying they are taking that back. It's done deal.

You never have said anything that turned out to be wrong?

What's upsetting some of us Pecisk is the way they're treating this issue and the people affected by it.

DB has always been like this, since way before the KS project. He never feels the need to inform. I suspect his attitude is "ignore it and it'll all go away". In fact it'll just go quiet, which isn't the same thing.

 

[SalsaDMA]

Explain how to get a refund of ~£1000 worth of Kickstarter pledges and I'd be all ears. Seriously.

He can't, cause the link doesn't state that.

They merely say they will deem on a case by case basis.

I contacted them through the contact optino on the website we originally got ( https://www.elitedangerous.com/backers/login/ ) and asked for a refund. The page says there can be a 24 hour time before rpley, so I don't even know what they will answer me when they get back to me. The "collectors edition" I had pledged for is worthless without offline, so I'm gonna take my money back if I can.

 

[Binerexis]

Well you clearly don't understand the point I was making but nevermind.

I understood your point, I just found it to be flawed. Still, here's hoping you're having a good day.

 

[starbuck1771]

I wonder if it could get to a point where it would be cheaper to invest a small team in a single player standalone version ( like frontier )
than give refunds ?

It already is cheaper because if they get sued they could lose everything because what they did is commit an act of fraud. If you are a U.S. citizen you can always file a complaint with the FBI and make this turn into a nightmare for Frontier.

fraud
n. the intentional use of deceit, a trick or some dishonest means to deprive another of his/her/its money, property or a legal right. A party who has lost something due to fraud is entitled to file a lawsuit for damages against the party acting fraudulently, and the damages may include punitive damages as a punishment or public example due to the malicious nature of the fraud. Quite often there are several persons involved in a scheme to commit fraud and each and all may be liable for the total damages. Inherent in fraud is an unjust advantage over another which injures that person or entity. It includes failing to point out a known mistake in a contract or other writing (such as a deed), or not revealing a fact which he/she has a duty to communicate, such as a survey which shows there are only 10 acres of land being purchased and not 20 as originally understood. Constructive fraud can be proved by a showing of breach of legal duty (like using the trust funds held for another in an investment in one's own business) without direct proof of fraud or fraudulent intent. Extrinsic fraud occurs when deceit is employed to keep someone from exercising a right, such as a fair trial, by hiding evidence or misleading the opposing party in a lawsuit. Since fraud is intended to employ dishonesty to deprive another of money, property or a right, it can also be a crime for which the fraudulent person(s) can be charged, tried and convicted. Borderline overreaching or taking advantage of another's naiveté involving smaller amounts is often overlooked by law enforcement, which suggests the victim seek a "civil remedy" (i.e., sue). However, increasingly fraud, which has victimized a large segment of the public (even in individually small amounts), has become the target of consumer fraud divisions in the offices of district attorneys and attorneys general.

 

[phlOgistOn]

It already is cheaper because if they get sued they could lose everything because what they did is commit an act of fraud. If you are a U.S. citizen you can always file a complaint with the FBI and make this turn into a nightmare for Frontier.

fraud
n. the intentional use of deceit, a trick or some dishonest means to deprive another of his/her/its money, property or a legal right. A party who has lost something due to fraud is entitled to file a lawsuit for damages against the party acting fraudulently, and the damages may include punitive damages as a punishment or public example due to the malicious nature of the fraud. Quite often there are several persons involved in a scheme to commit fraud and each and all may be liable for the total damages. Inherent in fraud is an unjust advantage over another which injures that person or entity. It includes failing to point out a known mistake in a contract or other writing (such as a deed), or not revealing a fact which he/she has a duty to communicate, such as a survey which shows there are only 10 acres of land being purchased and not 20 as originally understood. Constructive fraud can be proved by a showing of breach of legal duty (like using the trust funds held for another in an investment in one's own business) without direct proof of fraud or fraudulent intent. Extrinsic fraud occurs when deceit is employed to keep someone from exercising a right, such as a fair trial, by hiding evidence or misleading the opposing party in a lawsuit. Since fraud is intended to employ dishonesty to deprive another of money, property or a right, it can also be a crime for which the fraudulent person(s) can be charged, tried and convicted. Borderline overreaching or taking advantage of another's naiveté involving smaller amounts is often overlooked by law enforcement, which suggests the victim seek a "civil remedy" (i.e., sue). However, increasingly fraud, which has victimized a large segment of the public (even in individually small amounts), has become the target of consumer fraud divisions in the offices of district attorneys and attorneys general.

lol threatening fraud. Try proving fraud instead of overstated dreams - or take Molyneux to court and prove it's possible

 

[Sniger]

Doesn't that also imply that when they wrote the EULA they intended then that the game could be played offline - in other words something changed since (as thye've said at length) rather than they never intended to include offline - which is what some people seem to be trying to assert?

Until friday I would have thought so, but ultimately it is a question I am not in a position to answer.

 

[ianw]

It already is cheaper because if they get sued they could lose everything because what they did is commit an act of fraud. If you are a U.S. citizen you can always file a complaint with the FBI and make this turn into a nightmare for Frontier.

fraud
n. the intentional use of deceit, a trick or some dishonest means to deprive another of his/her/its money, property or a legal right. A party who has lost something due to fraud is entitled to file a lawsuit for damages against the party acting fraudulently, and the damages may include punitive damages as a punishment or public example due to the malicious nature of the fraud. Quite often there are several persons involved in a scheme to commit fraud and each and all may be liable for the total damages. Inherent in fraud is an unjust advantage over another which injures that person or entity. It includes failing to point out a known mistake in a contract or other writing (such as a deed), or not revealing a fact which he/she has a duty to communicate, such as a survey which shows there are only 10 acres of land being purchased and not 20 as originally understood. Constructive fraud can be proved by a showing of breach of legal duty (like using the trust funds held for another in an investment in one's own business) without direct proof of fraud or fraudulent intent. Extrinsic fraud occurs when deceit is employed to keep someone from exercising a right, such as a fair trial, by hiding evidence or misleading the opposing party in a lawsuit. Since fraud is intended to employ dishonesty to deprive another of money, property or a right, it can also be a crime for which the fraudulent person(s) can be charged, tried and convicted. Borderline overreaching or taking advantage of another's naiveté involving smaller amounts is often overlooked by law enforcement, which suggests the victim seek a "civil remedy" (i.e., sue). However, increasingly fraud, which has victimized a large segment of the public (even in individually small amounts), has become the target of consumer fraud divisions in the offices of district attorneys and attorneys general.

"the intentional use of deceit" - perhaps you can show the evidence of intentional deceit you have?

 

[Binerexis]

What's upsetting some of us Pecisk is the way they're treating this issue and the people affected by it.

DB has always been like this, since way before the KS project. He never feels the need to inform. I suspect his attitude is "ignore it and it'll all go away". In fact it'll just go quiet, which isn't the same thing.

I think it's unfair to assume what devs are going to do when people in this thread are getting more volatile and demanding by the minute making the situation even harder to handle. At this point, they're in a situation where those who wanted offline aren't going to be satisfied with a response anyway.

 

[SuBSynk]

what they did is commit an act of fraud.

" the intentional use of deceit, a trick or some dishonest means to deprive another of his/her/its money"

Kinda failed on this first sentence though didn't it.

Please also keep in mind people live in other parts of the world than the "sue-happy culture" of the US.

I wont even comment on the idea of getting the FBI involved but to say you need to take a step back and breath a little.

 

[synchromesh]

I guess it depends on how generous they feel with refunds - legally imo I think the KS investors are actually entitled to pretty much nothing

I think your right.....Its not really a case of ripping people off... Legally I don't think they have done that.....From a certain perspective its a feature that wasn't able to be implemented..... Like many other kickstarters it doesn't always pan out exactly but they haven't done a runner with all the cash..... No doubt SC may not turn out EXACTLY as promised ?