OA and Dj truthsayer discuss update news

Yes.

FDev: "We'll be supplementing Squadrons with Fleet Carriers that have this limited functionality"
Players: "OMG, such barebones, so very like Powerplay, CQC, and Multicrew! Here are things we want from them"
FDev: "Okay, let's delay Carriers to allow time to add some of the functionality players want"
Players: "OMG, you delayed Carriers, you never listen to us!"
Is there a precedent like this?
 
Yes.

FDev: "We'll be supplementing Squadrons with Fleet Carriers that have this limited functionality"
Players: "OMG, such barebones, so very like Powerplay, CQC, and Multicrew! Here are things we want from them"
FDev: "Okay, let's delay Carriers to allow time to add some of the functionality players want"
Players: "OMG, you delayed Carriers, you never listen to us!"
Why did they plan to add yet another barebone feature in the first place then?

FDev1: "We could add fleet carriers in Q4."
FDev2: "Sounds cool. What will players be able to do with it?"
FDev1: "Nothing much really, it's just a different megaship model. But it sounds cool."
FDev2: "Sure, let's do this and announce it as highlight feature of Beyond!"

Coming up with fake conversations is fun!
 
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Regarding fleet carriers, since changes in video game development are the norm, they probably should never have talked about their plans. Wait, not talking about their plans is exactly why people are upset.
 
An interesting observation. At my job, we also have customers (though not like game industry customers). We, too, get this insanity. Comments ranging from one of the people working at our customer location claiming that all of my colleagues are stupid (probably I am stupid when I'm not the one there as well) to finding one bug therefore the entire thing is broken and must be checked.

There is no pleasing humans.
 
Why did they plan to add yet another barebone feature in the first place then?

FDev1: "We could add fleet carriers in Q4."
FDev2: "Sounds cool. What will players be able to do with it?"
FDev1: "Nothing much really, it's just a different megaship model. But it sounds cool."
FDev2: "Sure, let's do this and announce it as highlight feature of Beyond!"

Coming up with fake conversations is fun!
1: Spam
2: Spam spam egg chips beans and spam
3: Spam spam spam spam spam spam spam spam, spammity spam spammity spam
4: SHUUUUUUT UUUUUP
 
*nod* damned if they do, damned if they don't.

I'm speculating, but I seriously doubt we'll get any hard info this year, and anything they do​ tease had better be beyond the point where it's in any doubt of shipping.
It's all about managing expectations, though.

Do that successfully and you'll retain people's interest and support while, at the same time, avoid over-promising or creating false expectations.

The whole "team of a hundred people" thing was a textbook example of doing this wrong.

Throughout the development of Beyond there was (in optimistic quarters) a feeling that Beyond was being created by a small group while the majority of the team were obviously working on The Next Big Thing.
Which, to be fair, was fairly plausible because it's not like Beyond could really be all a "team of 100 people" could come up with, right?

So, what happened?

Turns out that Beyond was all the "team of a hundred people" have been working on in any meaningful way.

That's not a good result, whichever way you try to spin it.
It would seem to suggest that Beyond (along with ongoing bug-fixes) is all the "team of a hundred people" are capable of producing in 18 months or somebody was telling fibs about the "team of a hundred people".

Honestly, I struggle to believe that there's anybody left in the ED community who pays much attention when somebody from FDev announces "something exciting, coming soon".
Hell, the phrase has become a trope within the community.

Their current PR strategy has pretty-much tanked completely, to the point where the response to it ranges from outright hostility at worst to indifference at best.
Quite simply, nobody cares (either way) what they say any more.

If they want to change that, it's probably time to try something different.
 
The whole "team of a hundred people" thing was a textbook example of doing this wrong.

Throughout the development of Beyond there was (in optimistic quarters) a feeling that Beyond was being created by a small group while the majority of the team were obviously working on The Next Big Thing.
Which, to be fair, was fairly plausible because it's not like Beyond could really be all a "team of 100 people" could come up with, right?

So, what happened?

Turns out that Beyond was all the "team of a hundred people" have been working on in any meaningful way.
According to Frontier that's not true. They said in August 2018 that work on the (now known as) 2020 content have started some time ago. So it seems like half of Beyond they'be been in full production of the next big thing. It's very likely that pre production started a few months earlier, you don't just put the majority of your team onto something without creating an internal roadmap first.
 
Yes.

FDev: "We'll be supplementing Squadrons with Fleet Carriers that have this limited functionality"
Players: "OMG, such barebones, so very like Powerplay, CQC, and Multicrew! Here are things we want from them"
FDev: "Okay, let's delay Carriers to allow time to add some of the functionality players want"
Players: "OMG, you delayed Carriers, you never listen to us!"
Implying that if/when Carriers are added to the game, they won't be the same barebones limited functionality you're warning us off from now. Haw Haw!
 
Their current PR strategy has pretty-much tanked completely, to the point where the response to it ranges from outright hostility at worst to indifference at best.
Quite simply, nobody cares (either way) what they say any more.
Yeah i know its funny. Since the announcement every time i think of elite ive been throwing to face a cold cup of the *reality* of frontier developments. Starting to accepting i can't like them as much as i want to.

In the past, frontiers results, their output has generated goodwill towards the company. This was the problem, because the company side (community management, pr, and future development roadmap for elite) in no way match the strength of the goodwill generated by elite the game.

The frontier is cold and unmoving, and we're in love with being in space. Bound to break at some point.
 
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Yes.

FDev: "We'll be supplementing Squadrons with Fleet Carriers that have this limited functionality"
Players: "OMG, such barebones, so very like Powerplay, CQC, and Multicrew! Here are things we want from them"
FDev: "Okay, let's delay Carriers to allow time to add some of the functionality players want"
Players: "OMG, you delayed Carriers, you never listen to us!"
This would totally make sense....if I hadn't been playing these last four years and watching such gems as Powerplay and Multi-crew go sailing on and on and on and on. Perhaps this particular line works with all of the new players, but I think you'll find that it falls flat among the vets who've been around the block a few times. Nice try tho.
 
This would totally make sense....if I hadn't been playing these last four years and watching such gems as Powerplay and Multi-crew go sailing on and on and on and on. Perhaps this particular line works with all of the new players, but I think you'll find that it falls flat among the vets who've been around the block a few times. Nice try tho.
Exactly, FDev didn't release another barebone feature (Fleet Carriers) that would be barely used and so go untouched in future updates. It looks like they listened to players. Noice!

Or are you arguing that FDev can't change, despite dozens of forum users nagging for FDev to change? If FDev indeed cannot change, then why are those users nagging? :S
 
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Implying that if/when Carriers are added to the game, they won't be the same barebones limited functionality you're warning us off from now. Haw Haw!
I like your confidence! Bet you £10 that Fleet Carriers upon arrival will have more functionality than FDev originally said in the Focused Feedback Forum :D
 
I like your confidence! Bet you £10 that Fleet Carriers upon arrival will have more functionality than FDev originally said in the Focused Feedback Forum :D
On balance I think you make the better point but remember when you said 'wait for Gamescom'?

We (the community) lack the necessary information to establish whether the rate of development progress is good or bad. With the stated size of the dedicated ED team and the timescales we do know progress seems questionably slow. As you say, it may be justified but we just don't know. I think much more could be done to help manage expectations.
 
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On balance I think you make the better point but remember when you said 'wait for Gamescom'?

We (the community) lack the necessary information to establish whether the rate of development progress is good or bad. With the stated size of the dedicated ED team and the timescales we do know progress seems questionably slow. As you say, it may be justified but we just don't know. I think much more could be done to help manage expectations.
What? You don't realize who you're talking to??? StuartGT is one of the "Fabulous Fifteen" handpicked personalities to spread the word to us plebs that all was not only well in ED development land but positively crack-a-lackin! You and the rest of us don't need to manage our own expectations, we've got him to help do it for us:)
 
What? You don't realize who you're talking to??? StuartGT is one of the "Fabulous Fifteen" handpicked personalities to spread the word to us plebs that all was not only well in ED development land but positively crack-a-lackin! You and the rest of us don't need to manage our own expectations, we've got him to help do it for us:)
Your punditry does not move the conversation forward, StuartGT's generally does.
 
Or are you arguing that FDev can't change, despite dozens of forum users nagging for FDev to change? If FDev indeed cannot change, then why are those users nagging? :S
Maybe they can change but they haven't, we recently got a taste of how poorly they can release an update.
 
Ah, ok. Appealing to the authority figure, gotcha'.;)
It means that while I may agree or disagree with StuartGT's opinions I do respect their veracity, if not the style. If the topic were on ship loadouts or combat technique the situation might be different.
 
On balance I think you make the better point but remember when you said 'wait for Gamescom'?

We (the community) lack the necessary information to establish whether the rate of development progress is good or bad. With the stated size of the dedicated ED team and the timescales we do know progress seems questionably slow. As you say, it may be justified but we just don't know. I think much more could be done to help manage expectations.
Agreed, although I do like a good bet :D If anyone had bet me £10 on my Gamescom estimation, they would have won [noob]
 
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