Open Gun-ports = open for pvp : Pilots federations rule of the duel

The number of pmfs did increase. What about the number of concurrent players? Is there more people playing now than 4 years ago? The simple popping up of PMFs doesn't tell much about activity. As does assuming they are all active. It's not like everybody is like the heroic Communists who'd adopt and push any red faction and diligently destroy the unwholesome occurence of Imperial influence down to the root.
And then you have solo players who may or may not do any BGS work and rather opt out of MP shenanigans. It's not like each of them cheeses the system to be untouchable 5th coloscopist.
Its not the numbers that are the issue, its the agendas they have and the ever shrinking space they co-exist in. A single player can wreck a small system easily, and prolonged conflicts can get messy. Its very hard these days to not see more agenda driven play- for example in my time in Utopia I helped flip every system to favourable- thats going through about 500 systems and making sure each one is right. That massive area has to be policed and all PMFs and rando traffic kept in check.
 
  • When I play ED I play a nice pleasant cmdr.
  • I don't attack other strangers. I play "nice guy".
  • I switch between Open and Solo depending on certain activities and my frame of mind for the day.
  • I can kinda defend myself, but big picture I suck at combat.
  • I don't like being interdicted. NPC or other players.
  • I don't like gankers. I don't like getting surprise attacked. I don't like getting blown up.

BUT... without the big meanies, the gankers, the interdictions, and various unexpected things that I don't like... this game would suck. It is the fear of being attacked by someone better than me that makes me want to become a better player, get a better ship, learn to fly better, defend myself, avoid mischief, and able to fight back.

If there weren't NPC pirates and the constant fear of being attacked by other players better than me this game would be awful. Might as well play a Disney app. I am thankful for the big meanies out there. I hate them, they are villains. But they make the game worth playing.
Well NPC's are problem only for noobs and unarmed ships, otherwise well, they are just source for little light show on combat rank +mats...and yeah I suck at combat :D

Mostly I despise for the lulz ganks as they break my immersion. Pirate, bounty hunter, opponent at war or PP, fair game. Murderhobos nah...
 
Not a win-win. If I just got interdicted by pirate NPC in my Imperial Cutter trading ship with 25million buy-back plus trading mission cargo it is completely ridiculous to expect me to power down my ship when another commander arrives on the scene (and continue being shot at by NPCs), and doing otherwise suggests I actively want to engage in PvP -> kill on sight.

If an unexpected commander appears near me I assume they want to PvP and I take necessary actions/precautions. If they say something in chat my behaviour might change. But without knowing the other cmdr's intent, ship build, and skills, than their combat rank (which can be misleading) I'm not about to just give up, power down, and forfeit my ship and cargo. Thats ridiculous. For all I know its some noob kid flying around in his dad's Anaconda.

If your "unofficial rule" was arriving commanders should say "hello need help?" or "Arrrrg! Die Die Die!" that might go further towards a friendly galaxy than just assuming I want to engage a stranger in PvP.
Aye, but first you got get commander like myself and yourself break the Pattern of going in gun-blazing or boosting the heck out of there whenever we see and empty frame on our radar.
As that is what these jokers have done to us.
Totally paranoid.

I have fun chatting to folks in the station, but out in space I keep a wary eye out for other commanders.
And it’s said because online play means collaborative or antagonistic PvE and PvP and BGS gameplay with other commanders.

Griefing and pretending it’s pvp is a ,
And like Morpheus says In the matrix, “he’s starting to believe” in the humanity of other pilots in the pilots federation.

I was totally okay with some crazy thargoid supporting commander just laying waste to commanders trying to perform station rescues, as at least they used chat to indicate their presence and have warning of their intentions.
They didn’t just curb stomp you without warning, provocation for their amusement.

I’m not naive as to how games work online though. I’m 40
(Muffled) something now and I was 20 errr cant remember when LAN parties quake3,counter-strike, unreal tournament half life death match were all the rage.
So a bit of nostalgia - The lost sever where counter strike players are nice to each other.
Dear Concerned

just wait and check your radar to see if their weapon are deployed or not. I think we might be surprised to find there are more nicer players out there who also don’t Like hang around to make friends.
 
I have fun chatting to folks in the station, but out in space I keep a wary eye out for other commanders.
And it’s said because online play means collaborative or antagonistic PvE and PvP and BGS gameplay with other commanders.
I do that not only in the station. I don't remember how many times I have to loop around the station because I missed my exit chatting with somebody. Not knowing if somebody is hostile or not, or if I want to shoot them or just chat is the most fun part of the game. Tread everybody as hostile first and go from there. Even if we all belong to the same club we are not friends at first, quite the opposite actually. Remember it's a cutthroat galaxy, that's what Elites lore and marketing says, so act accordingly. In the end outlaws, pirates, murderhobos just play their part to make the cutthroat galaxy believable.
 
Manners aint gunna matter to some ganker. Fancy shmancy rules about opennin' gun ports will just annoy 'em. The only way to deal with a ganker is ter shoot at 'em. The only good ganker is a dead ganker. (by dead i mean looking at the rebuy screen. i'm not advocating violence against anyone irl).
 
Boffin, this seems to be a passionate subject for you. Sadly, what you're envisioning is a pipe dream. I'd implore you to drop this Quixotic crusade on the forum and reinvest your energy into promoting a PG where PvP is handled your way.
Well yeah I have to say that to me first outrightly hostile move is interdiction itself, there is no way I should power down ship after that, it is escape or fight.
 
Tell me what would I care to countermove when I visit your chosen system while looking for a transport mission. I just pick what I like. Maybe I pick the mission with the prettiest face. Maybe the mission offered by a Fed faction. Or the one that pays most. You simple don't know what I'll do and I don't care what you're trying to achieve. Because neither of us cares about each other.
If I'm doing my job right, BGS wise, then the odds are good that you'll either be working for the faction of my choice, or against the faction of my choice.
 
Indeed. It's like a random outcome.
It's not random, though. Individual Commanders may be unpredictable, but they're fairly predictable as a group. Far too many players are primarily interested in grinding credits and reputation, and if you manipulate a faction's state, then you also manipulate the types of missions they offer.

Before I headed out to deep space exploring post 3.3, I amused myself by either supporting the brave freedom fighters that resisted the Evil Galactic Federation, or helping to spread the true light of freedom, prosperity, and culture throughout Human space. I did it along the Hudson/ALD border to support my chosen power, since I don't enjoy combat farming or ABA cargo runs.

Despite only playing around three hours a week on average, my strategy was effective. I would see posts on DD about how a Federation hot spot would dry up, or that someone discovered a new Imperial Hotspot. More surprising to me was the change in state of the Hudson/ALD border, which I've been monitoring via Inara. Apparently, my little one-woman campaign against the Federation kept Hudson's BGS team busy stamping out the brushfires I'd ignite. Either that, or a lot of anti-Hudson/pro-ALD BGS players also decided to quit for greener pastures at the same time I did. 🤷‍♀️

edit:

It's also why I find posts from PvPers who believe they can "defend" a faction they support via PvP so amusing. "Defending" a controlling faction via PvP is functionally identical to attacking a controlling faction via PvP. If the attackers are in any way competent, then they're focusing as much on manipulating faction states as they are influence. The only way you can manipulate a faction's state is by working for them, which also gives them influence... in the short term.

Which is why I felt free to do my BGS work in Open. If I made it to my destination, then the faction I'm attacking gained a little short-term influence (easily mitigated by helping the faction(s) I'm supporting) at the cost of a long-term unfavorable faction state. If I got killed by a PvPer "defending" their faction, then the faction I'm attacking both loses influence, and moves closer to an unfavorable faction state. It's a heads I win, tails you lose worse scenario. :D
 
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It's not random, though. Individual Commanders may be unpredictable, but they're fairly predictable as a group. Far too many players are primarily interested in grinding credits and reputation, and if you manipulate a faction's state, then you also manipulate the types of missions they offer.

Before I headed out to deep space exploring post 3.3, I amused myself by either supporting the brave freedom fighters that resisted the Evil Galactic Federation, or helping to spread the true light of freedom, prosperity, and culture throughout Human space. I did it along the Hudson/ALD border to support my chosen power, since I don't enjoy combat farming or ABA cargo runs.

Despite only playing around three hours a week on average, my strategy was effective. I would see posts on DD about how a Federation hot spot would dry up, or that someone discovered a new Imperial Hotspot. More surprising to me was the change in state of the Hudson/ALD border, which I've been monitoring via Inara. Apparently, my little one-woman campaign against the Federation kept Hudson's BGS team busy stamping out the brushfires I'd ignite. Either that, or a lot of anti-Hudson/pro-ALD BGS players also decided to quit for greener pastures at the same time I did. 🤷‍♀️

edit:

It's also why I find posts from PvPers who believe they can "defend" a faction they support via PvP so amusing. "Defending" a controlling faction via PvP is functionally identical to attacking a controlling faction via PvP. If the attackers are in any way competent, then they're focusing as much on manipulating faction states as they are influence. The only way you can manipulate a faction's state is by working for them, which also gives them influence... in the short term.

Which is why I felt free to do my BGS work in Open. If I made it to my destination, then the faction I'm attacking gained a little short-term influence (easily mitigated by helping the faction(s) I'm supporting) at the cost of a long-term unfavorable faction state. If I got killed by a PvPer "defending" their faction, then the faction I'm attacking both loses influence, and moves closer to an unfavorable faction state. It's a heads I win, tails you lose worse scenario. :D
In general I think we see that people who say "I want to PvP you in Open because otherwise you're messing with my BGS while hiding in Solo" don't actually have a clue how the BGS works. There are a couple of notable knowledgeable exceptions in this forum, but for most PvP enthusiasts pushing this agenda, "BGS" is some kind of magic incantation which might get them the Open-only paradise they crave. The truth is that if I'm working against your chosen faction in whatever mode, blowing up my ship will hardly ever gain you long-term benefit. The only thing that can really tilt the scales is to get on with it and work for "your" faction.
 
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It's not random, though. Individual Commanders may be unpredictable, but they're fairly predictable as a group. Far too many players are primarily interested in grinding credits and reputation, and if you manipulate a faction's state, then you also manipulate the types of missions they offer.

Before I headed out to deep space exploring post 3.3, I amused myself by either supporting the brave freedom fighters that resisted the Evil Galactic Federation, or helping to spread the true light of freedom, prosperity, and culture throughout Human space. I did it along the Hudson/ALD border to support my chosen power, since I don't enjoy combat farming or ABA cargo runs.

Despite only playing around three hours a week on average, my strategy was effective. I would see posts on DD about how a Federation hot spot would dry up, or that someone discovered a new Imperial Hotspot. More surprising to me was the change in state of the Hudson/ALD border, which I've been monitoring via Inara. Apparently, my little one-woman campaign against the Federation kept Hudson's BGS team busy stamping out the brushfires I'd ignite. Either that, or a lot of anti-Hudson/pro-ALD BGS players also decided to quit for greener pastures at the same time I did. 🤷‍♀️

edit:

It's also why I find posts from PvPers who believe they can "defend" a faction they support via PvP so amusing. "Defending" a controlling faction via PvP is functionally identical attacking a controlling faction via PvP. If the attackers are in any way competent, then they're focusing as much on manipulating faction states as they are influence. The only way you can manipulate a faction's state is by working for them, which also gives them influence... in the short term.

Which is why I felt free to do my BGS work in Open. If I made it to my destination, then the faction I'm attacking gained a little short-term influence (easily mitigated by helping the faction(s) I'm supporting) at the cost of a long-term unfavorable faction state. If I got killed by a PvPer "defending" their faction, then the faction I'm attacking both loses influence, and moves closer to an unfavorable faction state. It's a heads I win, tails you lose worse scenario. :D
Yeah. Last October, before I embraced the YARR, there was one anarchy system within 50ly of where I was based. Now there are five, not including that one. Four of them were systems that were directly flipped by myself. The other one appears to be a new player group and I should head over and say hi sometime since I honestly thought I was the only active anarchist in the area.

Only one of the systems gave me any issue and it was the first one I started in, largely because I was new to it. I ran into people directly opposing me in CZs. I ran into people bounty-hunting against me and watched the daily bounty count drop from 200-300 to 30 after trashing a single anaconda. And like you said - attacking via PvP was a waste of time, since for all I know they could be running missions in another mode. I was on my way to the CZ, and saw the conda on the scanner, recognised it as one I'd seen flying around the system damaged before, watched it drop into the nav beacon, and followed them in. It was absolutely 100% opportunistic. Otherwise... the system doesn't get enough traffic in open to be worth patrolling. Sure, I might grab some harmless T6 (the majority of the people I see, let's be honest) but at the opportunity cost of literally everything else I could have been spending my time on.
 
In general I think we see that people who say "I want to PvP you in Open because otherwise you're messing with my BGS while hiding in Solo" don't actually have a clue how the BGS works.
Well, I agree, but I've never seen anyone saying something like that. What I see more often then not, is that people take ganking for PVP.

We work the BGS for our system in open, so others have a chance to keep us from doing that. Hasn't happened till now, but there's hope :)
 
Yeah. Last October, before I embraced the YARR, there was one anarchy system within 50ly of where I was based. Now there are five, not including that one. Four of them were systems that were directly flipped by myself. The other one appears to be a new player group and I should head over and say hi sometime since I honestly thought I was the only active anarchist in the area.

Only one of the systems gave me any issue and it was the first one I started in, largely because I was new to it. I ran into people directly opposing me in CZs. I ran into people bounty-hunting against me and watched the daily bounty count drop from 200-300 to 30 after trashing a single anaconda. And like you said - attacking via PvP was a waste of time, since for all I know they could be running missions in another mode. I was on my way to the CZ, and saw the conda on the scanner, recognised it as one I'd seen flying around the system damaged before, watched it drop into the nav beacon, and followed them in. It was absolutely 100% opportunistic. Otherwise... the system doesn't get enough traffic in open to be worth patrolling. Sure, I might grab some harmless T6 (the majority of the people I see, let's be honest) but at the opportunity cost of literally everything else I could have been spending my time on.
Being ready for opportunities is probably the ideal situation. Your BGS efforts are on point but you're ready to rock if required.

PvP can be effective too if you're at an extreme disadvantage or advantage. In the former you're wasting your time doing BGS while the latter you can afford to relax a little. It's a balancing act though.

Eyes on the prize, ultimately.
 
Well, I agree, but I've never seen anyone saying something like that. What I see more often then not, is that people take ganking for PVP.

We work the BGS for our system in open, so others have a chance to keep us from doing that. Hasn't happened till now, but there's hope :)
I don’t know. I feel like I see a new, “X is attacking our faction, and they’re doing it in solo, so we can’t defend our faction” thread every week.

All I can think of is, “You’re lucky they’re doing it in solo. If it was me, I’d be doing it in Open where I can trick you into doing my half my work for me.”
 
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