Operation Enigma, breaking the code!

[AnnuverScotinExile]

Do I trust my instincts and knowledge to disseminate the readily available evidence and draw a conclusion, or do I listen to the talking prune and reject reality?

OK, hand up who wants GluttonyFang to change his user name to 'The talking prune'? Now that would be a PR coup.

 

[JosiahD]

It's not good will. It's your own RP within an RP but that's a different convo.

Im just saying the best PR for code right now is silence.

I would argue that their best PR would be actions in-game that go some way to demonstrate that what we saw during the Hutton CG is not the norm for them moving forward. But similar to someone else's observation, we're some way off yet before people will accept that the forum PR and in-game behaviour match up.

 

[Vandaahl]

Do I trust my instincts and knowledge to disseminate the readily available evidence and draw a conclusion, or do I listen to the talking prune and reject reality?

If talking prunes are part of your reality, than your holding 2 apples. You'll need some medication to get rid of the talking prune btw.

 

[mossfoot]

I've pointed out how I've had positive PvP experiences with pirates, blockaders, and the CODE in the past, and my own personal displeasure about the Hutton situation.

The spin and PR was handled well, all told. GF, you have a career in politics ahead of you

But at the end of the day, the end result seems to be, if anything, polarizing. People who didn't trust the CODE before are even more mistrusting and those that supported them are even more supporting. Maybe a few fence sitters chose a side. I doubt many already on one side switched.

Really what should be taken away from this isn't about what DID happen, but what WILL happen in the future.

The proof of the pudding is in the eating, as they say. CODE and its reps talk a good talk, all that's left is to see its effect in game. If another Hutton Orbital type situation happens down the road, you can be sure people will bring this back up, as well as the PR that went into trying to repair relations... which will basically mean nobody will believe what's said next time (not that many seem to THIS time, but that's another issue ).

I for one hope the CODE sticks by the ethics they espouse and sticks to in-game reasons for their actions and not exploit game mechanics unfairly. I enjoy seeing organized piracy and blockades existing in the game (and especially organized opposition to said things) and want to see it in a way that works for everyone.

 

[Windscreen Smudge]

I would argue that their best PR would be actions in-game that go some way to demonstrate that what we saw during the Hutton CG is not the norm for them moving forward. But similar to someone else's observation, we're some way off yet before people will accept that the forum PR and in-game behaviour match up.

And if you do see something along those lines it won't mean a thing, because our pal GF here may have the sincere belief and intention of Code in ED being something different and separate from C.O.D.E. in EvE. However infiltration, manipulation and subversion are all common practice in EvE and it is quite possible that GluttonyFang is just a figurehead being used by Code's members to reduce suspicion, while they do as they please and lead the group in the direction they wish it to go.

 

[EUS]

As an update, we currently have a super majority on outlawing mode invasion completely. This is defined as gaining trust of a group in the group mode and intentionally doing so only to enter and break the stipulated rules of said group. It is an immediate termination if we catch our members committing said act.

As a side note, some of our members wish to express that they are agreeing to the matter with hope that Mobius will only undermine our future minor faction in Open. I personally prefer that this is realized, as well. However, due to the inability to enforce such a promise, we hope to see some expression of good will from Mobius, at the very least.

Good luck with that since the only rule for Mobius' members is to not PvP unless in a CZ.
"There are no leaders in this group and you will never be told how to play or that you should be doing something for the greater good of the group."
That's why it's so popular with so many. Freedom.
But you knew this already.

 

[nexxo]

The spin and PR was handled well, all told. GF, you have a career in politics ahead of you

Actually he made all the mistakes in the book. So yes, he does have a career in politics ahead of him.

 

[OnePercent]

Yeah sure i'll join in for fun

 

[bitstorm]

As a side note, some of our members wish to express that they are agreeing to the matter with hope that Mobius will only undermine our future minor faction in Open. I personally prefer that this is realized, as well. However, due to the inability to enforce such a promise, we hope to see some expression of good will from Mobius, at the very least.

It's an interesting thought, Mobius being PvE, are player factions considered E or P?

But even so how could this even be enforced inside Mobius? And even if it could be enforced, any players wanting to do so will just drop to their own group or solo making it actually completely irrelevant what you do or don't ask Mobius to do.

And as such, being realistic about the whole situation, the only reason I can actually see for asking Mobius to agree to such rules is as way to "hold something over" the Mobius group, or certain players within, and allowing a justification for CODE killing players in Mobius somewhere down the line should you feel a player is undermining the CODE faction inside Mobius.

And that, to be honest, really isn't on. So realistically, if Mr/Mrs. Mobius has any sense I think they should tell you to stuff it.

 

[Jesters09]

So, it is fine for code to exploit weaknesses in game design, like camping on a landing pad, lack of police response, ramming. But please don't exploit the ability to under-mind code in group or solo mode. LOL Now I can't wait for minor powers to come out, I have a new goal.

You and me both ;-)

 

[GluttonyFang]

Principle of equivalence. If you can't distinguish the 2, they are the same thing. Related or not.

I can apply that concept to a lot of things. Racial differences in the end share equivalence in being human, yet they are free agents and mostly choose to do different things.

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That doesn't matter. In PR it's all about what the public thinks, not what you think. You have to meet the public where they are, and then gradually move them to where you want them to meet you. You acknowledge their views to demonstrate you've listened, make amends where possible and when everybody feels in a cooperative mood again then you make your requests. You're quite some time away from that moment yet.

I think I excelled more than quite a lot of official PR from gaming companies myself for running as a representative for an unofficial player group, while I do wish to improve my PR skills, I think currently what is important isn't my PR skill but the issue we are discussing at hand. Please refrain from further comments that tell me how to do my "job" (not even a job since I'm not getting paid) and provide relevant feedback instead. I appreciate your time spent on telling me how to function as a PR representative, but I think you have spent more time on that than actually providing constructive feedback on the situation about Hutton.

 

[Nonya]

Good luck with that since the only rule for Mobius' members is to not PvP unless in a CZ.
"There are no leaders in this group and you will never be told how to play or that you should be doing something for the greater good of the group."
That's why it's so popular with so many. Freedom.
But you knew this already.

Wait - so you mean it's perfectly fine to kill Mobius players provided you're in a CZ and you've selected the other "team" to fight on?

"Newsteam! Assemble!"

 

[GluttonyFang]

In my left hand I hold something roundish, red and firm. Inside the meat is white, the seeds at the core are dark brown and the overall contents are sweet and crispy that produces a delightful wet crunch when bitten into. Prior experience tells me this is an Apple.

In my right hand I hold something roundish, red and firm. Inside the meat is white, the seeds at the core are dark brown and the overall contents are sweet and crispy that produces a delightful wet crunch when bitten into. However when I declare that the item in my right hand is an Apple it pipes up: "No no! I'm not an apple, I swear I'm a prune!"

Do I trust my instincts and knowledge to disseminate the readily available evidence and draw a conclusion, or do I listen to the talking prune and reject reality?

Please read about uniformitarianism and its criticisms and the problem with ampliative inference, Cartwright anti-fundamentalism views might also help you to realize how that argument can be flawed.

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Actually he made all the mistakes in the book. So yes, he does have a career in politics ahead of him.

Please be aware of your diction.

"Mistakes in your books."

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It's an interesting thought, Mobius being PvE, are player factions considered E or P?

But even so how could this even be enforced inside Mobius? And even if it could be enforced, any players wanting to do so will just drop to their own group or solo making it actually completely irrelevant what you do or don't ask Mobius to do.

And as such, being realistic about the whole situation, the only reason I can actually see for asking Mobius to agree to such rules is as way to "hold something over" the Mobius group, or certain players within, and allowing a justification for CODE killing players in Mobius somewhere down the line should you feel a player is undermining the CODE faction inside Mobius.

And that, to be honest, really isn't on. So realistically, if Mr.Mrs. Mobius has any sense I think they should tell you to take a hike.

Please refrain from speculating on the matter, we have outlawed mode invasion independently from the request of members hoping for a general expression of goodwill from Mobius and its affiliated players.

 

[Unfluffydave]

Think about it, if we really wanted to avoid association with the C.O.D.E. from EvE, we would just use a different name in disguise. We don't, because we know we are not related to the C.O.D.E. in EvE and another our representative, S7 just recently clarified the issue, as well.

You may speculate however you wish, that is your personal freedom, so forgive me if I find this conversation becoming unfruitful and that I find no interest nor productivity in continuing this particular conversation.

If you want to be disassociated with CODE in EvE then why take their name and act like them in ED? Whether by accident or design you are walking, talking and sounding like them and you know what they say about a particular water fowl in that situation.

 

[GluttonyFang]

If you want to be disassociated with CODE in EvE then why take their name and act like them in ED? Whether by accident or design you are walking, talking and sounding like them and you know what they say about a particular water fowl in that situation.

We were not aware that the name Code is also used by players in EvE.

We act far differently than the C.O.D.E. in EvE. We do not launch suicide squads to kill off players and attempt real life extortion nor endorse grieving. We do not sound like them, either, since I don't believe my behavior (representing The Code) on the forum have resembled anything like theirs.

 

[Unfluffydave]

Please refrain from speculating on the matter, we have outlawed mode invasion independently from the request of members hoping for a general expression of goodwill from Mobius and its affiliated players.

So, you told your people to stop being chevos and expect something in return from Mobius?

 

[bitstorm]

the only reason I can actually see for asking Mobius to agree to such rules is as way to "hold something over" the Mobius group, or certain players within, and allowing a justification for CODE killing players in Mobius somewhere down the line should you feel a player is undermining the CODE faction inside Mobius.

Please refrain from speculating on the matter, we have outlawed mode invasion independently from the request of members hoping for a general expression of goodwill from Mobius and its affiliated players.

I'm sorry but it's hard not to speculate, because this talk of Code wanting "goodwill" from Mobius is ultimately pointless. Which would mean either it's not been thought through or there's some other motive, ie the one quoted above.

What's more I'm struggling to see why you're labouring the Mobius thing. The only issue has been a few Code players jumping into Mobius and killing players last month, those players were kicked from Mobius and that presumably is past. Painting some picture of Mobius vs Code isn't really gonna help things.

 

[Windscreen Smudge]

Please read about uniformitarianism and its criticisms and the problem with ampliative inference, Cartwright anti-fundamentalism views might also help you to realize how that argument can be flawed.

Lol, sure, if I wanted to have a philosophical debate behind a podium that would be applicable.

 

[GluttonyFang]

I'm sorry but it's hard not to speculate, because this talk of Code wanting "goodwill" from Mobius is ultimately pointless. Which would mean either it's not been thought through or there's some other motive, ie the one quoted above.

What's more I'm struggling to see why you're labouring the Mobius thing. The only issue has been a few Code players jumping into Mobius and killing players last month, those players were kicked from Mobius and that presumably is past. Painting some picture of Mobius vs Code isn't particularly constructive for either "side".

I have been discussing the issue by the request of a Mobius member reaching out to me about it. I won't deny that there's tension between the two groups, which is why I seek to address the tension.

The "invasion" occurred much much earlier on, definitely out of the range of "last month."

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Lol, sure, if I wanted to have a philosophical debate behind a podium that would be applicable.

I am merely pointing out the flaw in your argument.

 

[Windscreen Smudge]

We were not aware that the name Code is also used by players in EvE.

We act far differently than the C.O.D.E. in EvE. We do not launch suicide squads to kill off players and attempt real life extortion nor endorse grieving. We do not sound like them, either, since I don't believe my behavior (representing The Code) on the forum have resembled anything like theirs.

YOU, personally, were not aware when you created a thread in the player groups forum to start up a pirate group. Many of your members are clearly, painfully aware of the other group's existence.

Suicide squads are used in EvE because it is a legitimate tactic for what they do, not because of some malignant purpose. No one has been extorted in Real Life through EvE Online without immediately facing criminal charges, CCP actively and fervently hunts down extortionists on their own and presses their own charges, with or without the player's direct complaint. They track all of the financial side of EvE online down to the last hundredth of an isk and link it to every real person.

CCP does not, under any circumstances, tolerate any intrusion of in-game activities on a person's real life. They get deadly serious about that crap and punish anyone who commits such acts to the fullest extent of the law in whatever country they live.