Let’s face it. The hyena is one of the most plain, generic, and boring animals in Planet Zoo, but it really shouldn’t be. In real life, hyenas are highly intelligent and complex animals. I think these things could help to make the spotted hyenas much more realistic and overall a more interesting animal:

1. New Animations:
Right now, it seems that the spotted hyena just uses wolf animations. The problem with this is that due to their anatomy, hyenas locomote very differently from wolves in real life. Here are some references for the animation team to look at if a community manager or dev ever sees this:
Source: https://youtu.be/ptGw9F4wVgM

Source: https://youtu.be/5pVrF6coROs

Also, hyena cubs don’t wag their tails like little puppies...

2.Emotes/Playing Animations:
The hyena has none of these right now, which is a shame as they do quite a few things in real life. As far as emotes go, submissive hyenas in a clan will bow their heads and flatten their ears around dominant individuals in greeting ceremonies, which also are not in the game. In greeting ceremonies, hyenas go up to each other, lift their legs, and sniff each other. This is their way of telling who’s who in the clan.
Source: https://youtu.be/ftNXBfTGCeo

Submissive hyenas will also crouch in the presence of a more dominant hyena
Source: https://youtu.be/S6T752_EXno

As far as playing animations goes, it mostly applies to cubs which are usually born single in the game for some reason. Usually hyenas have twins or triplets, not just one cub, so maybe fix that too. Adults could also do a back scratching animation, as previously mentioned:
Source: https://youtu.be/eC2OBZMIJY4


3. Fixing the fake science:
Don’t fall for that God damn MinuteEarth crap about female hyenas always being bigger and more dominant than males. Spotted hyenas aren’t sexually dimorphic at all, and their rank in the clan just depends on who their female relatives are as females pass down the ranks and not males. The only reason male hyenas are sometimes lower ranked than females is because they leave often their birth clans in the wild. If you want more info, follow the Hyena Project. They’ve been studying hyenas for over two decades.

4. Clan Size Expansion and realistic Hierarchy:
As previously mentioned, female hyenas should pass down the ranks to their offspring and hyenas have complex social dynamics. The clan size should be increased because in the wild, there can be up to 80 hyenas. Also, in captivity in places such as Kevin Richardson’s reserve, there can be plenty more than just 2-5 hyenas in a group is they grow up together and get along well.

5. Coat color variations:
Spotted hyenas come in a variety of shades of brown and tan, and it’s weird to only see a single color variant in the game. This issue isn’t exclusive to hyenas, but spotted hyenas are one of the animals that suffers the most from the lack of variation due to them varying so greatly in real life.

6. The model and texture:
If you’ve seen a hyena in a zoo in real life, you’d know they aren’t as skinny and weak looking as frontier’s model. It’s too thin, the face is okay but definitely could be improved, the texture needs more realism and variation on different parts of the body like a real hyena, so on and so forth. Don’t get me wrong, it’s a nice model, just not as accurate as some other games such as Afrika (PS3). The reason I bring this up is because Frontier promised “the most realistic animals of any game ever” in pre-launch advertising campaigns.

7.Habitat space requirement:
Hyenas shouldn't require more space than lions and tigers. An exhibit that can support 4-5 lions should be able to support 5-7 spotted hyenas.

That’s about all I have to say, if I think of anything later I’ll just post it in the reply section. This isn’t meant to offend frontier or anything, just to make the hyena a more interesting and accurate animal in the game so players don’t get bored watching over their hyenas, which is easy even for me right now. It just feels like Frontier had a missed opportunity. Such a complex and intelligent animal included in the game didn’t have any of the things that makes them complex and interesting in real life.
 
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From what i saw this doenst only apply to hyenas.

The animals have no identity and all have a lack of interactions (with animals, objects, or just rolling around) and they all do the same: walk a bit, sleep, eat, walk, sleep etc. Very rare is a thing of interaction between animals, especially between baby/parents...

This should all be way more and also more diverse in stead of "4 cubs who do exactly the same things (for minutes....) on the almost excact same time :/
 
Yes, please Frontier do finally fix the Group Size 😒 and add the Pack-System you've created for the Wolves and Wild dogs, so they don't try to kill each other every 5 Minutes 🤦🏻‍♂️
I do absolutely love the Hyenas (but of course it would be great if they would behave more realistic) but I didn't use them since a very long time because of the unrealistic Social Behavior.
I'm tired of seeing completely wrong Group Sizes in the Game even though I've made a List once which Animals need to be fixed because the Social Behavior is slightly or even like in this Case completely wrong
 
From what i saw this doenst only apply to hyenas.

The animals have no identity and all have a lack of interactions (with animals, objects, or just rolling around) and they all do the same: walk a bit, sleep, eat, walk, sleep etc. Very rare is a thing of interaction between animals, especially between baby/parents...

This should all be way more and also more diverse in stead of "4 cubs who do exactly the same things (for minutes....) on the almost excact same time :/
True, but at least the wolves and wild dogs have play animations and stuff. The hyena has nothing. Also, I know more about hyenas than any other animal so I only suggested stuff for them since I know it’s safe to do so.
 
Yes, please Frontier do finally fix the Group Size 😒 and add the Pack-System you've created for the Wolves and Wild dogs, so they don't try to kill each other every 5 Minutes 🤦🏻‍♂️
I do absolutely love the Hyenas (but of course it would be great if they would behave more realistic) but I didn't use them since a very long time because of the unrealistic Social Behavior.
I'm tired of seeing completely wrong Group Sizes in the Game even though I've made a List once which Animals need to be fixed because the Social Behavior is slightly or even like in this Case completely wrong
The hyena would need its own grouping system. As previously mentioned, their social dynamics are nothing like that of Caniforms.
 
There are indeed several animals that do need polishing with animations so they don't resemble other animals. Since you mentioned hyenas already, I'd like to name several others:
  • Orangutans shouldn't resemble gorillas as much when moving.
  • Jaguar sprint should resemble lions and tigers more so than cheetahs.
  • Adult gharials shouldn't be able to lift their bodies off the ground, but belly slide instead.
 
I agree with everything except for the animations part. Don't misunderstand me, I want proper animations for hyenas.

All antelopes use the same animations, although it's evident that they do not move in the same way in real life. You can even see how the shoulders, legs and back are constantly broken, and that bothers me a lot. Same way with the rest of the animals. All felines with the same animations, reptiles, primates...

The problem with this is, if they make proper animations for all the animals, that will take time, money, and in the DLCs will be less stuff.

I really want this to happen, but sadly, it won't happen.
 
I agree with everything except for the animations part. Don't misunderstand me, I want proper animations for hyenas.

All antelopes use the same animations, although it's evident that they do not move in the same way in real life. You can even see how the shoulders, legs and back are constantly broken, and that bothers me a lot. Same way with the rest of the animals. All felines with the same animations, reptiles, primates...

The problem with this is, if they make proper animations for all the animals, that will take time, money, and in the DLCs will be less stuff.

I really want this to happen, but sadly, it won't happen.
It doesn't cost money to make an animation once you have the software downloaded, what are you talking about? Lol. Also, I've animated 3D models myself and locomotion is quite simple once you get the hang of it. It only takes 45-60 minutes to do an accurate walk or run cycle for me, not counting the smoothing out. The animations are pretty much what ruins most of the animals in the game. I only mentioned the hyena because it's one of the most obvious ones. I also mentioned the cape buffalo and all the antelopes in general in a different post. Another thing, frontier's team has over 500 people. If more than 15 of them are animators, I'm pretty sure that means they have enough people to animate the DLC animals and fix up the current animals. Also, they brought this upon themselves by saying every animal will have "its own rig and animation set" in pre-launch dev logs and whatnot, so they definitely do need to get it together and fix their lies. Worst of all, THE DIRECTOR HIMSELF SAID IT!!!
Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cfqji4WnX9o
 
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It doesn't cost money to make an animation once you have the software downloaded, what are you talking about? Lol. Also, I've animated 3D models myself and locomotion is quite simple once you get the hang of it. It only takes 45-60 minutes to do an accurate walk or run cycle for me, not counting the smoothing out. The animations are pretty much what ruins most of the animals in the game. I only mentioned the hyena because it's one of the most obvious ones. I also mentioned the cape buffalo and all the antelopes in general in a different post. Another thing, frontier's team has over 500 people. If more than 15 of them are animators, I'm pretty sure that means they have enough people to animate the DLC animals and fix up the current animals. Also, they brought this upon themselves by saying every animal will have "its own rig and animation set" in pre-launch dev logs and whatnot, so they definitely do need to get it together and fix their lies. Worst of all, THE DIRECTOR HIMSELF SAID IT!!!
Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cfqji4WnX9o
Yeah, right... My bad, sorry lol

And for the rest, great truth. I don't know why there aren't more people complaining about this.
 
@Doctor Hyena or any other programmer out there. Does it take more computing power for the game to run unique animations for every animal, then to rerun the same code over and over applied to different animals? i.e. is the code recycling just being expedient (or lazy) or is there an actual game optimization reason for this design choice?
 
@Doctor Hyena or any other programmer out there. Does it take more computing power for the game to run unique animations for every animal, then to rerun the same code over and over applied to different animals? i.e. is the code recycling just being expedient (or lazy) or is there an actual game optimization reason for this design choice?
Animations are animations, so regardless of which one it's playing it's still running simultaneously with possibly hundreds or thousands of other objects in the scene (objects being animals, guests, etc.).

Unless the cobra engine runs differently (it's an in-house engine, so how it works is a mystery), then every object in a scene is it's own, well, object. So each lion is it's own lion, not a projection of some hidden parent lion.

Also, in relation to cost, it's not that animating itself costs money. The people doing the animating is what costs money. That may be included in their salary, it might not be, I have no idea since I'm not an employee there. However, Frontier has expressed that they are not keen on adding new rigs:

Thanks for your feedback all. RabidOkapi does a great job touching on why this won't be happening, but I'll explain further. Adding in more stages of growth means the team will need to create more skeletons/rigs, meaning more animations, animal models, audio and more. It's simply not viable for us to do this post-launch, not just because of the cost and time it would take, but also for technical reasons and the effect it would have on players' games.
 
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@Doctor Hyena or any other programmer out there. Does it take more computing power for the game to run unique animations for every animal, then to rerun the same code over and over applied to different animals? i.e. is the code recycling just being expedient (or lazy) or is there an actual game optimization reason for this design choice?
I’m not a programmer tuts, just a modeller, texture, and animator.
 
Animations are animations, so regardless of which one it's playing it's still running simultaneously with possibly hundreds or thousands of other objects in the scene (objects being animals, guests, etc.).

Unless the cobra engine runs differently (it's an in-house engine, so how it works is a mystery), then every object in a scene is it's own, well, object. So each lion is it's own lion, not a projection of some hidden parent lion.

Also, in relation to cost, it's not that animating itself costs money. The people doing the animating is what costs money. That may be included in their salary, it might not be, I have no idea since I'm not an employee there. However, Frontier has expressed that they are not keen on adding new rigs:
Well that sucks. However, they didn’t say that they couldn’t replace current animations, which as I said as a 3D animator, it is very easy after you learn to do it. Also, this is all their fault, the director lied to us. He said every animal will have its own rig and animation set, and that was a big, horrible lie. I’m upset that they didn’t stick to their word. And worse, that was the director of the game! I don’t expect every animal to have its own animation set but I at least expect the hyenas, small antelopes, and okapis to have their own anims. Maybe they’ll be able to do that stuff after the major cash grab DLCs are out.
Source: https://youtu.be/Cfqji4WnX9o
 
@Doctor Hyena or any other programmer out there. Does it take more computing power for the game to run unique animations for every animal, then to rerun the same code over and over applied to different animals? i.e. is the code recycling just being expedient (or lazy) or is there an actual game optimization reason for this design choice?

Alright, developer speaking here. Although my current field is Angular/Frontend development, I've got my experience with modding zoo games and game development (Unity).

Of course it's a part of game optimization and it's not lazy at all. Shared rigs do come with the cost of not having all animals being 100% accurate yes, but there are benefits to it. Not having to load in a hundreds of slightly different animations is a massive memory save and lets face it, it's also a reasonable thing to do from an expense perspective. What Frontier has done is most certainly a combination shared rigs tweaked to each model, and a mix of shared anims and unique anims ( the Jaguar being a prime example of that), which is in my eyes the best way to approach this, given the vast amount of animals there are in the world.

As for code, which is far more my area of expertise; of course there is shared code between animals. It would be incredibly inefficient to code shared behaviors like feeding, drinking, sleeping, etc. over and over again instead of making it a shared behavior base. Even ZT2 did that back in the day, and that's perfectly normal. Good programmers write re-usable code. Otherwise you end up with tons and tons of code that should do exactly the same, but might not because someone might have messed it up somewhere or interpreted the specs slightly differently. That makes it incredibly easy to write inconsistent behavior and bugs, and makes it unbelievably hard to debug and fix issues. I'd much rather work in a project that efficiently re-uses code by writing it in such a way, than a project that does not do that. I'd charge twice the amount of a regular project if I had to, just because of how frustrating the development process is.

Whether people agree with these decisions or not is up to you; but from a developer perspective these are perfectly sound decisions, and you'll have a hard time finding developers who will disagree with that.
 
Alright, developer speaking here. Although my current field is Angular/Frontend development, I've got my experience with modding zoo games and game development (Unity).

Of course it's a part of game optimization and it's not lazy at all. Shared rigs do come with the cost of not having all animals being 100% accurate yes, but there are benefits to it. Not having to load in a hundreds of slightly different animations is a massive memory save and lets face it, it's also a reasonable thing to do from an expense perspective. What Frontier has done is most certainly a combination shared rigs tweaked to each model, and a mix of shared anims and unique anims ( the Jaguar being a prime example of that), which is in my eyes the best way to approach this, given the vast amount of animals there are in the world.

As for code, which is far more my area of expertise; of course there is shared code between animals. It would be incredibly inefficient to code shared behaviors like feeding, drinking, sleeping, etc. over and over again instead of making it a shared behavior base. Even ZT2 did that back in the day, and that's perfectly normal. Good programmers write re-usable code. Otherwise you end up with tons and tons of code that should do exactly the same, but might not because someone might have messed it up somewhere or interpreted the specs slightly differently. That makes it incredibly easy to write inconsistent behavior and bugs, and makes it unbelievably hard to debug and fix issues. I'd much rather work in a project that efficiently re-uses code by writing it in such a way, than a project that does not do that. I'd charge twice the amount of a regular project if I had to, just because of how frustrating the development process is.

Whether people agree with these decisions or not is up to you; but from a developer perspective these are perfectly sound decisions, and you'll have a hard time finding developers who will disagree with that.
Like I said, I'm only upset because they lied to us by promising unique animation sets for every species and we just got a bunch of shared and canned animations. Also, I'm a developer and I disagree with sharing animations for such differently built animals (lion and cheetah, wolf and hyena, gazelle and sable, okapi and horse). There's also some other developers that know me that disagree with any shared animations at all. Also "slightly different", bruh I said the animals with obvious differences.
 
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It doesn't cost money to make an animation once you have the software downloaded, what are you talking about? Lol. Also, I've animated 3D models myself and locomotion is quite simple once you get the hang of it. It only takes 45-60 minutes to do an accurate walk or run cycle for me, not counting the smoothing out. The animations are pretty much what ruins most of the animals in the game. I only mentioned the hyena because it's one of the most obvious ones. I also mentioned the cape buffalo and all the antelopes in general in a different post. Another thing, frontier's team has over 500 people. If more than 15 of them are animators, I'm pretty sure that means they have enough people to animate the DLC animals and fix up the current animals. Also, they brought this upon themselves by saying every animal will have "its own rig and animation set" in pre-launch dev logs and whatnot, so they definitely do need to get it together and fix their lies. Worst of all, THE DIRECTOR HIMSELF SAID IT!!!
Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cfqji4WnX9o
Uh, hello, professional animator here. It absolutely does cost money to make more animations in a professional setting beyond the cost of the software. I think you're forgetting something very important here: time. The time an animator spends making that new animation, and making sure it hooks up with other animations properly, is not free.
And a well done quadruped locomotion cycle, even if it's just a vanilla walk, certainly takes more than 45-60 minutes. Not counting the time spent researching the correct gaits of the animals in question (it's not always easy to find good references for a specific animal at a framerate you can use, with a clear view of what is going on) it's going to take at least a few hours to get that cycle completely polished. This assuming you have free reign of the work and are not expected to start with keyframes, run those by the art director, go to breakdowns, show those to the art director, go to inbetweens, again show those to the art director, and final polish. And all of this again, making sure the cycles work with the other animations they need to hook up with.
And as for fixing existing animations; if it's going to be a big change, that means it's not just 'fixing a run cycle', it's fixing that cycle, and any other animations that connect to that cycle, since the poses are now all changed.
I don't think you understand how tedious and time consuming this can be on a professional level.
And don't get me started on rigging.
 
I’m not a programmer tuts

That's super creepy.

--

Anyway, I agree with the spirit of the thread that in a perfect world every animal would have been designed and animated independently but I also hear loud and clear what @Iben is saying regarding what can be reasonably expected. IMO the biggest issue to be addressed with the hyenas is their group sizes and hierarchy, but beyond that I think they're fine. Sure, I recognise that they aren't perfect, but they're not terrible either.
 
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