A peasant, a discerning commander fits a monster tech chair! 
Pay2Win made it to Elite
- Thread starter Einar Donarsson
- Start date
I have a call centre chair, I like my comforts!A peasant, a discerning commander fits a monster tech chair!
My point is: Just because you are clever enough not to fall for such a strategy, doesn’t make that strategy any less predatory. Nor does the fact that Elon Musk exists make Chris Roberts any more virtuous.
You're free to do whatever you want, of course, but that doesn't mean that everyone should behave like Cowslip. Some of us prefer to keep our wits about us, and sound the alarm when we begin to notice the silver wires.
You aren't better or worse then anyone else becaue YOU choose not to buy something. Implying that others are somehow clueless for making an informed decision about how they spend the money they earn is disingenous at best. It's a space flight simulator on PC ... not a sinister plot by Frontier to be our financial puppet masters ... keep it in perspective.
I'm definitely guilty of that, and I have no doubt what-so-ever that the money I've spent on my computer gives me an advantage in Elite Dangerous: AKA Pay-to-Win. The difference is that all this equipment gives me an advantage across many games, both single-player and multi-player, rather than a single game. This has always been in case in PC video gaming. Those with money to spend on equipment will always have an advantage over those who don't.
Those who could afford a good computer had an advantage over those who bought budget computers. Those who could afford fiber optic held an advantage over those with dial-up. Those who could afford good peripherials held an advantage over those who relied on the OEM ones.
What's become a worrying trend in video gaming is that the video-game developers themselves have decided they need a cut of that money. As a result, more and more developers are designing their games to extract a lot of money from the few players succeptable to videogame addiction, rather than making a great game which a lot of players are willing to buy for a small amount of money.
Sorry man. That was supposed to be part of the comedy section of that post. So, if that wasn't clear, I guess that's on me. Lesson learned.
And that fills up my bingo card. The same one I've used with EA, Blizzard, and Crowd Imperium fans.
... or maybe just adults
A Secret labs chair has only ever seemed to me like a "pay to win an empty bank account" style macrotransaction to me. And trust, I have plenty of those tempting me in other IRL areas. Are they actually supposed to be any good?
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The Kickstarter benefits were starting options, that only gave you a slight step up. An Imperial Eagle, which is not much advantage at all or one of 3 configs of Cobra, which are slightly more advantageous but not by much, especially in the days when the credit curve was more exponential than tangential. Now you'd just blow straight past those ships to get your Anaconda. The Cobra options are also a nod to the original game players only having a Cobra.
I'd be happy to have those on sale for Arx, as regular ships requiring full rebuy. Not quite the same as g5 dirty drag ships with 0 rebuy. Or a python that's clearly designed to match the best combat ships now, that can be fully engineered with 0 rebuy
You still can't have the CM4 though, that wasn't a starting option.
I'd be happy to have those on sale for Arx, as regular ships requiring full rebuy. Not quite the same as g5 dirty drag ships with 0 rebuy. Or a python that's clearly designed to match the best combat ships now, that can be fully engineered with 0 rebuy
You still can't have the CM4 though, that wasn't a starting option.
I'd settle for a CM5You still can't have the CM4 though, that wasn't a starting option.
It wasn't. That was a mistake.
Past mistakes should not excuse future ones.
The difference here, as I've pointed out multiple times, is that Frontier has no control over things like what hardware players use to interface with the game, nor how much free time they have to play. These things may indeed unbalance a game (though, to Frontier's credit, they balanced the possible control devices quite well), but they are beyond Frontier's purview.
The pay-to-win aspects that Frontier has complete control over include contextuality of assets our CMDRs have access to, and this is what they've chosen to monetize.
It's not pay to win ... it's pay to play ... and it affects your game experience not one iota other then a perceived change to the contextuality in which you particpate.
It was a great decision by Frontier.
The practice of exchanging real-world currency for an in-game benefit is pay-to-win, that's literally the definition of P2W in computer gaming. It does not matter if that benefit is temporary or permanent, whether the advantage it gives is decisive or relatively irrelevant, or anything like that.
Whether the practice of selling pre-built ships in ED is P2W or not is not a matter of opinion. It simply is, by definition.
Now that is a matter of opinion. Everybody is free to decide if they are okay with this level of P2W or not.
Er no ... It is simply early access.
You're one of those "I have alternative facts!" people huh?
Early access to that ship is a benefit (advantage) you can buy for real money, therefore it fits the definition of P2W perfectly.
I have no idea what this is a reference to, but have no doubt it is along the same avenue of your existing debate that others are lacking moral fortitude.
Once again, an individual may decide that something is distasteful, or morally dubious, or whatever excuse they opt to use to not carry out an action, this is allegedly the human condition.
In this discussion, too often, is a slur put on those who may act as they so desire, suggesting that they are lacking in the ability to act responsibility and need care, or perhaps something more ominous.
maybe...... or maybe just adults
The crux of the matter is determining if there was a mistake made initially, surely?
No matter how this particular morsel is approached, it will be opinion, rather than solid fact, that determines it.
Again, the same perspective on future mistakes, that is going to be biased by personal perception.
It can be called whatever one wishes... Humans have a wonderful ability to package something in emotive language when they disagree with it.
The curious thing, is that, apparently, a reasonable number of people, couldn't give a flying fig about whatever the 'definition' of an action is, they have been spending their money and 'winning'
Stick by your principles and only part with your money for something you consider righteous, you shall have a glorious afterlife!
Also two free permits (Sol and Shinrarta) which would have taken a while to obtain by other routes especially at the time, and (for many) a permanent 25% or (for a few) 50% rebuy discount on every single ship.
I doubt there'd be a generally positive reaction for "Shinrarta Permit: 8000 ARX" or "25% rebuy discount: 20,000 ARX" nowadays (trying to match the ARX pricing roughly to the incremental KS pricing), even though they are in the modern game relatively trivial advantages easy to obtain (or replicate the effect of, at least) by other routes.
Three months early access to a ship, a more specific rebuy discount, and an extremely constrained ability to obtain new ship hulls in situations you wouldn't otherwise is considerably less powerful than some of that, I would say.
(And of course "you can engineer your ship" from Horizons beats all of those by an absolutely massive margin)