“i saw some negative comments” leading to “no one gets to use camels” seems like an absurd overcorrection
Planet Zoo 2 Speculation and ideas
- Thread starter yoav_r
- Start date
Ok here's a list for now just for fun (leaving out flying birds and fully aquatics just for this):
- Indian Peafowl
- European Fallow Deer
- Emu
- Meerkat
- Ring-Tailed Lemur
- Red-Necked Wallaby
- Golden Pheasant (New Species 1)
- African Spurred Tortoise
- Raccoon
- Nile Monitor
- Mandarin Duck (New Species 2)
- Greater Rhea (New Species 3)
- Common Ostrich
- West African Lion
- Bactrian Camel
- White Stork (New Species 4)
- South American Coati (New Species 5)
- Patagonian Mara (New Species 6)
- Capybara
- Asian Small-Clawed Otter
- American Alligator
- Wild Boar
- Scarlet Ibis (New Species 7)
- Mute Swan
- Puma
- Serval (New Species 8)
- Siberian Tiger
- Red Deer
- Black-and-White Ruffed Lemur
- Greater Flamingo
- Plains Zebra
- African Crested Porcupine
- Black-Tailed Prairie Dog
- Dromedary Camel
- Jaguar
- Red Panda
- Colombian White-Faced Capuchin
- Cheetah
- Guianan Squirrel Monkey (New Species 9)
- Timber Wolf
- Great White Pelican (New Species 10)
- Striped Skunk
- Red Kangaroo
- Lar Gibbon
- Red Ruffed Lemur
- Western Chimpanzee
- Southern White Rhinoceros
- Hippopotamus
- Aldabra Giant Tortoise
- Eurasian Lynx
- Grizzly Bear
- Amur Leopard
- American Bison
- Indian Elephant
- Snow Leopard
- California Sea Lion
- African Savanna Elephant
- Moose
- Przewalski's Horse
- Blue Wildebeest
- Bornean Orangutan
- African Wild Dog
- Komodo Dragon
- Alpine Ibex
- Mandrill
- Bongo
- Reticulated Giraffe
- Common Warthog
- Polar Bear
- Black Rhinoceros
- African Buffalo
- Gemsbok
- Okapi
- Giant Panda
- Reindeer
- Thomson's Gazelle
- Sable Antelope
- Giant Anteater
- Spotted Hyena
- Western Lowland Gorilla
- Pygmy Hippopotamus
- Galapagos Giant Tortoise
- Striped Hyena
- Koala
- Saltwater Crocodile
- Malayan Tapir
- Markhor
- Wolverine
- North American Beaver
- King Penguin
- Aardvark
- Formosan Black Bear
- Hamadryas Baboon
- Fennec Fox
- Caracal
- Scimitar-Horned Oryx
- Addax
- Clouded Leopard
- Indian Rhinoceros
- Baird's Tapir
I guess maybe there’s some merit to allowing for some extra sorting/grouping options but I definitely wouldn’t want to see it done in a way that could come across as de-emphasizing the value of similar species. Plus I'd hope that any sort of grouping would be taxonomically consistent: lemurs are a family, while zebras are part of a genus. Grouping them at the family level would also lump in the p-horse and donkeys, while grouping lemurs at a genus level (or narrower) would only result in the ruffed lemurs getting paired. Maybe they could do a thing like, if you’ve got the red ruffed lemur selected, you could go into Taxonomic View or soemthing. “See more from this genus” would show the black and white ruffed lemur, or you could set it to “family” for the other lemurs, “order” to pull back to monkeys and apes, etc.
I have to disagree with some of the subspecies takes. Subspecies can be incredibly important distinctions. That's not to say that some in PZ are unnecessary. I think the most logical way to do it, is that Frontier just does it the way zoos do it in a broad global sense. Like, for example, the different populations of tigers have been isolated long enough that important morphological differences have become apparent and even necessary for their livelihood. The paler and fluffier coat of the Amur tiger is better adapted for life in the taiga, while the more saturated thinner coat of the Sumatran tiger is adapted for life in dense rainforests. If zoos were to mix these two populations and muddle their adaptations these hybrids would theoretically not do as well if they were released in the wild in either habitat. This reasoning also applies to the leopard for me.
But perhaps more relevant for a zoo game, if it were this way we would just get annoying situations like the takin. The takin is clearly the Sichuan subspecies/variety (whatever taxonomy you use). You can't use it as the Misihmi or Golden. Some animals just have dramatically different appearances based on what subspecies they are a part of and you can't just pick one specimen to design the entire model off of for an entire species (kind of like the tiger scenario I mentioned above). Giraffes would also apply. The different species/subspecies have very distinct appearances and zoos nowadays are very particular about not mixing them.
Oh and the distinctions of the Przewalski's horse and southern white rhino for conservation reasons that I don't feel like typing out.
I feel like excluding domestics is weird even if you don't like them personally. They are essential for making zoos, especially the camels. They belong in PZ.
Here's my perspective on subspecies changes that you suggested based on how animals are managed in the US, other places in the world probably do some differently:
Formosan Black Bear->Asiatic Black Bear
Indian Elephant->Asian Elephant
Pronghorn Antelope->Pronghorn
Pygmy Hippo->Pygmy Hippopotamus (Not a subspecies change, but leaving it because the inconsistency bothers me more than you know)
Timber Wolf->Gray Wolf
West African Lion-> Lion
Western Chimpanzee->Chimpanzee
I would add further changes that actually narrow down species further:
African Buffalo-> Cape Buffalo
Takin-> Sichuan Takin
Quick draft from my side where I took the liberty to change some subspecies. I also have omitted exhibit species and flying/fully aquatic animals.
| Lion |
| African Elephant |
| Lowland Gorilla |
| Western Chimpanzee |
| Cape Buffalo |
| White Rhinoceros |
| Zebra |
| Reticulated Giraffe |
| Thomson's Gazelle |
| Ostrich |
| Blue Wildebeest |
| Spotted Hyena |
| Gemsbok |
| Fennec Fox |
| Meerkat |
| African Crested Porcupine |
| Somali Wild Ass |
| African Spurred Tortoise |
| Common Warthog |
| Aardvark |
| Hippopotamus |
| Pygmy Hippopotamus |
| African Wild Dog |
| Cheetah |
| Hamadryas Baboon |
| Mandrill |
| Greater Flamingo |
| African Penguin |
| Ring-tailed Lemur |
| Bongo |
| Red River Hog |
| Giant Panda |
| Amur Leopard |
| Bactrian Camel |
| Asian Elephant |
| Bornean Orangutan |
| Asian Small-Clawed Otter |
| Sun Bear |
| Komodo Dragon |
| Siamang |
| Sumatran Tiger |
| Binturong |
| Indian Peafowl |
| Malaysian Tapir |
| North Sulawesi Babirusa |
| Lar Gibbon |
| Chinese Pangolin |
| Clouded Leopard |
| Wolverine |
| Takin |
| Red-crowned Crane |
| Snow Leopard |
| Jaguar |
| Giant Anteater |
| Llama |
| Galapagos Giant Tortoise |
| Capybara |
| Spectacled Caiman |
| Nine-banded Armadillo |
| Sloth |
| Columbian White-faced Capuchin |
| Collared Peccary |
| Red Kangaroo |
| Koala |
| Emu |
| Red-Necked Wallaby |
| Saltwater Crocodile |
| Southern Cassowary |
| Tasmanian Devil |
| North Island Brown Kiwi |
| Common Wombat |
| European Fallow Deer |
| European Brown Bear |
| American Bison |
| Polar Bear |
| California Sea Lion |
| Reindeer |
| North-American Beaver |
| Black-tailed Prairie Dog |
| Moose |
| Cougar |
| Eurasian Lynx |
| Alpine Ibex |
| European Badger |
| Raccoon |
| Mute Swan |
| African Pygmy Goat |
| Highland Cattle |
| Chicken |
| Striped Skunk |
| Grey Wolf |
| Okapi |
| Bonobo |
| Japanese Macaque |
| Markhor |
| Addax |
| Maned wolf |
| Caracal |
| Red Panda |
| Gharial |
| South American Coati |
| Grey Crowned Crane |
| Helmeted Guineafowl |
| Great White Pelican |
| Geoffroy's Spider Monkey |
| White-faced Saki |
| Greater Rhea |
| Patagonian Mara |
| Sulawesi Crested Macaque |
| Mantled Guereza |
If I'm not mistaken, the controversial Zoo Tycoon 3 had a system where you selected an animal and then selected which subspecies you'd want. If implemented well, I think this would be a good solution, because Frontier can make a clear distinction between species and subspecies. Also, we are less likely to receive a subspecies in a new pack that belongs to a species we already have.
I would like that. Not sure if that would reduce the amount of subspecies we recieve, but they could have designated DLC spot like Exhibits. Like we're always expecting one subspecies for our drop down menu
The problem here is that, frankly, there's only a very small handful of species that I'd care to prioritize having multiple subspecies for, so at that point why bother with adding such a system? Tiger, brown bear, wolf, I guess leopard if we must, the donkey and pig depending on your taxonomic preference... Off the top of my head, the only subspecies split involving new animals that I don't think I'd dislike outright is the potential addition of the African forest buffalo as an oddball choice (the current buffalo should be renamed Cape buffalo either way, absolutely).
I wouldn't mind if that means that old stuff we're getting back gets retouched
I hope all animals in PZ1 are in PZ2 either in base or very early on, so that the roster can really expand.
Still so many animals that could have been in PZ1 - Walrus, Echidna, Secretary Bird, Tree Kangaroo, Coati, Shoe Bill, Musk Ox, Generuk, Rabbit/Hare, Mara, Howler Monkey, Chameleon, Cobra, any Duck, Pelican, Spoonbill, Ibis, Goose, Puffin, Rhea, Numbat, Bilby, Lyrebird, Ribbon Seal, Sika Deer, Blackbuck, Kudu.
Then Aquatics, and Flying animals too.(thus tanks and aviaries.) So many new choices available. I really hope the final number of animals is a lot more than PZ1. Happy to have more expensive expansions with many more animals also in addition to DLC to ensure more animals/flora/features. But really want any PZ1 animals in very early.
More customization/interaction of the small exhibit animals & exhibits would be great and increase the fun of using these animals and designing for them. Same for walk though exhibits. That would make more animal options again.
Other features:
Better pathing options.
More barrier types and more varied basic shelters.
Much better performance on PC with less lag with more animals for as long as possible.
The features that were added throughout PZ: Koala/Kangaroo baby's from pouches, brachiation, diving, population management from the get go, restaurants, gift shops,
New features like: egg laying/ nesting/ hatching, interactive cinemas, more animal interactions
More tycoon features.
Still so many animals that could have been in PZ1 - Walrus, Echidna, Secretary Bird, Tree Kangaroo, Coati, Shoe Bill, Musk Ox, Generuk, Rabbit/Hare, Mara, Howler Monkey, Chameleon, Cobra, any Duck, Pelican, Spoonbill, Ibis, Goose, Puffin, Rhea, Numbat, Bilby, Lyrebird, Ribbon Seal, Sika Deer, Blackbuck, Kudu.
Then Aquatics, and Flying animals too.(thus tanks and aviaries.) So many new choices available. I really hope the final number of animals is a lot more than PZ1. Happy to have more expensive expansions with many more animals also in addition to DLC to ensure more animals/flora/features. But really want any PZ1 animals in very early.
More customization/interaction of the small exhibit animals & exhibits would be great and increase the fun of using these animals and designing for them. Same for walk though exhibits. That would make more animal options again.
Other features:
Better pathing options.
More barrier types and more varied basic shelters.
Much better performance on PC with less lag with more animals for as long as possible.
The features that were added throughout PZ: Koala/Kangaroo baby's from pouches, brachiation, diving, population management from the get go, restaurants, gift shops,
New features like: egg laying/ nesting/ hatching, interactive cinemas, more animal interactions
More tycoon features.
I wish the subspecies issue could be dealt with in a black-and-white way, but I don't think it can be. Like to go the other way. Zoos in the US have the Tajik markhor to my knowledge, however, everyone here just refers to them as markhors. So in this case, I don't mind the generalization despite the major differences between subspecies in regards to their horns. This is were, ultimately, some subjectively come into play, because based on my logic earlier, this should be just as annoying as the takin situation in game.
Meanwhile fish people
Yea this is how I feel too. Which species "deserve" to have multiple subspecies in game? Where is the line to be drawn.
I mean Idk how unrealistic that would be, but every? There doesn't need to be line drawn.
If we only have one type of animal (say one Buffalo) just specify which one specifically it is.
If we have multiple, make a drop down menu for us to choose which. Amount of subspecies per animal would be either decided by demand, popularity, how common they are, or by frontier random roulette as oddball choices.
Like there would probably be enough demand for both Sumatran and Siberian Tiger to be included, while only one subspecies of Moon Bear will be enough
Don't forget about us southamericans
Honestly, the line is drawn in regards to what we keep in zoos IRL imo(which changes regionally). That's why we got the Southen white rhino instead of "white rhinoceros". That's why we have the western chimp, which is what seems to be in the EAZA (if I'm wrong please correct me). That's why we have the "bengal" and Siberian Tiger, which is unfortunate outdated as "bengals" have been phased out from conservation focused zoos.
I don't think drawing the line is nesscarily hard, there's just many different views of where it should be drawn. I like how PZ has done it post launch with their DLC animals, I feel like it reflects IRL conservation breeding programs well. I hope they do it this way in PZ2. I don't need the southern white rhino to be changed to the white rhino to include the functional extinct northern white rhino that has no captive presence.