POLL: Should ED have an Auto Pilot?

Should Elite Dangerous have an autopilot that can only be used for jumping to systems (and be able t

  • YES

    Votes: 242 30.6%
  • NO

    Votes: 550 69.4%

  • Total voters
    792
  • Poll closed .
Status
Thread Closed: Not open for further replies.
Fuel scooping and honking while drives are cooling down and jumping in a way that you lose as little time doing that as possible is an art form. You also have to play around heat to avoid module damage. At best you will never have to stop and scoop and you lose almost no time scooping. I would never use an autopilot while I can do that. Then again an argument for jump autopilot is that it would be very unoptimal and manual control gives you an advantage. I wouldn't mind if others had the options of using it. I would opt out.
 
Fuel scooping and honking while drives are cooling down and jumping in a way that you lose as little time doing that as possible is an art form. You also have to play around heat to avoid module damage. At best you will never have to stop and scoop and you lose almost no time scooping. I would never use an autopilot while I can do that. Then again an argument for jump autopilot is that it would be very unoptimal and manual control gives you an advantage. I wouldn't mind if others had the options of using it. I would opt out.

...or you could deliberately make it sub-optimal and just simply disengage an AP when the fuel runs below 25% i.e. no auto scoop. That way you are rewarded for manual flight with exploration data and a faster journey time :) I'm all in favour of rewarding skilled DIY behaviour, not unlike a docking computer not reacting to ship scans.
 
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Jex =TE=

Banned
So on real flights for example from Europe to Australia passengers prefer to go to sleep to pass the time. According to your take on it that's a dismal idea. What the airline companies should be doing is making it more exciting for example introducing more white knuckle turbulence or throw in a few cabin depressurisations now and and again to keep people on there toes. WTH?

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!

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Pressing J X amount of times are FUN :eek: :S ???? SYNTAX ERROR

Sorry, that is not fun and wasn't fun after the first 5 or 10 times unless you're a cat and like a dangly thing to hit. I don't believe anybody finds it fun actually - Nobody's brain is that simple to find that fun but IDK why people hate the idea of an AP.
 

Jex =TE=

Banned
Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post (Source)
There's this great new invention, only a couple of centuries old. It's called Logic. You should give it a go sometime

How was his statement logically flawed?

I wouldn't bother if I were you. He'll just carry on making vage statements, demonstrably false of logic and then keep on reply with "hidden meaning" and vagueness. That's why I have him on my ignore list and still see he's pulling the same nonsense.

Not to say Ziggy isn't right sometimes. He is! When he's agreeing with me ;) :p
 

Jex =TE=

Banned
if an autopilot were added to the game I would want it to be highly restrictive. A basic "fly here" module that can be turned on when in super cruise and takes you to a distance and speed at which you can disengage super cruise manually would be a start. Another module for auto super cruise engage/disengagement. Another module for hyperspace jumps. Another module to multi-hyperspace jumps. A module for automated fuel scooping (which could be set to automatically scoop at the next scoopable star that was automatically jumped to once you hit a minimum fuel level. Each subsequent level of automation would require all of the previous. The modules would be a fair bit of weight, and each would take up a module slot, with the higher level ones requiring a higher level of module slot. So you might be able to fit it all on your Anaconda, but it is gong to cost you a fortune, your jump range will be severely hamstringed and you won't have module space for an AFMU, shield, SRV or extra fuel tank. About all you'll be able to carry is scanners and a scoop, and I'm not sure about the scanners.

Basically, the slog to the core SHOULD be a slog. There is an air of achievement when reaching Jaques. You shouldn't be able to just tell your ship to take you to Beagle point for you then go to bed without there being a serious cost to it. Even if it could only be set to take you every one thousand light years, only requiring you to input a galaxy's map selection every forty five minutes should come with a major downside.

For my part I voted "no". If you are on Flight Simulator X and you want to fly across the Atlantic manually with a subsequent manual arrival, approach and landing, that's totally doable. But nobody does. I even see twitch streamers perform a 3 hour flight, only to let the computer land the thing for them - the only reason people tuned in was to watch them crash and burn and they didn't need even provide that small level of entertainment. If it is there, people will use it. It won't make the game more fun, it will just make it convenient and, in doing so, detract from the experience. I don't use a docking computer as it uses up modules and kills me, but would I have spent 12 hours straight jumping manually to Jaques in a day had I had the automation available? Hell no. Would I be better off for it? No, because I the sense of accomplishment I got from it was exhilarating. If you add higher-level automation to Elite Dangerous, you risk taking people away from what makes Elite Dangerous so exceptional, and I believe that the core experience of Elite will be fundamentally altered, for better or worse.

It detracts from YOUR experience you mean which has nothing to do with anybody else's. Can everyone stop with the seflish, entitled arguments please as they're not arguments.

I'd much rather have an AP to deal with the mundane flying so I could get on with looking up prices or routes etc or you know, needing to get a drink or go for a pee.

What I don't want to do is be hunched over my joystick, intently piloting the ship and looking like a right just so I don't break someone else's "Immersion (TM)"

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No thanks. If I wanted a computer to play my computer game for me, I'd buy another computer.

This is the most stupid argument so far - can you explain how it plays your game for you?

Presumably you use gimballed guns, right?

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Literally nothing dangerous occurred between leaving the bubble and docking at Jaques. The only instances where my ship was in danger was when I wasn't my paying attention and flew myself into stars. Stick in an autopilot and even that small risk is gone. I could literally have turned on my Xbox for 14 hours, gone to work and come home at Jaques. What would be the point? You would have everybody going to the core in their sleep, and it would no longer be a sign of achievement.

Once again stop with the selfishness! What has everyone elses game got to do with you or people like you!?

Talk about self entitled!
 

Jex =TE=

Banned
I feel the need to jump in here. (see what I did there)

Could someone PLEASE explain to me how plotting a course from say, Maia to Ceos, jumping, waiting, jumping, waiting, jumping etc.. is in any meaningful way, flying the ship? You don't move any significant distance in SC unless the destination is behind the star, in which case you just fly 10 seconds to the right and then jump.

I don't think an autopilot from star to station is a good idea no. But a way to eliminate the tedium of having to manually jump from star to star? I fail to see how that is gamebreaking. No auto refuelling, no interdiction avoidance, no auto heat management. Just a mechanism to jump in, orient the ship to the next jump destination, wait for cooldown, and jump again.

I absolutely cannot see any problem with this.

They haven't been able to answer this yet. It's been asked over and over and nobody has said how it is "flying"

The other stupid argument is "it plays the game for you" however, we haven't had a demonstration of how it's going to do that either so they are currently sat in the "massively unsupported argument that's so bad Donald Trump could do better!" drawer.
 

Jex =TE=

Banned
My point to not having an AP is very simple: its a waste of developers time, time that could be very well spent in adding new content and improving existing gameplay, instead of supporting playing AFK.

Nope.

It's already been written so the code is there and it's been tested. We're not talking that much time and I'd prefer this over CQC, PP or Eng's, all of which afaic, were a massive waste of time and could have been used to make travelling much more interesting and made exploration a actual thing. I just saw Scot Manly's "exploration" video and to say I'm unimpressed is an understatement. So many water worlds that look exactly the same - good job there FD!

Given that FD make very questionable decisions on content, I think we can steer them in better directions.

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Why not just angle for long-distance hyperspace jumps then? I can't help but think that if FD nerf SC and multi-jump long-distance travel, people will be clamouring "Why do I have to sit here and watch my ship fly itself for 20 jumps at a time? Why can't I just jump directly to Sothis? I have a wife and kids."

I don't see a reason why you should be able to jump your entire fuel range. Hyperspace should take more time in my view and be based on fuel. You go into witch space when you jump right, so why come out early. Just keep going until you fuel runs out, stopping to refuel by station or scoop then off again.
 

Jex =TE=

Banned
I voted for delayed ship transfer. I'm almost entirely for the slow burn approach the game takes, I love it! someone once suggested sarcastically that refuel/restock/repair should have a delay and I was all for it! But I'm totally for autopilot.

It's kind of disheartening to see people I recently agreed with insinuating that me and anyone who want autopilot is a spoiled petulant child. Maybe its my imagination, but a lot of the posts come off as self satisified or somehow equally off-putting. Can someone explain to me how wanting autopilot is an 'instant gratification' thing or an I-Win button or whatever? Maybe after 5 weeks of in-game time we finally discovered ED, a game I've loved for over a year, is the wrong game for me and I'm only in it for the wrong reasons? I've never felt more sorry for the instant transfer folks (still dont think it's a good idea, but I feel their pain), a lot of the opposition is incredibly dismissive without ever really participating in actual discourse.

I hope I'm wrong, but I get the feeling lots of people here are cool with ED being the video game equivalent of working in a coal mine. Or, perhaps more generously, it's a video game for people that hate video games (and maybe themselves?).

I'd go for more delayed repairs and cargo as well. I voted against instant ship transfers but that was because it introduced game breaking things and FD should have known that since it's their game.

All arguments, if you can call them arguments have been defeated now anyway.

"It breaks Immersion" It's part of the lore and has been in every version of Elite. ED even already has an AP it's called the docking computer yet the DC is fine doing the complex task of landing (notice there's no argument here!) yet getting it to fly in a straight line is absurd for some reason. AP is very much part of the immersion.

"It plays the game for you" - This hasn't been demonstrated so can now be ignored.

"It takes dev time" - It's already written and it's been tested so no, not really.

"I want to fly my ship it stops us flying" - Once again, it is yet to be demonstrated how this is flying. This can be ignored too.

Did I miss anything?
 
I'd go for more delayed repairs and cargo as well. I voted against instant ship transfers but that was because it introduced game breaking things and FD should have known that since it's their game.

All arguments, if you can call them arguments have been defeated now anyway.

"It breaks Immersion" It's part of the lore and has been in every version of Elite. ED even already has an AP it's called the docking computer yet the DC is fine doing the complex task of landing (notice there's no argument here!) yet getting it to fly in a straight line is absurd for some reason. AP is very much part of the immersion.

"It plays the game for you" - This hasn't been demonstrated so can now be ignored.

"It takes dev time" - It's already written and it's been tested so no, not really.

"I want to fly my ship it stops us flying" - Once again, it is yet to be demonstrated how this is flying. This can be ignored too.

Did I miss anything?

I voted no, as that would be my personal choice. As it goes, if it was implemented i would just ignore it and it wouldn't bother me. The main reason why is that I generally look at systems maps and see what is going in the system before jumping out on the way to my destination. I like to see whats going on there just in case I want to head back. I hardly ever jump, line up to star and jump, line up to star etc. It's usually jump, if I haven't been there scan the system and then open the system map to decide if I want to explore the system. If I have been there, I will open up the factions pane and looks whats going on, there maybe an opportunity for me.

It is very rare that I need to bucky ball it to a system.
 
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Jex =TE=

Banned
Oh yeah... the people in this thread sound so happy about what is like to travel in ed. Just read all the suggestions they give to the op on how to deal with it

Wow - just how boring is travel in ED. Well, it seems the experts have chimed in to say "don't play the game, watch tv or read a book!"

Anyone saying this is good game design loses any credibility in saying anything about game design.

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I think if you want an Auto pilot you need to fit a docking computer, get an AI Relic and then find an Egineer to install the AI Relic into the Docking compouter and then network the docking computer to the FSD and Navigation computer.

And No I am not being snide or facetious.

If you did that, how could anyone say you were lazy/trying to skip gameplay by having an Auto pilot if you earnt the Auto pilot though game play!

Weirdly this post got me thinking about how hyperdrive works in ED.

When you "line up with the star" you're never lined up exactly so what part of the hyperdrive then steers your ship correctly?

You're not doing it which means AP is already in the game twice now.

Once as a docking comuputer

Once as a hyperdrive autopilot.

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I agree and I disagree. I do think that there is something special about travelling to the far reaches of the galaxy manually - a real feeling of achievement - and I think that if people use an autopilot they won't ever feel that same sense of accomplishment. I know, I know. You'll say it is optional again. And then I'll argue again that that argument doesn't hold water. And we go round and round in cicliclar arguments. Let's say we have done that and simply disagree with one another on that point.

That's fine but nobody cares what you think. We don't care if you think it's an acomplishment or not. If you want to do it without an AP fine, go for it, nobody is going to force you to do it manually. What you need to do is stop thinking Elite is your game and understand that your opinion doesn't mean anything, just like mine doesn't and anyone elses. Let other people play the game they want to play, not what you want to force upon them :)
 

Jex =TE=

Banned
Correct me if i'm wrong but as the game is at the moment you're supposed to be getting off on flying about the galaxy.
When i'm exploring i don't simply jump and honk,unless i'm heading for a particular area of the galaxy,i'm looking for things of interest to explore.
When meaningful game play is available via multi crew i can see the argument for an npc pilot(auto pilot)until then i don't really see what people would do whilst there ship self fly's its self around the galaxy.

Well it's been explained a dozen times in this thread so how you're one of the few that have managed not to pay attention I don't know say, really.

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Though I do know a number of pilots who I have deep respect for endorse an autopilot feature of some kind, I just can't help but think that this thread is at its core a Netflix thread. Indeed, the very idea of autopilot seems like a tool to enable the CMDR to NOT play the game while the game plays itself and they seek entertainment elsewhere.

Personally, I prefer to play. I hope Fdev never wastes their time developing this feature; plenty of better things to focus on.

I'll ask you the same question then.

What makes you think YOU have any say on how other people play the game? Why do YOU think you're more important than everyone else here?

PS - it's not a netflix thread, it's a poll about an AP ;)
 
You're not doing it which means AP is already in the game twice now.

Once as a docking comuputer

Once as a hyperdrive autopilot.

actually 5 times because you have ship transfer and guardians in v2.2 beta which is AI NPC piloting and you also have the limpet drones collecting/delivering stuff automatically. All sounds a bit OP to me we should be forced to manually collect 1000's of chunks of rock like the good ole days down pit [rolleyes]
 

Jex =TE=

Banned
What utter nonsensical drivel. The old "extreme extrapolation" argument, although you did go a step further than most with the addition of saving electricity bills. It's the ultimate lazy argument that presumes to know better than others.

Besides that it's poor logic, the 'you want this so you must want this, this and this also' just doesn't hold water. The main reason being is that travel automation has no affect on other players and I'm not talking about the fact that it's optional to use. Any player using it is not at any advantage whatsoever. It does not give you any financial gain, it's not safer, it gives no improvement of statistics or ranking, no increase in exploration data, doesn't improve your ship or equipment, it's a neutral addition to the game. You couldn't even use it to travel to Jacques and wear that badge because you have to fuel scoop manually.

You'd be just as well arguing against the gold paint job for the Anaconda because it's too flashy.

I don't agree with one of the other main points of the debate with the fact that long distance travel should be made more interesting and interactive. Really? How many posts do we see on the forum already about too many interdications? With the exception of explorers the vast majority of time when players are travelling they are doing so with a particular objective, they want to get to their destination, they aren't just bimbling around waiting for something interesting to happen.

Not to mention you lose a slot when you install one....

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Everyone wants us to focus on the 'realign and press [J]' aspect of the Hyper Jump mechanic. I would rather focus on the 'dropping in' to the next system end of the discussion. It seems easy to dismiss the risks faced when you drop onto another star but, the risks are real. Asking a Modules to deal with staying out of a stars gravity boundary,

This got me thinking. Imagine an AP that you could prgram, with speeds and waypoints.

That would allow navigators to plot courses and take advantage of gravity wells. It would open up emergent gameplay and give player san actual "Kessel Run" as we try to plot the fastest course.

If FD added in other things in space, we could have more things to navigate around which would be really cool. Who wanted more to do in space?
 

Jex =TE=

Banned
And, just gloss over the risks associated with dropping in on a new star?

Why are you fixated on this risk thing its abject nonsense. You do know we've all played the game and done hundreds or thousands of jumps right? To tell the entire community that there's "risks" is bordering on rude. Do you think anybody here is actually nodding there head and saying "this guy gets it!!" - No - and I don't know why you keep using this as a point of argument.

Could you please point out who you think here, in this thread, doesn't know how to hyperjump?

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But you want a computer to save you from these risks. That's my issue with a HJ-AP. The Commander should have to deal with these risks. You still had to open your eyes.....

There you go again - what risks??? LOL They are only risks for you because you are a really bad pilot. The rest of us that can see a big star in front of us do one of 2 things most likely.

Push the nose up.....

or

push the nose down....
 

Jex =TE=

Banned
Wrong. Without input, from a pilot or computer, a ship would plunge into a star and cook. Try it. I'll even pay for your re-buy (I'll need video proof for the payout).

JESUS IN A BALLOON ARE YOU SERIOUS????

LOLOLOLOL

Your argument boils down to "If you don't drink water from your tap your at risk from dying!!!!! You need to drink to stop you from dying!!!!!!!"

Does ANYONE here, reading this, think they're at risk of dying from dehydration right now?

No, of course they don't and your now being incredibly rude trying to tell the player base that we're clueless about the game we're playing.
 

Jex =TE=

Banned
Something like what you are doing? My argument is no emotional, it's based on logic. If your ship is flying, a Commander should be in control. Without the proper response to entering a new system, your ship would drop into the star and cook. Based on that, my opinion is, the Commander should have to make that input. My opinion. Just a valid as yours.

So logically if a ship is flying a commander should be flying it but that's an opinion, how is that based on logic? Do you know what logic is? AND, OR, XOR, Etc? If you're talking about logic fallacies, you just walked over "non sequitor" cliff I'm afraid.

There is no logic in your post.

How do you logically account for a docking computer then?
 
And probably zeroed the throttle during the jump...

Someone still had to make that input. The thought behind it is explaining why an AP would cheapen the experience. You don;t like it when other boil the argument down to the extremes, well neither do I. Input is needed to safely navigate the galaxy. I stand firm in the belief that the Commander should have to make these very simple and easy to learn maneuvers. So sue me.

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So logically if a ship is flying a commander should be flying it but that's an opinion, how is that based on logic? Do you know what logic is? AND, OR, XOR, Etc? If you're talking about logic fallacies, you just walked over "non sequitor" cliff I'm afraid.

There is no logic in your post.

How do you logically account for a docking computer then?

You are not the arbiter of logic, you simply don;t agree. I can live with that.

I have previously answered for the Docking Computer, keep up and you'd know what was said.
 

Jex =TE=

Banned
Elite 2 was a very different game to E|D. It didn't have the MP element, nor the scale of the Milky Way Galaxy. A large portion of the players around here want to preserve that scale. Watching Netflix, or reading a webpage doesn't do that.

Sorry, I missed this part and this is an absolute lie. FE2 did have the scale - you never even played it did you so why are you making up things to try and defend your bad argument? How does me wtahcing netflix change the scale? Where is the logic in that? What do you think atronaughts are going to be doing on the 6 month journey to Mars?

Did you know it's an absolute fact that there isn't one person alive today that can grasp the scale of the galaxy? The "sense of scale" you feel is compeltely made up in your head and is wrong.
 
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