Powerplay fix

[GNThrone]

Just when someone would think that you can't stoop any lower...

Well that's my opinion of your attitude right now.

Hopefully, you also reviewed the rest of the links I included in the post that you snipped that quote from.

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=175255&page=18&p=2701769&viewfull=1#post2701769
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...muakXrMcDNjYvTy_MAF5UhcWYg/edit#gid=520829301

 

[Martin Schou]

The thing is, you keep insisting that you've proven that FDev is wrong that you should have lost Syntheng, and I've shown that you should have experienced a cascading turmoil failure and not gotten any expansions. You haven't proven anything - all you've done is shown what I already showed, namely that FDev's wording is completely useless and that they need to show us the maths used to determine what the outcome should have been.

 

[GNThrone]

The thing is, you keep insisting that you've proven that FDev is wrong that you should have lost Syntheng, and I've shown that you should have experienced a cascading turmoil failure and not gotten any expansions. You haven't proven anything - all you've done is shown what I already showed, namely that FDev's wording is completely useless and that they need to show us the maths used to determine what the outcome should have been.

My computations still are the closest to actual values this turn. A 0.01% deviation would suggest it's reasonable.

Also, my sentiments updated when I did the computations. I verified that we indeed lost syntheng and it's loss and addition of new systems would lead to a +14 CC reserve.

 

[Apos]

Well that's my opinion of your attitude right now.

Hopefully, you also reviewed the rest of the links I included in the post that you snipped that quote from.

The problem is that you didn't post your opinion on my attitude, because you had little critique for it. Instead, you linked it to the group I am supporting and severing it from it's personal value, implying that they are somehow connected.

That's something I'd expect from a tumblr rad-fem.

Additionally, you seem to be under the impression that my attitude is any different to yours. Do you want Gluttony to analyze me as well and see for yourself than in reality we aren't very much apart? I just apply my harshness and insensitivity to different values.

But I digress.

Yes, I've already seen those values. Like I said, they seem valid, it's just a matter of FD replying back. The problem is that we have never observed things happening in the way you propose which would be

1) Turmoil persists
2) Shake off
3) Expansion happen
4) Positive CC

On the contrary, we have indeed seen expansions get cancelled due to turmoil.

If this the order of things and it get verified as such, fine, one more piece of information for everyone on how PP works.

 

[GNThrone]

I've already seen those values. Like I said, they seem valid, it's just a matter of FD replying back. The problem is that we have never observed things happening in the way you propose which would be

1) Turmoil persists
2) Shake off
3) Expansion happen
4) Positive CC

On the contrary, we have indeed seen expansions get cancelled due to turmoil.

If this the order of things and it get verified as such, fine, one more piece of information for everyone on how PP works.

I'm going to guess that expansions will succeed in any state. BUT if the deficit is too large that the new systems will not lead to a positive CC, then none would succeed.

So following that, the game would succeed every expansion then check if the resulting CC is negative. If the value is negative, it removes the expansion system causing the largest deficit, then checks again if the resulting CC is negative. If the value is still negative, it will keep removing expansion systems one at a time starting with the remaining expansion system having the largest net negative effect (a net positive is a low net negative effect - double negative)and check the resulting CC each time. It's why Aowica succeeded despite having a net negative CC (-9) effect.

Edit: The game stopped removing expansion systems at Aowica because the resulting CC after removing the 3 systems before Aowica is 14 CC.

Following this logic, powers pushed into turmoil will have their expansions failed if their CC deficit is large enough. And powers pushed into turmoil with a marginal deficit are able to expand into new systems resulting in a positive CC.

 

[Maxulic]

Guys, there is a very simple fix to the PP mess. Unpledge and go thousands of light years away from civilized space to explore the galaxy (or go back to any activity you were interested in before PP).

I assure you that you will enjoy the game again.

Simple fix.

 

[Gswine]

Guys, there is a very simple fix to the PP mess. Unpledge and go thousands of light years away from civilized space to explore the galaxy (or go back to any activity you were interested in before PP).

I assure you that you will enjoy the game again.

Simple fix.

Now way man, we be tweaking on this now. Nobody to blame but ourselves!

Though maybe a more honest reply would be that you'd find many people here arguing have become part of groups that have entered into Power Play or even sprung up around it. Probably pretty invested beyond the actual mechanics of it. That's why fails in the mechanics of the game are felt so personally. I think. but +1 rep for being the voice of reason

 

[GluttonyFang]

Now way man, we be tweaking on this now. Nobody to blame but ourselves!

Though maybe a more honest reply would be that you'd find many people here arguing have become part of groups that have entered into Power Play or even sprung up around it. Probably pretty invested beyond the actual mechanics of it. That's why fails in the mechanics of the game are felt so personally. I think. but +1 rep for being the voice of reason

This is pretty much equivalent to saying playing PP and being invested in it is in some way the "wrong way" to play the game.

If I break whatever you're enjoying in Elite, let's see how fast you react. Then I'll proceed to tell you to do something else in the game and potentially something you dislike.

 

[xDreadnoughtx]

We owe it to the players of PP to attempt to break the back of all empire powers cycle after cycle. Disregard all other in fighting and just rinse and repeat.

See what interesting mathematical conundrums that might bring. Empire in tatters? No further reaction from FD? we can then all get on with it safe in the knowledge that there is no bias at all......probably.

Let's face it, FD have a story roadmap for ED. It's planned months in advance and players better not get in the way. Right now we are being treated to a load of hackneyed empire succession tosh.

Anyways. Need to go and fortify.

 

[ROSS-128]

We owe it to the players of PP to attempt to break the back of all empire powers cycle after cycle. Disregard all other in fighting and just rinse and repeat.

See what interesting mathematical conundrums that might bring. Empire in tatters? No further reaction from FD? we can then all get on with it safe in the knowledge that there is no bias at all......probably.

Let's face it, FD have a story roadmap for ED. It's planned months in advance and players better not get in the way. Right now we are being treated to a load of hackneyed empire succession tosh.

Anyways. Need to go and fortify.

This is what I've been saying. The best way to deal with the situation we've been seeing is to put pressure on the Empire, drive them to collapse again and again until the Empire bias is either confirmed beyond reasonable doubt, disproven, made official, or abandoned. Force it all out into the open so it can be dealt with, one way or another.

 

[GluttonyFang]

This is what I've been saying. The best way to deal with the situation we've been seeing is to put pressure on the Empire, drive them to collapse again and again until the Empire bias is either confirmed beyond reasonable doubt, disproven, made official, or abandoned. Force it all out into the open so it can be dealt with, one way or another.

Pretty much, if there's a linear story line pre-established and followed like a script, where players are given the illusion of the ability to change PP, then count me out, I'm done with PP from that point onward, it's an utter waste of time.

 

[Cooperman]

why does it (powerplay) have to be so complex for gods sake. this is why not many commanders play it. sorry I just don't get it for the core pilots that play 1-2 hours a day at most.

coops.

 

[Apos]

Pretty much, if there's a linear story line pre-established and followed like a script, where players are given the illusion of the ability to change PP, then count me out, I'm done with PP from that point onward, it's an utter waste of time.

I wouldn't say it's pre-determined, seeing how they are going along with the Imperial powers decision to not fight each other after the Emperor's death. (most unrealistic reaction ever if I may add.)

It's still player driven. Just from Imperial players only.

 

[Gswine]

This is pretty much equivalent to saying playing PP and being invested in it is in some way the "wrong way" to play the game.

If I break whatever you're enjoying in Elite, let's see how fast you react. Then I'll proceed to tell you to do something else in the game and potentially something you dislike.

I don't get what your saying here, but I don't think you got what I was saying so what's there to say?

 

[GNThrone]

I wouldn't say it's pre-determined, seeing how they are going along with the Imperial powers decision to not fight each other after the Emperor's death. (most unrealistic reaction ever if I may add.)

It's still player driven. Just from Imperial players only.

If it's player driven for the empire only as you state, then FD should have lifted treason penalties for imperials blowing up fellow imperials aligned to another power. Note, we can't really fight each other with the treason penalties in effect.

Powerplay, in its current form, is detached from lore as it is from everything else.

 

[GluttonyFang]

I don't get what your saying here, but I don't think you got what I was saying so what's there to say?

I don't know what you're on about.

Because something we enjoy thoroughly is broken, that's why we are asking for a fix. If how you solve issues is to avoid it, then so be it, but we don't view it that way.

 

[GNThrone]

I don't get what your saying here, but I don't think you got what I was saying so what's there to say?

I don't know what you're on about.

Because something we enjoy thoroughly is broken, that's why we are asking for a fix. If how you solve issues is to avoid it, then so be it, but we don't view it that way.

You guys are clearly not the same page

Edit: Maybe Gluttony's first reply was intended for Maxulic. Dunno.

 

[GluttonyFang]

You guys are clearly not the same page

Edit: Maybe Gluttony's first reply was intended for Maxulic. Dunno.

For clarification the reply was aiming toward both Maxulic and him.

 

[Apos]

If it's player driven for the empire only as you state, then FD should have lifted treason penalties for imperials blowing up fellow imperials aligned to another power. Note, we can't really fight each other with the treason penalties in effect.

Powerplay, in its current form, is detached from lore as it is from everything else.

Everyone else has been asking about it, except the Empire. We have been saying for ages that the Imperial powers should be allowed to fight each other exactly due to how much difference in ethos they display.

But the Imperial representatives claim for a unity that can't exist in any realistic scenario and proceed their plans as if it can.

And once again the Empire has it their way and the discouragement of the factions being able to fight each other remains.

So go ahead, gather the Aisling community and make a thread as big as your bug complaint about Syntheng asking for FD to change the undermining rules so that Aisling can fight with Arissa and put the claim to the throne fight to an end.

It might just happen.

 

[Gswine]

I don't know what you're on about.

Because something we enjoy thoroughly is broken, that's why we are asking for a fix. If how you solve issues is to avoid it, then so be it, but we don't view it that way.

That confirms you misunderstood what I said. We play the game but constantly we are reminded that it does not work as intended. It does not matter for which Power things are broken, or if any appear to receive beneficial treatment. As long as one Power is disadvantaged we all play through more flawed turns and this is never going to be a good thing.

The poster I responded too asked why we don't just unpledge and walk. So many of us are invested in outside groups through the game. Leaving PP, especially when in a group that now exists because of PP feels like turning your back on the players you've found to actually play the game with. It's got nothing to do with ignoring other groups, or more fundamentally, the Powers that have flawed game processes hamstringing them.

You now seem to be asking Imperials to give you a hug.

*Hugs*