PvP and Open Play Should be Required to Unlock Engineers!
- Thread starter Slamdance_Kozmopolis
- Start date
Welcome everyone to yet another Hotel California thread.Players need to be exposed to all facets of the game. That's what people tell me, when I complain about unlock requirements...
If I'm required to go exploring to unlock Professor Palin & required to go mining to unlock Selene Jean, despite the fact that I have no interest in these activities, why shouldn't solo traders be required to play in open for 20 hours and win 5 PvP matches to unlock Felicity Farseer?
Fair is fair and everyone needs to broaden their horizons, no?
You hit the nail on the head here. There is no accomodation for PVP players in the game. That's why we're always trying to steal your thing.
"Make BGS open only."
"Make Powerplay open only."
"Make CQC but we can bring our own ships."
Deep down we just want to be included. We want FDev to give us something to do. But as soon as a PVP activity is introduced into the game, solo players are going to cry foul. They paid for the game and they want to be able to do everything in solo, even PVP.
ED is a terrible game when you want to do PvP space combat. There are much better games for that. So if you play ED because you want combat PvP, you are playing the wrong game.
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I wasn't sold until this point. This is essential in any serious futuristic dystopian sim game.
Anyone who does PvP would completely disagree. The issue here is that FDev have shied away from adding any meaningful gameplay in this area and there is a gap for that admittedly (or was, maybe it's been this way to long to change). However, the actual combat part is extremely well done.
That's by the bye though. The problem with the idea for any kind of reward for playing in open comes from the fact that most of it, especially around the edges of the bubble, is pretty much empty. 20 hours out there might is no different than 20 hours in solo.
The other issue is that since you're asking players to survive 5 attacks, how would you code it into the game that a menu log wasn't counted as survival? Besides, building a ship for the specific purpose of surviving a gank is easy.
Anyway, my view is that players who don't want to be in open shouldn't feel they have to go in there. System chat is bad enough in busy areas and doesn't need more salt being added when they get blown up. As well as that, the more of those players you have in open, the more cheating you will see (combat logging).
So no thanks, the solo players should be free to stay where they are.
Competive PvP is locked behind a grind wall par excellence. And if you finally have done it, skill doesnt have a greate Influence. The fights are boring, just passing by and firing. Again...again and again. FA off doesnt add much either. No dogfights, no chasing, no shake off.
Just my Opinion. I am happy for everyone who likes it, but thats not for me.
Still they're not wrong
There is no incentive, no meaning and no purpose* for the pvp game
Sure, nobody is saying the pvp is not fun when done consensually by like minded commanders with relatively similar skill sets.
But that still doesnt change the fact that pvp is completely untied from the game scope and purpose and is not required for any game objective.
*(no, hurting other players does not count as purpose to me - pvp-ers not gaining anything out of it except schadenfreude)
Fair enough if I've misunderstood and the comment was aimed at what FDev has provided- which is limited to the basics of a flight model where PvP would be fun and an open mode to do it in.
Additionally, you can't be surprised that with no structured way of playing the bad guy, some players will find their own way of doing that.
New players are automatically inserted into Open Play.
That's what I noticed when creating an alt last year.
So new players are already experiencing the "loose consortium of emergent content creation professionals" that enrich their gameplay with new and exciting emergent experiences.
No need for the newbies to wait until they're ready to dabble in engineering.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Which also hits the approach on the head - "always trying to steal your thing" - as we all bought the same game and features, regardless of play-style preference.
PvP players are included - they can, with other like-minded players, engage in PvP while engaging in existing game features - what they can't do is force any other players to play with them while doing so, which seems to be the core of the issue - they can't exclude players who don't like PvP from engaging in those game features in the other game modes.
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No. Just plain NO.No, actually I appreciate it now! I'm so happy to be forced into these activities... I mean, I still don't like them, but how would I know that if I wasn't forced to do them for hours and hours?
Now I KNOW I don't like them!
How can all those solo players BE SURE they don't like open IF THEY AREN'T FORCED TO TRY IT?
Seriously.
I do not care to be someone else's reason for LOL's. I do play in open most of the time but there are places that one does NOT play in open.
Most (or all) delivery CG's.
Rescue CG's (unless in a group of players)
Landing at Farseer's base.
Founder's World (tried it a week ago, even just leaving the area got me shot down by two players just for being there, no reason for the interdiction, no reason for blowing me up, just the LOL's).
I wasn't "forced to try it." I already DID try it. Found out that unless you're in a wing (and I rarely know when I'm going to be on-line so it's really hard for me to coordinate such things) switching to Solo is the only way to get there.
In a real world, rescue missions bring people together. You don't expect them to be standing around a burning building with weapons armed to shoot the people rescuing others for the fun of it. Those people would (under real-world conditions) would be arrested and taken to jail. Since I don't have the option of having a police force near burning stations or rescue ships Solo is the only option for rescue ships.
When doing Power Play delivering stuff I play in Open because it's SUPPOSED to be players against players. I don't HAVE to, but it's nice to have the option, isn't it?
No, you're not going to gain any traction for "pushing Open only" 100% of the time. If you want 100% Open mode, go to SC or EVE.
Player-killers are ejected from the noob-zone. So no, new players are not being introduced to PvP - they are being given the chance* to constructively interact with other new players (and some older players who keep a noob-zone alt to provide help).
* Though it seems many don't use the game's woeful comms.
There is plenty of opportunity for consensual PvP - all you have to do is organise it. Even in the newcomer's forum you will find regular meetings of a "fight club" (sorry, can't talk about it
). It is about time that people realise that many of us don't want to be "content" for others and maybe they should try to work out why PvP in Elite is not a popular activity and go find another game if they can't be bothered to organise their own "fight club".
I agree with you in spirit. The tasks should match the things you want to engineer. Do you want to engineer mining lasers and other mining gear? Go mining first. Do you want to engineer your lasers? Kill 100 ships using lasers first. X4 does a way better job of this than Frontier. For example, if I want to unlock the drive research line (X4's equivalent to engineering), I need to basically "win a race" where I must go from point A to point B in so many seconds. It's like a real life mechanic saying, "You want me to put a turbocharger on your car? Prove to me you can handle it by driving on the track." This is way more immersive than a mechanic saying, "You want me to put a turbocharger on your car? Go smash 500 rocks with a pickaxe."
There's two threads here really.
The first could be seen as a typical "open only" one where we demand everyone play in open for the thrill of seal clubbing.
The second is more nuanced and is a request for Open Only content that would need a whole boatload of changes to work and is extremely unlikely given the lack of love shown to PvP previously.
Standard for the forums I guess.
The first could be seen as a typical "open only" one where we demand everyone play in open for the thrill of seal clubbing.
The second is more nuanced and is a request for Open Only content that would need a whole boatload of changes to work and is extremely unlikely given the lack of love shown to PvP previously.
Standard for the forums I guess.
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And here I thought it was all about engineering requirements making no sense at all... My bad, it's still very early!