Repeat the same Guardian unlock 18 times? Really?

[Bob McBobblehead]

The foundations of Elite Dangerous are built on grind. The Guardian stuff seems to be a focal point, but the whole game is based on it. Travelling to Colonia is a grind, the basic travel mechanics are a boring grind.

Travelling is the most used mechanic in the game, if anything this should be the top priority to make it more fun and less of a grind.

 

[Stigbob]

That's the problem with goals, people focus on them? Just imagine if the entire world revolved around never having goals to focus on, and thus never achieving anything. It's okay, we know how that looks; Frontier has provided a beautiful example.

I've unlocked all the ones I want and didn't find it fatal, I've also been having fun with them ever since. Other people who've unlocked some don't seem to think it's all so earth shatteringly terrible either.

The game is amazing; it just assumes focus and goals are an implausible notion and who even would, you know, want to progress. I guess if you live for repetitive mediocrity, it's nirvana.

Sounds like any video game. If you don't like it don't play it, it's only a big deal if that bothers you.

 

[Stigbob]

The problem is that even if you only want to unlock a single module, you have to repeat the mini-game up to 8 times. It’s not really practical to haul your butt all the way back out to Guardian territory all the time, so the most sensible solution is to just try to do all 8 runs in one go. That’s where the mind-numbing tedium begins.

You pretty much have a choice: 8 re-logs and repeats of the exact same simple mini-game, or 8 dull round-trips to the middle of nowhere, followed by the same simple mini-game.

Twenty five minutes, in a ship with decent jump range to get there. Three or four unlocks an hours if you relog (don't do that) two if you visit different sites and don't relog.

Easier than an anaconda, much easier than military rank.

 

[Tikanderoga]

That's a good point. What may have happened was that FD calculated how many Guardian materials someone would get in the course of that mission and set the module costs accordingly, not realising that people would just start relogging at one site.

Because that's much more immersive. [blah]
I think, everyone who unlocked the guardian weapons just did the unlock at a single site rather than visiting 12 sites.

 

[Stigbob]

Because that's much more immersive. [blah]
I think, everyone who unlocked the guardian weapons just did the unlock at a single site rather than visiting 12 sites.

I tried both ways for science. It's much more fun visiting different ones.

 

[DoppelGanger]

Twenty five minutes, in a ship with decent jump range to get there. Three or four unlocks an hours if you relog (don't do that) two if you visit different sites and don't relog.

Easier than an anaconda, much easier than military rank.

This is factually false. It will take an hour+ to get there, not 25 minutes. The jumps will take 25 minutes, yes, but the landing on the planet, finding the place by coordinates, finding a descent spot to land and so on will take an hour+ in total. That is fine, that is the game.

Also, you unlock one blueprint per session, not three or four, relogging is not a part of the game. It's cheating, similar to combat logging.

So, by design, you have to visit many Guardian locations and scan those, *without relogging*. This is what developers designed, unless switching modes has now become an official game mechanic.

It's factually a bad design decision to give player 1(!) option to achieve something, while also having to repeat the same thing 4 / 8 / 10 x Weapons/Modules amount of times. IT leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

 

[DoppelGanger]

I've unlocked all the ones I want and didn't find it fatal, I've also been having fun with them ever since. Other people who've unlocked some don't seem to think it's all so earth shatteringly terrible either.



Sounds like any video game. If you don't like it don't play it, it's only a big deal if that bothers you.

And that's the point, you are having fun with unlocked weapons, but the road to getting them is massive. It's a 500 mile drive through a highway without any diverging paths. Who would call that an amazing journey? It's even worse than an on rails MMO, where you move in a linear fashion, but at least the scenary/story/enemy is changing.

Also, I don't get FD, they want to attract more people (making tutorial comprehensable, progression is far easier than ever before, focusing on development where the most amount of people will enjoy aka combat and so on), but yet you say if you dont like it, dont play it? What if I don't like this aspect of repetitive unlocking and 80% of a playerbase agrees? What if only a small handful of CMDRs unlocked all guardian weapons? Is the game for a small handful of players who have no problem driving 500 miles in a straight line?

It's not subjective, it's a fact that it's a bad design decision for repetative gameplay which is only a gateway to the real meat of a game. Once you do it, you forget it forever.

And I understand that you already did those the hard way, your work will lose value once the blueprints become more easily achievable (and trust me, they will).

 

[Stigbob]

This is factually false. It will take an hour+ to get there, not 25 minutes. The jumps will take 25 minutes, yes, but the landing on the planet, finding the place by coordinates, finding a descent spot to land and so on will take an hour+ in total. That is fine, that is the game.

For you maybe, the landing was taken into account into the other timings I gave however. So it's still accurate, no matter what you claim.

Also, you unlock one blueprint per session, not three or four, relogging is not a part of the game. It's cheating, similar to combat logging.

In my post I gave unlocks per hour not per session. Maybe you need a coffee.

So, by design, you have to visit many Guardian locations and scan those, *without relogging*. This is what developers designed, unless switching modes has now become an official game mechanic.

Yes and I recommended people don't relog but visit different ones, what's your point ?.

It's factually a bad design decision to give player 1(!) option to achieve something, while also having to repeat the same thing 4 / 8 / 10 x Weapons/Modules amount of times. IT leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

If you don't like it don't do it.

And that's the point, you are having fun with unlocked weapons, but the road to getting them is massive. It's a 500 mile drive through a highway without any diverging paths. Who would call that an amazing journey? It's even worse than an on rails MMO, where you move in a linear fashion, but at least the scenary/story/enemy is changing.

I enjoyed it, I'm considering a third expedition out there. No rush though I'm enjoying the stuff I have already.

Also, I don't get FD, they want to attract more people (making tutorial comprehensable, progression is far easier than ever before, focusing on development where the most amount of people will enjoy aka combat and so on), but yet you say if you dont like it, dont play it? What if I don't like this aspect of repetitive unlocking and 80% of a playerbase agrees? What if only a small handful of CMDRs unlocked all guardian weapons? Is the game for a small handful of players who have no problem driving 500 miles in a straight line?

It's an optional recreational activity, if you don't like it you are either doing it wrong or doing the wrong thing in the first place. The game is for the people who enjoy it.

It's not subjective, it's a fact that it's a bad design decision for repetative gameplay which is only a gateway to the real meat of a game. Once you do it, you forget it forever.

Only if you grind at it all at once, I've still got loads to do out there.

And I understand that you already did those the hard way, your work will lose value once the blueprints become more easily achievable (and trust me, they will).

It wasn't work, it was playing a video game.

It wasn't hard, it was fun.

If they drop the requirements my reaction will be "good I'll go do that third expedition now".

 

[Tikanderoga]

Also, you unlock one blueprint per session, not three or four, relogging is not a part of the game. It's cheating, similar to combat logging.

So, by design, you have to visit many Guardian locations and scan those, *without relogging*. This is what developers designed, unless switching modes has now become an official game mechanic.

It's factually a bad design decision to give player 1(!) option to achieve something, while also having to repeat the same thing 4 / 8 / 10 x Weapons/Modules amount of times. IT leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

They also designed a button that lets you refresh the mission board without logging off and back in?
They also designed the game so it isn't just a repetitive endless grind?

The Module blueprints drop from one site only, and since you need 12 of them, where do you find the 11 other planets/sites to get them from?
Weapon blueprints drop from multiple sites, I'll give you that one.

 

[kofeyh]

TAlso, you unlock one blueprint per session, not three or four, relogging is not a part of the game.

Frontier designed a game where you are inserted where you last were on logout; this is fairly typical of games to do. This is, indeed, by design. If their own mechanics are ignorant of that, and in fact are optimally achieved when doing so, it would denote some assumptions have been made that do not match reality.

This isn't on the player to resolve, it's on Frontier to not have rampant repetition that's incredibly tone-deaf to the surroundings it is in. For example having a requirement for multiple blueprints from a single location in a game that restores you to your previous location on logon.

It's been five years like this; mechanics that seem entirely ignorant of the framework they are expected to operate in. To be honest, I don't really care anymore, but this was never on players to resolve; it's on Frontier to be cognisant of the outcomes of things they want people to do. Frontier doesn't 'dog-food' what they produce. And they probably should a little more

 

[MAUXUS]

No need, turns out it's nowhere near as bad as people make out.

Aaaaaaahahahahahahahahahahahah!!! Good one!

Edit: ...wait it was a joke, right?

 

[Stigbob]

They also designed a button that lets you refresh the mission board without logging off and back in?
They also designed the game so it isn't just a repetitive endless grind?

The Module blueprints drop from one site only, and since you need 12 of them, where do you find the 11 other planets/sites to get them from?
Weapon blueprints drop from multiple sites, I'll give you that one.

There are five module data locations that I know of, so far.

Frontier designed a game where you are inserted where you last were on logout; this is fairly typical of games to do. This is, indeed, by design. If their own mechanics are ignorant of that, and in fact are optimally achieved when doing so, it would denote some assumptions have been made that do not match reality.

This isn't on the player to resolve, it's on Frontier to not have rampant repetition that's incredibly tone-deaf to the surroundings it is in. For example having a requirement for multiple blueprints from a single location in a game that restores you to your previous location on logon.

It's been five years like this; mechanics that seem entirely ignorant of the framework they are expected to operate in. To be honest, I don't really care anymore, but this was never on players to resolve; it's on Frontier to be cognisant of the outcomes of things they want people to do. Frontier doesn't 'dog-food' what they produce. And they probably should a little more

After five years maybe you should accept the game is what it is, it's not going to change in any major way you need to be realistic.

You are doing that thing where you read an inaccurate gripe (see above) then repeat it like it's a fact because you lack the knowledge to fact check it. Maybe you should try to avoid that. That approach would kill this thread though.

 

[DoppelGanger]

For you maybe, the landing was taken into account into the other timings I gave however. So it's still accurate, no matter what you claim.

In my post I gave unlocks per hour not per session. Maybe you need a coffee.

Yes and I recommended people don't relog but visit different ones, what's your point ?.

If you don't like it don't do it.

I enjoyed it, I'm considering a third expedition out there. No rush though I'm enjoying the stuff I have already.

It's an optional recreational activity, if you don't like it you are either doing it wrong or doing the wrong thing in the first place. The game is for the people who enjoy it.

Only if you grind at it all at once, I've still got loads to do out there.

It wasn't work, it was playing a video game.

It wasn't hard, it was fun.

If they drop the requirements my reaction will be "good I'll go do that third expedition now".

Can you unlock more than 1 blueprint in one site? How?

How many sites are there and how many blueprints? Please enlighten me as you played the game as intended and surely have the knowledge.

"Only if you grind at it all at once" - Grind. Your words, not mine.

"It wasn't work, it was playing a video game." - Yes, operating the software is now called playing a videogame.

"It wasn't hard, it was fun." - Agree on the wasn't hard part. Nothing better than doing easy task for 20 hours.

 

[Franc Kaos]

Twenty five minutes, in a ship with decent jump range to get there. Three or four unlocks an hours if you relog (don't do that) two if you visit different sites and don't relog.
Easier than an anaconda, much easier than military rank.

So, you consider three hours to do ONE thing good gameplay? Just wow!

 

[Stigbob]

Can you unlock more than 1 blueprint in one site? How?

How many sites are there and how many blueprints? Please enlighten me as you played the game as intended and surely have the knowledge.

"Only if you grind at it all at once" - Grind. Your words, not mine.

"It wasn't work, it was playing a video game." - Yes, operating the software is now called playing a videogame.

"It wasn't hard, it was fun." - Agree on the wasn't hard part. Nothing better than doing easy task for 20 hours.

Twenty hours, lol. See fact checking above.

So, you consider three hours to do ONE thing good gameplay? Just wow!

How many have you done ?.

 

[DoppelGanger]

Twenty hours, lol. See fact checking above.



How many have you done ?.

Responding to questions as 'lol' is the best argument. Avoiding them even.

This is not even a discussion, this is internet waving, who has done more in-game or has no problem with game's issues.

EDIT: i pulled 20 hours out the blue, but unlocking all Guardian weapons/modules would take longer than that.

 

[Stigbob]

Responding to questions as 'lol' is the best argument. Avoiding them even.

This is not even a discussion, this is internet waving, who has done more in-game or has no problem with game's issues.

EDIT: i pulled 20 hours out the blue, but unlocking all Guardian weapons/modules would take longer than that.

I know you made it up, that's why it made me lol. See the rest of this thread and forum for more fictitious "problems".

I'm waving guardian weapons at you.

 

[DoppelGanger]

I know you made it up, that's why it made me lol. See the rest of this thread and forum for more fictitious "problems".

I'm waving guardian weapons at you.

So no answers to the questions I had, which you should have knowledge of as you already done those things and should know the answers.
Then this back and forth discussion is meaningless. Thank God FD doesn't read general forums, they are 90% filler.

Yes, waving guardian weapons... the equivalent of forum ..ehm. (it gets bigger in this thread)

It was the same situation with Engineers, people who done them all shouted that it's fine, then there comes a rework...
FD makes mistakes and they aknowledge them sometimes. FD Acknowledging the Guardian blueprint problem is just a matter of time and of course the people who shouted "Nay, it's good as it is" will be suddenly gone... hmmm

 

[Stigbob]

So no answers to the questions I had, which you should have knowledge of as you already done those things and should know the answers.
Then this back and forth discussion is meaningless. Thank God FD doesn't read general forums, they are 90% filler.

Yes, waving guardian weapons... the equivalent of forum ..ehm. (it gets bigger in this thread)

It was the same situation with Engineers, people who done them all shouted that it's fine, then there comes a rework...
FD makes mistakes and they aknowledge them sometimes. FD Acknowledging the Guardian blueprint problem is just a matter of time and of course the people who shouted "Nay, it's good as it is" will be suddenly gone... hmmm

Seriously do you blame FDEV for ignoring most of what gets said ?.

Even the people who actually play the game instead of just hanging around moaning for years after they stopped can't get their facts straight. Most of it is just rubbish. Real feedback gets washed away in a sea of tears.

Engineers V1 and V2 were both fine for me, it's a game I enjoy and I don't grind at it. I prefer V2 it's more convenient.

 

[DoppelGanger]

Seriously do you blame FDEV for ignoring most of what gets said ?.

Even the people who actually play the game instead of just hanging around moaning for years after they stopped can't get their facts straight. Most of it is just rubbish. Real feedback gets washed away in a sea of tears.

Engineers V1 and V2 were both fine for me, it's a game I enjoy and I don't grind at it. I prefer V2 it's more convenient.

What facts are wrong? There was a user Aussiedroid stating the same thing:

"I've perhaps spent 8 hours over 2 days on the mission, puzzle & prep, and have yet to unlock a module. I'm sure I am not min-maxing the puzzle & site, and I am collecting a lot of other guardian stuff, but those blueprint stall the whole process! Makes it much longer than it should be IMO."

I had the same experience, only left a small amount Guardian segments i think.

So, back to the questions:

Can you unlock more than 1 blueprint in one site? How?
How many sites are there and how many blueprints?