Repeat the same Guardian unlock 18 times? Really?

[VeefourLFC]

Just my opinion, worthless on this forum I know, but being invested in ED for a long time with a LEP and many many skins and kits, I have fell out of love with ED:

ED just needs a new game designer and lead, the last 12 months are full of nerfs and bugs with total ignorance towards the player base. Quince, Rhea, Skimmer missions, gold rushes are all good fun and get everybody in the same system and is a bit of laugh but nerfed due affecting the amazing BGS - a total fallacy.

Sandro's fixation with no being another 'Eve' and making a unique game has turned ED into a horrible buggy mess with little fun to be had. Board hopping is an exploit UNLESS Frontier have run out of ideas and imagination and it becomes a Guardian grind mechanic, then its OK.

ED from game design point of view is just poor, the complaints on this forum testify to that, so a number of the player base is getting bored and annoyed at constantly being ignored by the management and designers. Maybe if they listened a bit and got off their self righteous high horse they would not be generating such negativity.

I have unlocked the Guardian tech with the board hopping exploit/mechanic and now I am back checking the forums for a glimmer of fun to be had in this once great game.

I will no longer purchase skins, kits and cosmetics from the store as that is ED's primary focus now, cash grab as much as you can from a declining franchise, its cheap and lazy and Frontier does not deserve this loyal fanbase.

ED has incredible sound and graphics, such a shame that the game design is so lacking and the community management is so poor, for this reason I will no longer support any Frontier projects until they finish what they promised for ED.

Apologies for the rant, with ED I feel like I've just split from a long term girlfriend who boned my best mate.

 

[Zelos]

That's factually incorrect as DB himself said the average play time is 60 hours and 90% of people that bought the game aren't playing it anymore.

60 hours is not much for a game like Elite. About as much as you need to fly to the other end of the Galaxy and back.

I've played around 1000 hours now.

We need to stop fantasizing that we have this magical player base that are happy with the game because for years now, the game has been mostly defended by people who think all the game mechanics are perfectly fine and ED is the best game ever made. It's only in the last few months that the penny finally seems to be dropping and people are realising how little gameplay there actually is which is a good thing, because now at least we can sing from thew same song sheet and hopefully get some much needed improvment - we have Beyond now so hopefully FDev have some good ideas to get the game back in the game.

Sure, there are many issues, from the flight model over missing offline mode, the mediocre game engine to the frequent crashes. But I wonder if "missing gameplay/content" is really one of them?

People have been playing the predecessor Frontier - Elite II for many, many hours as well, which has far less content. And that hasn't been an issue either. So now they buy E and suddenly start to complain?

 

[Ian Skippy]

can I say I told you so now? I've said this more than once over the years. Cashing in on the "we want elite 4", train was a no brainer from a business point of view.

As I've also said not long ago - DB had 20 years to bring Elite 4 to us, but didn't; then crowdfunding becomes a serious thing and.."hey guys look I'm annoucing elite 4, just give me £2,000,000 and it's yours" and we the fans duly lose our minds and fall over ourselves to give him the money.

6 years on, now he's a millionaire and were still saying "where's X Y Z you said we were getting?"

It might not even be much of a stretch to say FDev are just treading water until SC kicks off.

I'd love to know what chris roberts truly feels about what's been going on with ED - if he has any sense he'll be watching so he can avoid any similar mistakes.

Chris Roberts wished he was in a position to make such mistakes. It would require people to play an actual game and complain about actual mechanics. Aliens? Traveling to other systems? Modifying your ship? Ancient ruins? AI? None of that exists.

You may want to do a quick reality check.

 

[Genus]

You may want to do a quick reality check.

I did one yesterday.

Just got notified it bounced.

I like this one.

It explains a lot:

Yes it does.

 

[Jex =TE=]

60 hours is not much for a game like Elite. About as much as you need to fly to the other end of the Galaxy and back.

I've played around 1000 hours now.



Sure, there are many issues, from the flight model over missing offline mode, the mediocre game engine to the frequent crashes. But I wonder if "missing gameplay/content" is really one of them?

People have been playing the predecessor Frontier - Elite II for many, many hours as well, which has far less content. And that hasn't been an issue either. So now they buy E and suddenly start to complain?

I seem to remember FE2 being a ton more fun than ED is. For a start, hyperjumping was a lot quicker, the panther clipper was hilarious when you basically made it invulnerable and watched ships explode on your hull. There were better missions too but I was also a kid back then so what worked then doesn't wash now.

If missing gameplay/content wasn't a thing, we wouldn't have Beyond and we wouldn't have thread after thread, for the last 4 years, complaining that ED is shallow and has no content.

 

[Mengy]

This might give you an idea.

Yeah, I’ve read the opinions there before. They explain a LOT of why Elite is the way it is, and why these seemingly obvious missteps in design with the game keep happening again and again. If you listen closely to certain Frontier livestreams and interviews you can actually notice it for yourself, the tunnel vision and reluctance to change direction. They aren’t mistakes, they are intended, and many of the actual devs at Frontier see it just like we the players do.

General Custer’s men followed his orders at the Battle of Little Bighorn, even though they were terrible orders and I’m sure a lot of his men disagreed with them. We all know how well that worked out.

 

[zimms]

I like this one.

It explains a lot:



Oof.

Yeah, let's ignore the positive majority and really focus on the rare negative anonymous post on the Internet.

 

[Jex =TE=]

Yeah, I’ve read the opinions there before. They explain a LOT of why Elite is the way it is, and why these seemingly obvious missteps in design with the game keep happening again and again. If you listen closely to certain Frontier livestreams and interviews you can actually notice it for yourself, the tunnel vision and reluctance to change direction. They aren’t mistakes, they are intended, and many of the actual devs at Frontier see it just like we the players do.

General Custer’s men followed his orders at the Battle of Little Bighorn, even though they were terrible orders and I’m sure a lot of his men disagreed with them. We all know how well that worked out.

And yet with that evidence right there, most of us aren't qualified to say that "making a game is easy or that we can't design a better game" lol.

 

[Genus]

Yeah, let's ignore the positive majority and really focus on the rare negative anonymous post on the Internet.

Could be worse. We could all get into the habit of classifying constructive feedback of this nature, something which is priceless to any forward thinking organisation looking to improve...as "negative anonymous internet posts".

Moreover, not ignoring the "positive majority" when required, is sometimes how very bad things happen. Also how good things happen when you recognise a productive consensus that does not have basis in mass hysteria, so you know...weigh it.

 

[zimms]

Sure, but it's still just cherry picking.

You pick one and say "See, everything's in shambles!"

I could now also pick another one and say "See, everything's fine!"

If an overwhelming amount says one thing, we shouldn't immediately assume that the minority is right. Because that's kind of what you're saying.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Yeah, I’ve read the opinions there before. They explain a LOT of why Elite is the way it is, and why these seemingly obvious missteps in design with the game keep happening again and again. If you listen closely to certain Frontier livestreams and interviews you can actually notice it for yourself, the tunnel vision and reluctance to change direction. They aren’t mistakes, they are intended, and many of the actual devs at Frontier see it just like we the players do.

General Custer’s men followed his orders at the Battle of Little Bighorn, even though they were terrible orders and I’m sure a lot of his men disagreed with them. We all know how well that worked out.

I have read them too. There are not that many, but they seem to be a mixed of not so good to very good. I would say the truth is probably somewhere in the middle.

Could be worse. We could all get into the habit of classifying constructive feedback of this nature, something which is priceless to any forward thinking organisation looking to improve...as "negative anonymous internet posts".

Moreover, not ignoring the "positive majority" when required, is sometimes how very bad things happen. Also how good things happen when you recognise a productive consensus that does not have basis in mass hysteria, so you know...weigh it.

Wish we got more constructive feedback, but alas the majority of what we seem to get these days is: This sucks

 

[Zeeman]

That's factually incorrect as DB himself said the average play time is 60 hours and 90% of people that bought the game aren't playing it anymore. We need to stop fantasizing that we have this magical player base that are happy with the game because for years now, the game has been mostly defended by people who think all the game mechanics are perfectly fine and ED is the best game ever made. It's only in the last few months that the penny finally seems to be dropping and people are realising how little gameplay there actually is which is a good thing, because now at least we can sing from thew same song sheet and hopefully get some much needed improvment - we have Beyond now so hopefully FDev have some good ideas to get the game back in the game.

Fine, let's say 30 hours. It's still significantly more than can be spent in SC at present. I'm not here to White Knight™, just to make th epoint that ED can actually be played. for a significant amount of time.

Z...

 

[Eldragon]

Yikes! Now ... if the first Guardian / Thargoid Mission to “go collect stuff/intel from this site” rewarded you with enough materials to get a couple of basic weapons and then the next one was “we need you to take out a Scout in this location” gave you enough for a slightly better weapon and then the next was “okay, a wing of scouts is attacking system <x>” which gave you enough for another rung ... and so on ... and so on ... culminating in “there’s a massive invasion force - get winged up and take ‘em down” for the final top notch stuff? THAT would be progression ... you’d do different missions, get some rewards along the way and the final “ultra rare” stuff would be both hard and require a wing.

The whole thing could be delivered via an Imperial / Federal Navy “Thargoid Joint Task Force” which would be like a hybrid faction/engineer: as you increase your rep (via missions and purchases) you unlock higher grade weapons/components AND the harder missions - which by there nature require the better weapons. Early missions get you 1D / 2D weapons, later ones reward you with access to the 3A/4A variants. That sort of thing.

Heck, it’s ALMOST a story yet nothing I’ve described there requires a different mechanic to what’s in the game now ...

This is a great idea and would be a lot of fun.

FDev could possibly make this happen without a huge amount of coding:

1- Make a new faction that only offers thargoid/guardian related missions.

2- Make those missions pay out guardian materials as an option the same way other missions pay out cash/rep/cargo/materials.

 

[Genus]

Wish we got more constructive feedback, but alas the majority of what we seem to get these days is: This sucks

Four years of apathy in reply will do that, to even the most objective of opinions.

 

[Zeeman]

Just my opinion, worthless on this forum I know, but being invested in ED for a long time with a LEP and many many skins and kits, I have fell out of love with ED:

ED just needs a new game designer and lead, the last 12 months are full of nerfs and bugs with total ignorance towards the player base. Quince, Rhea, Skimmer missions, gold rushes are all good fun and get everybody in the same system and is a bit of laugh but nerfed due affecting the amazing BGS - a total fallacy.

Sandro's fixation with no being another 'Eve' and making a unique game has turned ED into a horrible buggy mess with little fun to be had. Board hopping is an exploit UNLESS Frontier have run out of ideas and imagination and it becomes a Guardian grind mechanic, then its OK.

ED from game design point of view is just poor, the complaints on this forum testify to that, so a number of the player base is getting bored and annoyed at constantly being ignored by the management and designers. Maybe if they listened a bit and got off their self righteous high horse they would not be generating such negativity.

I have unlocked the Guardian tech with the board hopping exploit/mechanic and now I am back checking the forums for a glimmer of fun to be had in this once great game.

I will no longer purchase skins, kits and cosmetics from the store as that is ED's primary focus now, cash grab as much as you can from a declining franchise, its cheap and lazy and Frontier does not deserve this loyal fanbase.

ED has incredible sound and graphics, such a shame that the game design is so lacking and the community management is so poor, for this reason I will no longer support any Frontier projects until they finish what they promised for ED.

Apologies for the rant, with ED I feel like I've just split from a long term girlfriend who boned my best mate.

Quince? Heck... Let's go back to Robigo. A money maker that actually required a bit of effort. Smuggle "stuff" to a bunch of systems. Sure, take on 20 missions, but if you get scanned, you'll fail all the ones that are not yet handed in. Plenty of ships out chasing you, too. Even if it was a bit forced, at least it did required some effort, and it was, actually, kinda fun. It's how I made my Trade Elite - and I never got scanned - number of very close calls boosting through the letterbox, praying I'd make it before a scan finished, then flipping the ship and full throttle to avoid Teh Impaler™ at the back of the station... I really enjoyed those moments, and actually felt like I earned my cash.

Never did understand why they nerfed that one.

Z...

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Four years of apathy in reply will do that, to even the most objective of opinions.

Then stop being apathetic then.

 

[Ian Skippy]

Quince? Heck... Let's go back to Robigo. A money maker that actually required a bit of effort. Smuggle "stuff" to a bunch of systems. Sure, take on 20 missions, but if you get scanned, you'll fail all the ones that are not yet handed in. Plenty of ships out chasing you, too. Even if it was a bit forced, at least it did required some effort, and it was, actually, kinda fun. It's how I made my Trade Elite - and I never got scanned - number of very close calls boosting through the letterbox, praying I'd make it before a scan finished, then flipping the ship and full throttle to avoid Teh Impaler™ at the back of the station... I really enjoyed those moments, and actually felt like I earned my cash.

Never did understand why they nerfed that one.

Z...

The payouts even were significantly lower than many of the more recent cadh cows. Still, oths clearly were bugs and exploits, and complaing you stopped liking the game because fd fixed some exploits is a bit daft. In normal gameplay you earn tons of money, ED clearly listened to the playerbase. The 'I need at least 100m cr/hr' stuff is silly.

 

[Eldragon]

Quince? Heck... Let's go back to Robigo. A money maker that actually required a bit of effort. Smuggle "stuff" to a bunch of systems. Sure, take on 20 missions, but if you get scanned, you'll fail all the ones that are not yet handed in. Plenty of ships out chasing you, too. Even if it was a bit forced, at least it did required some effort, and it was, actually, kinda fun. It's how I made my Trade Elite - and I never got scanned - number of very close calls boosting through the letterbox, praying I'd make it before a scan finished, then flipping the ship and full throttle to avoid Teh Impaler™ at the back of the station... I really enjoyed those moments, and actually felt like I earned my cash.

Never did understand why they nerfed that one.

Z...

Robigo was incredibly fun. Yes it was possible to get rich doing it, but it required effort, time, and skill.

Compare that to how things are now:

Where destroying ships in a CZ pays less than hauling garbage between stations.

 

[Zeeman]

The payouts even were significantly lower than many of the more recent cadh cows. Still, oths clearly were bugs and exploits, and complaing you stopped liking the game because fd fixed some exploits is a bit daft. In normal gameplay you earn tons of money, ED clearly listened to the playerbase. The 'I need at least 100m cr/hr' stuff is silly.

I don't think Robigo was an exploit, as I said, it actually required some effort and skill. Ceos and Sothis, on the other hand... Hauling poop 500LY to earn 60m cr/hr, with no risk? That one came after Robigo, too...

Z...

 

[tolm]

This is a great idea and would be a lot of fun.

FDev could possibly make this happen without a huge amount of coding:

1- Make a new faction that only offers thargoid/guardian related missions.

2- Make those missions pay out guardian materials as an option the same way other missions pay out cash/rep/cargo/materials.

Exactly - how hard can it be?

Whilst they were at it - could update Engineers to give you missions as well: go scan this planet 200LY away and I’ll give you materials to G3 your FSD. That sort of thing. Make you feel you’re doing something “useful” rather than arbitrarily searching for “stuff”.