Newcomer / Intro safety while in supercruise

[Esteban]

I've been wondering about travel in supercruise. All of us know too well that we can be (and are) interdicted during this mode of travel. Advice often given is to take a circuitous route (rather than a straight-line route) to the destination to avoid interference. But what about being able to reach me while in SC? Allow me to explain with an example (a classic):

I'm headed to Hutton Orbital; many of you know that this station is a whopping 6,397,067 light-seconds from the system's drop-in point, the Alpha Centauri star. Ok, I arrive in Alpha Centauri and take off towards Hutton. A good 1/2 hour (arbitrary elapsed time) into the journey, I'm cruising along at >1500c. I'm well past the stations that are close to the drop-in point. I'm essentially untouchable right? I don't need to worry about taking some non-direct path.

Who's gonna catch me (and how)? I mean, if a potential pursuer must drop into the system at the same drop-in point or if you're at Hutton as a starting point to intercepting me, it certainly can't happen spontaneously as it often appears to - particularly when you've just started your trek from the drop-in point or as you slow in order to approach a station.

Until I slow down, allowing someone to close the distance, I'm safe aren't I? Thinking out loud...

 

[Dommarraa]

Pretty much yes.
Not sure if a really skilled player group could come out of normal space to sc at exactly the right point to be able to get you, but NPC's can't get you till you are slowing down.

 

[Stabby_Dave]

I've heard that some CMDRs deliberately do the "loop of shame", so that they're facing their attacker when they're slowing down. No idea whether it actually works, though.

 

[Tyres O'Flaherty]

I've had an interdiction (in solo) almost immediately after entering the system. I've also had one mid-range before hitting the seven-second-75% throttle too. And once, I was almost in orbit heading to a planetary base - but that broke off pretty quickly after the purp said something about not wanting to commit suicide. Odd one, that.

Also, the cops like to interdict you just because.

 

[aRJay]

There is another reason to loop out of the orbital plane of a system, the velocity you can reach in supercruise is dependent on the gravity from nearby objects such as asteroid clusters planets and stars if you travel outside the plane of the system you maximise your distance from such bodies so minimise the gravity effects. Doing this going to Hutton can get you to the maximum cruise velocity of 2001c.

 

[Vetinari]

Interdictors are based on time not distance, so they have to be within 15-7s of you to start interdicting. buy one and test it, see how easy it is compared to avoiding one. Can interdict on pretty much back third of ship from above or below, don't need to be exactly behind at all. That's why most hang round the entry or exit point to SC (star or station) as they can easily manoeuvre behind you as you slow down, the moment you stop evading and aim at the station they have a sitting duck to hit and its not hard as they don't have to be 'behind' you. They can start at the station, see you coming, fly towards and 'behind' you and theres little you can do if at some point you want to point at the station and actually get there you have to travel in a straight line or vector.

So they would have to be matching approx. speed to get to the relevant seconds behind you.

Theoretically they could run at 50% SC on the route, wait for victims and speed up to interdict, even the ones coming head on. Starting from normal space would probably take too long.

They can turn around in SC just as easily as you can so can follow you around depending on their ship. Loop of shame will lose some but not all by any means. Sometimes gives the perfect opportunity as you and they turn to start the interdiction as youre presenting the back third of your ship to them as they turn and have stopped flying 'away' from them directly.

The easiest and quickest by far usually is simply to do your own journey/game, submit and wake out, usually takes about 15-20s all told and you're back in your game and they should have a 20s cooldown longer than yours, don't panic and it becomes routine ABC. Problem is when they chain interdict as you come back into SC and with 3 of them they can keep doing it constantly which just gets tedious near the station.

Its much easier for them to interdict you than for you to avoid it, its much easier for you to learn how to evade after submitting than it is for them to do anything in the approx 10 seconds they have to stop you even with chaining they can never have an impact if you do it right doesn't matter how good they are they wont get the opportunity. Choose your battles or your battleground and good luck either way.

Of course the other option is to get a cheap chip and fight back, expect to lose or Brave Sir Robin but have fun, on your terms and only when you choose.

 

[Esteban]

This was just thinking out loud. The interdiction game is played (by me anyway) the way I choose to play it at each instant. I've gotten proficient at evading interdiction attempts. When the NPC is worthwhile ($), or I feel like playing it that way, I submit and the NPC is eliminated for the bounty. I have fun, always. This is mostly a benefit of chaining black box missions early-on in my ED days and getting lots of evasion practice.
Practice at submit-and-escape from live cmdr interdictions is more rare, so I could probably practice those maneuvers deliberately to become more confident. As we know interactions with real players are completely different than NPCs (who are far less individual and creative in their behavior).

I love some of the replies and suggestions here. I'm definitely going to try some of these and have some fun with them.

Happy travels, CMDRs!

 

[Ah Clem]

As far as avoiding interdictions in the first place the method I use is this:

1. When entering the system I roll perpendicular to the plane of the ecliptic.
2. I put my target on the left edge of my viewscreen and keep it there. I use the left edge so I can see the time to target.
3. Travel at 100% throttle as my flight path describes a logarithmic curve through the system. This gets me out of the shipping lane and into deep space fairly quickly. If I'm feeling nervous I can yaw a little more to the right and enter deep space quicker. Then I put my target back on the edge of the screen.
4. When I get to 7 seconds time to target I drop to 75% throttle, roll left, pitch up a bit and dive straight in.
5. If there's a lot of traffic sometimes I'll do barrel rolls such that my central mouse widget swirls around outside the target circle. I'm not sure if this helps or not but it's fun.
6. For a station or outpost, I'll get the prompt to drop out of supercruise at 1.00Mm. I go full throttle until I get within the no fire zone then hit the brakes and request docking.

Assumptions:

1. I think the chances for NPC interdictions vary depending on whether you are near the central star, in the shipping lane, or in deep space. I could be wrong about this. If anyone has some hard data about the probabilities of interdiction in different areas, please enlighten me.
2. A barrel roll, as opposed to an aileron roll, can be effective in preventing an NPC from locking on for an interdiction. Again, I could be wrong.

 

[Vetinari]

I think both of your assumptions are wrong but others will confirm.

NPCs can pop into existence right behind you pretty much anywhere, even mining on edges of bubble and nearly always within 1 system of inhabited. NPCs have their own rules including twins and triplets with the same name attacking you repeatedly with full shields after they wake out with low hull. Don't think it matters to NPCs whether you are in the shipping lane or not.
You only need 1 second to lock on if that to interdict, you only need one chance. Barrel rolls I don't think will defeat the NPC or the player as worst case scenario you will be rolling into and out of target lock so I just hit it when you are in. Best case you are just spinning in front of me with no effect whatsoever.

How far away are you at 7s on average when you aim at target? 800 LS ish? So all I got to do is wait 800LS ish from the station and come out to you whichever direction you're coming from knowing that you'll have to turn into the station at some point if you want to land and be slowing down and Ill easily be within 7 seconds of you. Even better assuming you submit or I win or you fight you will 99% of the time end up further away from the station than when you started and youll have to start from 0 speed with massive gravity effects from the planet so it will be nice and easy to keep interdicting as youll never get enough time to get far enough away.

OP - you can practice submit and escape on NPCS, the routine is the same, just a bit easier as no worry about Grom bombs etc. Practice on NPCS then when got the routine right and its ABC you're ready for players. I dont even high wake usually, its that easy, unless the mass lock factor is 23 and they are in a fast enough ship to keep it active, in which case it gets really boring.

 

[d8veh]

That's right. Interdictions from NPCs are no problem if you plan for them. All you need is A-rated thrusters and power distributor, and some minimal shields. I never even think about avoiding interdictions - I just fly the fastest route to the station. If I get interdicted, I submit, boost, boost again, get my FSD going and stick my finger up. If I have a slow ship, I drop a heatsink after the first boost to break target lock. In case of multiple interdictions, bi-weave shields are better than A or C-rated ones.

 

[Esteban]

I've had little difficulty evading NPCs even in the type 6 that I had for a while. If you don't feel like it, this saves a lot of time over submitting, escaping, getting back into SC and accelerating.

@Vetinari : you're right, that mass-lock factor 23 does get boring. I see that often after combat. The security forces in their anacondas seem to follow and I'm like: please let me leave, why are you following me, your scans are done, this is boring.

@Ah Clem : Sounds like it would be fun to see a video of your method, but I'll play with that too. I usually just go straight* but I know that's not the best when it comes to non-NPC tactics.
* not entirely - I do watch what's going on. You can spot behavior on the scanner pretty readily.

@d8veh : You give 'em the finger? I like that!

 

[A C Ender]

NPC interdictions are annoying but trivial. The real challenge is avoiding players.

If I'm on the last jump of my journey and I have any reason to suspect hostile player activity, I will fly in close to the star as soon as I jump in, throttle to 0 and place the back of my ship towards the star to stop or make it hard for anyone to interdict me. This give me time to assess the system, look for hostile, and plan when to start my journey and in what direction. It also give me time to plot an escape system if I need to high wake.

If there are players I suspect are hostile, I will start to head for deep space, but at all times try to maintain anyone who may follow me on the front half-sphere of my ship. Realistically you can't keep them in front, so what I try to do is keep any chaser perpendicular to me. It usually takes extensive manoeuvres to maintain a chaser perpendicular to you, bit eventually you will be in deep space at high speed with them deep in gravity wells, usually making them stop the chase and let you plot your approach from deep space. I usually seek to approach perpendicular to the orbital plane, or from the further side, wherever is further from the gravity wells, and further from the possible interdictors.

If you want to be really advanced, at this point you would activate SCA but not align it and maintain 100% throttle. On approach I keep my destination in the middle between the "align trajectory" symbol and my trajectory. I pitch to line up my trajectory at 7 sec remaining. The SCA will activate with a second or 2 delay (not timed it), and you will approach at very high speed. If done right, SCA will drop you out at station at speeds significantly faster than possible manually. If too late, you will be forced to do a loop of shame, as the SCA will fail to drop you. This is the legitimate time saving way to use SCA, where the typical is just allowing AFK.

 

[d8veh]

I've had little difficulty evading NPCs even in the type 6 that I had for a while. If you don't feel like it, this saves a lot of time over submitting, escaping, getting back into SC and accelerating.

That might be so, but there's very little in it. Sometimes it takes a long time for the mini-game to decide who's won the interdiction when you fight it. Occasionally, you'll mess up and lose the interdiction mini-game, which not only wastes a lot of time, but also leaves you in a very dangerous situation. Submitting and running is relatively predictable, both in terms of time and outcome.

 

[Para Handy]

That might be so, but there's very little in it. Sometimes it takes a long time for the mini-game to decide who's won the interdiction when you fight it. Occasionally, you'll mess up and lose the interdiction mini-game, which not only wastes a lot of time, but also leaves you in a very dangerous situation. Submitting and running is relatively predictable, both in terms of time and outcome.

... but it does have the disadvantage that the interdicting scumbag can keep on attaching a tether again and again until you get into the station's instance. I tend to play the mini--game for that reason unless I can see that the malefactor is easy-meat, at which point I submit and take them out or in high-sec systems tease them just out of 3km range until the fuzz turn-up and then join in. (BTW - only tried mini-game in a T-9 once, mistake, iron-man clear-save, never bought a T-9 again.)

 

[d8veh]

... but it does have the disadvantage that the interdicting scumbag can keep on attaching a tether again and again until you get into the station's instance. I tend to play the mini--game for that reason unless I can see that the malefactor is easy-meat, at which point I submit and take them out or in high-sec systems tease them just out of 3km range until the fuzz turn-up and then join in. (BTW - only tried mini-game in a T-9 once, mistake, iron-man clear-save, never bought a T-9 again.)

I agree. If it's a long way to the station, I occasionally change tactics, but, in most cases it's only one interdiction. When jumping system to system, there is only one interdiction attempt.

 

[aRJay]

I agree. If it's a long way to the station, I occasionally change tactics, but, in most cases it's only one interdiction. When jumping system to system, there is only one interdiction attempt.

Yes but some are reckless enough to take missions or even stack them which can lead to multiple interdictors dropping on you as you try to escape which can get tedious.

 

[d8veh]

Yes but some are reckless enough to take missions or even stack them which can lead to multiple interdictors dropping on you as you try to escape which can get tedious.

It reminds me of the old Robigo smuggling. In those days, it was much harder to win interdictions against NPCs, which is where many of us honed our skills at escaping from the hoards of interdictors. As I had 100% success rate, I've never changed. Call me a Luddite if you want.

 

[Thwarptide]

There one system I go into quite frequently on a mission. I can always expect interdiction. It never fails when you go there. Much of the time, no matter how well I fly the escape vector, they stop me. I can either run easily en, not wanting to be bothered with it or scramble their hulls before they run. They usually gank me when I get Close to the mission objective while slowing down.
Today I got the signs he was on to my presence, smack talking. But I could see him 4-5 km on my tail. So I did tried a few slow evasive maneuvers in SC and shook him. Staying well out of the shipping lanes I made it to within 2ls of port and he ganked me.
I've tried going to another location in the system and then to the objective. Same thing.
He just gets their first and waits
So you can fly far away from the shipping lanes, bop around the system all you want.
If the npc is gonna grab you, he will. How you deal him is up to you.
I had 3 deliveries in one system. This day the NPC was in a ship I couldn't handle in a fair fight. So I ran. In all three stops he ganked me 5 times.
Persistent lil creep.