This is not an argument. The gaming space is a kind of isolated environment, which should have rules. And it has them. But the problem is that they are not respected and do not work. And this is the most important factor for any online game. And in pvp this is especially noticeable. In fact, I do not care what 99% of the players do, It doesn't matter, what matters is that allowed cheating is bad PR for the game. I love open, but under these conditions, it soon won't be anyone left except gankers and cheaters.
Same old song about cheaters
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This is not an argument. The gaming space is a kind of isolated environment, which should have rules. And it has them. But the problem is that they are not respected and do not work. And this is the most important factor for any online game. And in pvp this is especially noticeable. In fact, I do not care what 99% of the players do, It doesn't matter, what matters is that allowed cheating is bad PR for the game. I love open, but under these conditions, it soon won't be anyone left except gankers and cheaters.
I come back around to the big question:
What do you lose? So you're denied the satisfaction of seeing someone blow up. You'll never present an argument to me that will make me sympathize. I will continue to say "Get over it, you won by default."
Please demonstrate how this impacts your ability to play the game, and clearly demonstrate material or virtual losses that affect you directly. I'll also need to see the receipts from your therapist that demonstrate the emotional damage you have suffered from this as well.
And if someone does this to NPC's - I'm going to have to ask that you clearly demonstrate, complete with irrefutable facts and actual data how this has any impact on you.
Everyday millions of people cheat - at games, on their spouses, on their taxes - most of these have no impact on our daily lives, and of the few that actually do, where is the outrage there? Where is the call to action?
Instead we're worried about someone pulling the plug on their internet connection that deprives someone else of some little satisfaction? Really?
And I'd think FD has far more important matters to turn their attentions to, like getting the servers stable and running smooth, fixing bugs that actually do break gameplay and developing new material. It's not like this is a subscription-based, pay-to-play, kill-all-the-other-clans-for-chinese-gold-and-stroke-your-epeen game. They've got our money already. If a bunch of disgruntled PvP'er quit, they didn't lose anything, except the space they take up in the forums complaining about... wait for it... nothing.
Perhaps somewhere out in year 11 of the 10 year plan, there might be a footnote to have a meeting and mention that a few people in a minority group complained that this was a problem, but I wouldn't hold my breath.
What do you lose? So you're denied the satisfaction of seeing someone blow up. You'll never present an argument to me that will make me sympathize. I will continue to say "Get over it, you won by default."
Please demonstrate how this impacts your ability to play the game, and clearly demonstrate material or virtual losses that affect you directly. I'll also need to see the receipts from your therapist that demonstrate the emotional damage you have suffered from this as well.
And if someone does this to NPC's - I'm going to have to ask that you clearly demonstrate, complete with irrefutable facts and actual data how this has any impact on you.
Everyday millions of people cheat - at games, on their spouses, on their taxes - most of these have no impact on our daily lives, and of the few that actually do, where is the outrage there? Where is the call to action?
Instead we're worried about someone pulling the plug on their internet connection that deprives someone else of some little satisfaction? Really?
And I'd think FD has far more important matters to turn their attentions to, like getting the servers stable and running smooth, fixing bugs that actually do break gameplay and developing new material. It's not like this is a subscription-based, pay-to-play, kill-all-the-other-clans-for-chinese-gold-and-stroke-your-epeen game. They've got our money already. If a bunch of disgruntled PvP'er quit, they didn't lose anything, except the space they take up in the forums complaining about... wait for it... nothing.
Perhaps somewhere out in year 11 of the 10 year plan, there might be a footnote to have a meeting and mention that a few people in a minority group complained that this was a problem, but I wouldn't hold my breath.
Ugh... when people coming into this debate without the bare minimum coverage of information as to what effect the central topic has on what aspects of the game...It used to make me more irritated, but the more I see it the funnier it gets for me.So...*Chuckles in the background*
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And again, philosophy, tautology, demagoguery. The real world? Tax fraud and cheating wives? Seriously? And no argument on the subject matter. Everything is clearly explained. There is a problem with unfair play? Yes. But you do not seem from those who can offer a solution, or to remain silent if you have nothing to say on the matter, but you can tell a lot about why the problem can not be solved. Useless.
I'd like if they would fix powerplay, and engineers (thanks for starting that with module storage finally), and late-game-income (now that rewards for delivery are reduced), and make exploring a valid way to play, etc. etc.
People with flaky connections would be *very* grouchy at most likely fixes for combat logging.
<passes Gluttony a lulzbucket>
it's funnier for me when people refuse to grasp the most basic concepts behind the technology - "Keep the ships in instance for X seconds because game Y does it!" or "Ban player from doing X with his/her Y in MY precious gametime!" etc.
it's funnier for me when people refuse to grasp the most basic concepts behind the technology - "Keep the ships in instance for X seconds because game Y does it!" or "Ban player from doing X with his/her Y in MY precious gametime!" etc.
Oh, I forgot to tell you, I finally am taking that intro course for network, it's super fun, I actually know bits and pieces about how it works now. I also realized how deep the well goes, so my salute to you for sticking with it and making a career out of it. o7And ops I just derailed didn't I .-.?
1.7 million players and you care about 0,00000000000000000000000000000000001% of them? You must be bored.
Definitely also true, but those doing it in those situations only really affect themselves, and while definitely an issue, is not as pressing, but should also be figured out how to solve, I think the simple conclusion would be increasing how often the game 'saves' when you are not in supercruise, right now it seems to be mostly on entering/exiting supercruise, however if this was increased, and it also included the people in instance, npc's and such, then they would reload and find themselves in the same situation?
And when I ask a question and get a politician's answer, I lose even more sympathy for their cause, even if it's not a cause I support. So either spell it out, line by line, or concede that this does not have any impact on you. But talking around the question, campaigning and selling your book just doesn't cut it. Answer the question.
Because the tears of wannabee pvpers that think blowing up and unarmed trader is pvp are the sweetest.
No, i've never combat logged OR been blown up as I do not do open I just find high amusement in the irony of the situation.
No, i've never combat logged OR been blown up as I do not do open I just find high amusement in the irony of the situation.
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Very much this. There's an awful lot of hyperbole here with very little in the way of practical insight or suggestions on how to even define combat logging. I see the same thing on 'griefing' threads.
We all agree Combat logging is bad (m'kay), and so is griefing. Yes there are minutiae over which the belligerent can points score against each other, but how about an actual, workable solution?
They are hard to pin down, so define the terms, in a rule based way that can be automated. You are all apparently experienced at seeing it, so define it.
I have resorted to combat logging a bunch of times against NPCs.
Not because of rebuy cost, but after 5-6 interdictions on my route to a Starport or Outpost, and in all cases they didn't even scratch my shields before I low-waked away from them. It became an annoyance, so, yeah, I combat logged in the hopes of actually getting to my destination that should have taken 10 minutes, but ended up being 30 minutes instead.
So far, though, in Guardians, I have not seen this repeated behaviour of NPCs.
Not because of rebuy cost, but after 5-6 interdictions on my route to a Starport or Outpost, and in all cases they didn't even scratch my shields before I low-waked away from them. It became an annoyance, so, yeah, I combat logged in the hopes of actually getting to my destination that should have taken 10 minutes, but ended up being 30 minutes instead.
So far, though, in Guardians, I have not seen this repeated behaviour of NPCs.
Since I do not play in Open these days, my guess is that combat loggers use it as a countermeasure to the Engineered weapons.
They are cool and all, but, man... it made the game so unbalanced at the same time.
Since I do not play in Open these days, my guess is that combat loggers use it as a countermeasure to the Engineered weapons.
They are cool and all, but, man... it made the game so unbalanced at the same time.
People were CLing way before Engineers. I'm sure it hasn't helped the situation, but it's not a root cause.
I'm interested in Kerrash's thoughts on the question s/he posed, and why they asked. And I suppose what kind of answer they were expecting to get that wouldn't simply exacerbate the argument.
The well is 7 layers deep... mostly
But you can make a career out of networking without ever getting below layer 3
Oh! Oh! Can I?
Because this is interpreted to mean: "I will play my way, by my rules, and everyone else is obligated to play by my rules, or they are cheating."
[argument]Won[/argument]
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Saying something isn't an argument doesn't make it so. Really. I simply fail to see the problem. Perhaps it comes from me neither taking the game too seriously nor really giving even the tiniest crap about what other people do in the game.
It's only an issue if you take your gaming too seriously.
"He should be punished - he started playing tennis, then decided he didn't want to play any more, put his racket away and went home." What a ... person who went home. In sport, as in the game, if your opponent takes his ball and goes home, you win. All this nonsense -- and it is utter nonsense -- about penalties and open and solo and gankers and the combined webvomit of thousands of people... all stems from somepeople trying to take a pastime into the real lives of the people they play against. I call bullocks.
UNCLENCH.
With regard to the first point here, you're dead wrong - gaming is in no way an isolated environment; such things don't exist. The basic demonstration of this point (although it depresses me to have to make it) is that when I, or anyone else, play a game, I (and anyone else) do it at my (or their) pleasure. If the way you play the game displeases me, I won't play with you, regardless of any previous choices that I have made. Suck it up.
Inasmuch as the developers don't -- like really don't -- see a particular need to address this issue in the way that you want them to, as evidenced by their lack of action on the "issue," I would suggest that the "rules" don't really mean much. Oh well. Strangely, it doesn't stop me enjoying the game in any way.
Which suggests that they're not rules then...
The most important factor for any game is that people enjoy it. Rules are determined by practice, not principle. The existence of politicians would be intolerable otherwise.
Which doesn't address the point that if you PvP and your opponent combat logs, you've won.
Me too.
Nonsense - I've never combat logged, don't agree with you in any way, and still only play open. If open is dead, it's not because FD have failed to make the game you want to play.
I'm still worried that there is a large correlation between people who want solo to disappear, combat logging to be "punished" and irrational concerns about where men put their willies.
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