seperate Coaster ENTRANCE & EXIT Stations

The coaster train will leave the ENTRANCE station, where the park guests entered the coaster to take their ride and finally arrive at the EXIT station to leave the ride. The empty train can be refilled at the ENTRANCE station, so that new guests don't have to wait until the train is completely empty, because all riders has left the coaster beforehand.
 
Yeah, I don't see how this improves the time - they still have to wait for the coaster to empty, it just empties somewhere else and then travels empty.
 
It does not improve the time, but it improves capacity (money) significantly.
This feature would be especially useful for multi-train coasters with long trains which currently cause significant long waiting times in the game.
 
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If it doesn't improve time, how does it improve capacity?
Capacity is only improved by shortening time.
What needs shortened, is the time it takes for the peeps to exit the ride. They walk too slow.
Having a second station, the train more than likely, wouldn't move until the station is clear of people.
This would take the same amount of time for one station. Now the train has to move to the next station, making it take longer.
 
Separate loading and unloading stations are critical. I can't believe they haven't been patched in yet.

The way I tend to approach multiple stations is to try and get the loading and unloading stations to perform their functions simultaneously. This allows a third train to be out on the coaster circuit. It also ensures that a full train is always ready to go up the lift hill. The result is always more guests on the ride and quicker queue times. There is no need to wait for passengers to exit the exit station. Once they're out of the train it's free to move on, and nobody is stuck waiting in the train like they are now should multiple trains try to occupy the station.
 
They are not "critical".

Real life example...

The Beast at Kings Island.
Has a throughput of about 1200 peeps an hour.
Runs three trains holding 36 people, each.
It's a 7,359 ft long coaster, and the ride lasts over 4 minutes.

1200 divided by 36 is 33 trains running per hour.
60 minutes divided by 33 trains equals 1.81.

The Beast load time is 2 minutes (rounded up).

Now, how unrealistic is Planet Coaster?
 
If it doesn't improve time, how does it improve capacity?
Capacity is only improved by shortening time.
What needs shortened, is the time it takes for the peeps to exit the ride. They walk too slow.
Having a second station, the train more than likely, wouldn't move until the station is clear of people.
This would take the same amount of time for one station. Now the train has to move to the next station, making it take longer.
You'd be correct if If you were running a coaster with a single train. But for a multi-train coaster, capacity is determined by the time of the longest block.
If you design a high capacity coaster, the longest block is the station. If you are able to separate the loading from the unloading into 2 blocks, each individual block is shorter.

Let's pretend Frontier only do the lazy implementation and not fix the slow walk out issue, but implement separate entrance & exit station using the exact same station geometry as the current station.
The trains entrance and exit time is exactly the same in both stations,
We can clearly see the benefit at the entrance station because the current animation for boarding is absurdly short.
The in the exit station, it would not need to do the boarding animation before moving the train to the next platform.

In the current game. Loading the trains is absurdly short, and unloading the trains is absurdly long.
So in the best case scenario (through station with optimal exit placement), the benefit is only a couple of seconds. (but it's still a welcome improvement)
However, you also need to consider the case of the same side entrance & exit : it is clearly unusable in the current station design, but with separate entrance and exit stations, you now can obtain the same performance as with through stations.

Then there is the creative aspect of being able to decorate the stations differently before and after the station, or be able to exit at a different height to shorten the chain lift (but that's a different issue).
 
I do know how blocks work, and proper timing.
I am referencing multi train coasters.
I gave a real life example of a coaster that has a 2 minute load time. I thinks that's longer than anything in PlanCo.

I agree peeps need to hurry up to the exit. You are right, the time savings isn't that great.
I am all for second stations, but not for increasing though put, because it really wont. I am all for using them for your given reasons.

"In the current game. Loading the trains is absurdly short, and unloading the trains is absurdly long."
But, ,but, but....if you lengthened the load time, and shortened the exit time...you come up with about the same time, no? [wink]

The same side entrance/exit stations is a choice people can make. They exist, I guess (I've never seen one) . I haven't been all over, but the few parks I have been two, I have never seen a "same side" station, nor a second station, except space mountain? That's two stations, right? Oh, I think Wicked Twister is a same side station?

So, honestly it seems we are on the same page, but for different reasons.

I looked up Smiler, and it runs 960 people an hour, runs 3 trains, 16 people per train, so 20 trains per hour...for a 3 minute load time(?)
I would LOVE to have real life figures for this. Three minutes seems too long to me? But if these figures are correct, PlanCo is already faster than real life.
 
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This is what I want to see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSEdMfzHKXc

Skip to the end to see the stations loading and unloading. With the 2 trains the 1st train cannot load fast enough that the 2nd 1 is back and unloading, then when the one has finished unloading the next train is ready. By have the loading and unloading times happening at the same time you essentially half the time it takes to load and unload a train + a little extra for the train 2 move forward a few feet.

I think the loading time should be made a little longer in PlanCo but that would need improved animations of people getting in their seat. I don't care about the time it takes per say but I like seeing people constantly moving and boarding instead of what we have now with 1 slow poke wandering the whole length of the station to leave and the station becoming a stand still haha
 
I have never seen same side single station being used at theme parks, but I have seen it many times at temporary fairgrounds. The station size it at a premium because they move the entire ride by truck every month, so they need to design it the station for minimum hardware use.

I do not know if Space Mountain (US version) uses same side stations because I do not remember the layout of the footpaths inside the building (I went there 25 years ago). The Paris version is completely different (parallel dual through station, like Big Thunder Mountain).

However I do know for sure that Rock & Roller Coaster uses 2 stations with entrance and exit on the same side.

According to Wikipedia, the ride duration is approx 1:20, I have seen other sources saying 1:10 (not including the station loading and unloading of course), has 4 trains (technically 5 trains but in day to day usage it only uses 4 simultaneously on the track).
Most of the time, the ride has :
-1 train in the entrance station loading people
-1 train in the initial section (countdown, launch and the first loop)
-1 train somewhere on the "road"/"stage" aka the main big dark building with the light show (3 blocks)
-1 train in the exit station unloading people

In order to make sure the train won't stop in the track building, loading and unloading operations should each take significantly less than a minute (loading is the longest part because of the harness safety check)
However, I have sometimes experienced the ride where there were hiccups and the vehicle was maintained for slightly longer than usual in the initial section (before launch) or in the final brake run at the end of the 2nd block in the building.

------- I've got an idea to know the exact tining ------
There are plenty of videos on youtube of the launch section filmed by people waiting in the queue, we should be able to get the actual timing from them.

EDIT : Most of the videos I found filmed in the queue are cut between launches. But I have found a video during a ride re-launch after a malfunction with an uninterrupted showing 3 consecutive launches (with light on and no music during a ride restart)
https://youtu.be/N7w6tX4rLAU?t=2m53s
Time between launch 1 & 2 : 1 minute 3 seconds
Time between launch 2 & 3 : 1 minute 6 seconds
Nobody is embarking because this is a ride restart but since the timing is constant, it gives the ideal timing if the ride operates at optimum capacity, it is a significant improvement over your 2 minute example
 
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I agree that separate Entranace and Exit stations would be a good addition. It was one of the first things i thought was missing from the game. It does absolutely speed up turnaround IF you have a situation where trains get backed up because the one in front has not loaded up by the time the next one gets back to the station. It would mean that instead of sitting there waiting it could unload which means when it got to the unload part everything would be quicker because its an empty train.

This technique is also used at many major theme parks. This year I was at Disney etc and Space Mountain, Seven Dwarfs, R&R Coaster, Expedition Everest all use this method! They do it because it means they can turn things around faster and get more people on the ride. Disney DO NOT want people in queues.. its the one place no one can spend any money, so I reckon they probably know what they are doing when it comes to making things as quick as possible.
 
Oblivion in Alton Towers, Euromir in Europapark, The wildmouse coaster in Europapark, Blue Fire in Europapark have all a exit and entrance station to speed up capacity. When the train enters the entrance station empty, people only have to load in. And you have also a extra block on the coaster. Which makes room for more trains. The system is used by Intamin, B&M and MACK. So, it isn't unusual and it was possible to do in RCT-2.
 
It doesn't necessarily speed up capacity. Capacity is determined by the track design.
Plus you have to add the time it takes to get the train from one station to the next.
Having one empty train in between the two stations still doesn't increase capacity of the track.

This idea that two stations increases through put in a vast majority of cases is bunk. It ALL comes down to track design, and block sections.
If you want them for aesthetics, so you can replicate real coasters, that's fine.
But be honest and call it what it is.

I've given data on real coasters and water rides before, and showed that even the log flume in PlanCo nearly matched that of a real life counter part.
 
According to Roland Mack, a coaster with a seperate entrance and exit will double the load capacity and reduce the station wait times by 50%. So it might not be, but Mack has proved it can work!
 
I've been to Europa Park many times.
Blue Fire has separate entrance/exit stations.
Euromir uses the same station for entrance and exit.
The Wildmouse uh.... I don't know, It's probably one of the best wild mouse in the world but I refuse to wait 45 minutes for a wild mouse... and that stupid cheezy swiss farm music, argh make it stop !!!. I've done it once a long long time ago, I do not remember the station.

One more thing at Europa Park is that they have extremely fast and efficient operations with well designed stations, multiple safety operators per train, and often a dedicated queue operator to fill empty seats.
Blue Fire at Europa Park has the best station I have ever visited. I believe the only way to best their design would be to be able to drop your bags in the containers in advance before the train arrives, so that there is no need to walk across the track to deposit your bag. (a bag lift going through the floor and coming out on the other side).
 
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I've been to Europa Park many times.
Blue Fire has separate entrance/exit stations.
Euromir uses the same station for entrance and exit.
The Wildmouse uh.... I don't know, It's probably one of the best wild mouse in the world but I refuse to wait 45 minutes for a wild mouse... and that stupid cheezy swiss farm music, argh make it stop !!!. I've done it once a long long time ago, I do not remember the station.

One more thing at Europa Park is that they have extremely fast and efficient operations with well designed stations, multiple safety operators per train, and often a dedicated queue operator to fill empty seats.
Blue Fire at Europa Park has the best station I have ever visited. I believe the only way to best their design would be to be able to drop your bags in the containers in advance before the train arrives, so that there is no need to walk across the track to deposit your bag. (a bag lift going through the floor and coming out on the other side).
Euromir in the last years was changed to seperate stations to add a 7th train on board. Now the whole ride is getting refurbished and will probaly improve even more.

And yes, capacity is about track design but if you can load a empty coach or train, instead of a one that has to be unloaded first you have a win win situation.
 
So I built A Gnarler woodie, patterned losely on the Roller Coaster at Playland in Vancouver. My ride has a duration of 106 seconds. Entrance and exits are located right in the sation center on each side. I cheated a bit with the block-sections by adding a piece of lift chain at the crest of the third hill (not only does it look like an old-school anti rollback device, it also adds a new block to the ride). With this set up I can set the minimum/maximum station time to 35 seconds and the coaster runs three trains with 24 people each fluidly.
It´s probably some of the maximum capacity you can get out of this coaster in PC. Now show me a coaster in real life that sends 24 riders on their way every 35 seconds. (the only existing coasters that come close are the notorious travelling Schwarzkopf fair coasters like Olympia Looping, who are total capacity monsters.)
That being said: with careful design you can really max out the PC system and create well paced coasters and fluid queues.

I can load that coaster into the workshop, if anyone is interested.

For a coaster that uses entry/exit on the same side: Skyrusch at Hershey
 
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Yep, separate stations only provide for an extra train as you will just be adding a new block section.

It's only a visual thing to make guests think it goes faster when you will only have benefits from it on the first run as you have that extra train to fill with people.

BUT, I can understand for a visual effect / theme purpose it would be nice to have trains enter empty by the use of separate train stations.
 
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