Serious proposals on how to reconcile the Anaconda WITHOUT DIRECTLY NERFING IT. (+Jump range)

sollisb

Banned
As distasteful as the subject of nerfing an overpowered ship is, and as "forbidden" as the topic apparently is (only one person on this planet presumes to think he can tell me what to do, my father, and I don't listen to him either), both the Anaconda and Python need to given a nerfing they so richly deserve. That would balance out the inequalities in ship types. It's distasteful, but needs to be done.

Simple question.. WHY? In what way does it effect your game play?
 
The reason why they shouldn't nerf any ship is not everyone is in the comfort of the bubble, a downward change could mean some people become literally stranded in particular spots with millions in exploration data.

What needs to happen is the other large ships need to be made more appealing:

The Corvette (in fact every Fed ship) should get a buff to jump range. Not too much of a buff but if somehow around 40 ly at the top end was possible.

T9 needs a buff to it's cargo capacity so it edges out a Cutter but it would also need it's optimal mass tweaked so it also edges the cutter out in terms of laden jump range.

The beluga doesn't need much of a buff to jump range (a couple of light years wouldn't hurt) but it does need an extra class 5 optional slot at least to make it more versatile.

The Cutter as mentioned already has major benefits not in jump range but in carry capacity, and it's jump range isn't too bad. Any jump range buffs they need to be careful they balance dedicated trading ships appropriately also.

What else we need is new non-combat large ship that's an Anaconda beater, an exploration ship that has plenty of room for a fighter bay/SRV/AMFU's etc so you can do all the things the Conda is good for while also having a larger jump range but being much weaker at combat & not really being a trader/passenger ship either. I would of said just buff the Beluga and give it a 65 ly+ jump range however we really need a more dedicated exploration vessel as a step up for the Asp's and Diamondbacks.

I'm really hoping that's something that's on course for the future updates, it would be a shame for Frontier not to address the issues or give us another bunch of inferior ships to everyone's favorite.

Getting stranded is not an issue... They could easily give everyone on the rim x units of jumponium or associated materials... And the few remaining, outliers that were STILL stranded (i.e. they flew there with jumponium before the nerf) could be manually relocated... FDEV once sent a player to the bubble for some reason I forget before sending him back out to the rim where is was before.

As I requested so politely in the OP, please refrain from one off, ship specific buffs. Once you go down that path, with 1,000,000 players, every singe ship needs revisiting arbitrarily!
 
Simple question.. WHY? In what way does it effect your game play?

Because he already got the corvette or cutter, and was using this 'OP' anaconda or python to achieve the Millions required to pay it and now he doesn't want anyone else to get them? I can't think of any other reason, specially since I didn't read any of them a few weeks ago complaining they were grinding credits for the corvette/cutter using an anaconda and it was OP.
 
No, you are the one introducing mechanics, I'm asking a very simple 'stat' question: what is the base speed of the ASPX (before it gets into any thrusters/weight computation). Do you have an idea?

I said take it offline if you want to continue. This is way outside OP now.
 
Re the Corvette, yes it was in a recent livestream last month... Sandro was answering questions about ships and one was... "So, are you going to buff the Corvette, increased range or change the two class 1 weapons to something useful?"

He chuckled and said... "Erm. No. The Corvette is a very popular ship already despite it being a limited vessel (I presume he meant Federation Navy) so I see no need to buff it at all considering how many people use it."

The Anaconda quote is listed in the OP.
Noted, thanks. I wonder how many people pushed through the Corvette rank grind without looking too closely at the stats? I would have to hold my hand up there; I just expected it to be the best from the descriptions. I really like my Corvette, but I'm going to be building an anti-Xeno Anaconda once I have saved up some cash and materials for engineering. The Corvette is great for anti-Xeno, but the Anaconda's combination of hardpoints and armour mean it is still the meta. The best AX weapons are now the new class 2 Guardians toys, so the Corvette's twin huge hardpoints don't give it any advantage.

"Admiral, a huge Thargoid fleet is on course for the Sol system. Shall I scramble the Corvettes?"
"Negative Commander - we've got some 400 year old freighters to handle them."

Perhaps next time the question should be phrased better and we might get a more positive response, e.g. "How do you plan to address the imbalance between the Anaconda and the Corvette?".
 

sollisb

Banned
The game is being ruined by people who feel they have some right to dictate how other players play.

Gold mines are nerfed because people complain that they don't use them no one else should.

Good missions are ruined by the same people.

Here's a simple answer those wanting to nerf the Anaconda.

If you don't like it, Don't use it. Sorted. Close Thread.
 
For me it has an easy answer: remove hardpoints on the Anaconda. Multipurpose, right?
Well maybe, but now we're contravening the no-nerfing-Anaconda rule...

Buffing other ships seems the way to go. This has precedent (Engineers 3.0 vs 2.4 and the resolution of grandfathering issues) and would avoid the saltpocalypse; as Sandro has said, it's too late now and people will get very upset if a nerf bat gets taken to their favourite ship.

One simple tweak to the Corvette would be to swap its C1 and C2 hardpoints around.
 
Noted, thanks. I wonder how many people pushed through the Corvette rank grind without looking too closely at the stats?

I think there is in general this expectation the 'vette should be a "point and destroy ship": on account of being one of the big 3, and being "the combat one", players are expecting to get in it, press the fire button while roughly looking at an enemy, and hear the words "ship destroyed".

That would be explicitly out of place, and people know it would be. Can you imagine the forum wildfire if any n00b could jump in a 'vette and murder every CMDR in sight by clicking because they were given a point n' win weapon?

The 'vette has a number of advantages that are outside of raw firepower, and again people know that because it's not exactly a seldom used machine. It handles far better, it has a very strong shield/SCB layout despite the fact Fed ships are typically hull tanks or hybrid tanks at best, it has modules placed to be much harder to cripple by targeting subsystems, it has very potent hardpoint placement if you can handle the one C3 weapon, it can use a C7 fighter without sacrificing much (where either of the other big 3 is utterly crippled using one)...

The 'vette is nowhere near as poor as people will have you believe. There is a discrepancy, but it's not because the 'vette is urine poor - it's because the 'conda has the modules that should be reserved for a combat dedicated equivalent. C8 is the highest class we have in the entire game; why does a multirole ship have it on distributor?

We can dance around this if we want, but we'd ultimately trying to build a house on sand, justified likely by the usual cries that "any attempts to balance the game is because you hate me and you hate fun and you don't want me to have fun!!1!"
 
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The Corvette is great for anti-Xeno, but the Anaconda's combination of hardpoints and armour mean it is still the meta. The best AX weapons are now the new class 2 Guardians toys, so the Corvette's twin huge hardpoints don't give it any advantage.

But not maxing out the combat power of the corvette does not negate that you can still mount the same number of AX weapons on it as in the anaconda. I really hope this whole discussion (or the event that triggered it) is not that because of the new guardian weapons, the corvette can't have better weapons in its huge hardpoints.

The whole point of the discussion is about the jump range discrepancy (read the title), so I still think removing a couple of hardpoints (thus leaving the corvette more combat oriented) is a way to go and does not nerf the current conda jump range.
 
I HAVE A SOLUTION!

In the beginning there was only the Anaconda, and life was good.
Then came the corvette and cutter, and the conda was "op".
Get rid of the corvette and the cutter.
Problem solved and without nerfing the conda.
 
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I think there is in general this expectation the 'vette should be a "point and destroy ship": on account of being one of the big 3, and being "the combat one", players are expecting to get in it, press the fire button while roughly looking at an enemy, and hear the words "ship destroyed".

That would be explicitly out of place, and people know it would be. Can you imagine the forum wildfire if any n00b could jump in a 'vette and murder every CMDR in sight by clicking because they were given a point n' win weapon?

The 'vette has a number of advantages that are outside of raw firepower, and again people know that because it's not exactly a seldom used machine. It handles far better, it has a very strong shield/SCB layout despite the fact Fed ships are typically hull tanks or hybrid tanks at best, it has modules placed to be much harder to cripple by targeting subsystems, it has very potent hardpoint placement if you can handle the one C3 weapon, it can use a C7 fighter without sacrificing much (where either of the other big 3 is utterly crippled using one)...

The 'vette is nowhere near as poor as people will have you believe. There is a discrepancy, but it's not because the 'vette is urine poor - it's because the 'conda has the modules that should be reserved for a combat dedicated equivalent. C8 is the highest class we have in the entire game; why does a multirole ship have it on distributor?

We can dance around this if we want, but we'd ultimately trying to build a house on sand, justified likely by the usual cries that "any attempts to balance the game is because you hate me and you hate fun and you don't want me to have fun!!1!"
Good points. I wasn't trying to 'build' anything - just pointing out that the capabilities of the two are closer than they should be. I certainly wouldn't advocate the Corvette being turned into an 'I win' button either, just that it should have a reasonable advantage over other ships at its intended role.
 
Without heaving read all the answers in this thread: I really like the suggestions of the OP. instead of nerfing ships because they are op, I rather like to see buff to other ships. And all of the suggestions of the original post are very good ideas to workaround this topic.

Sandro's argument that the Corvette is very popular and doesn't need a buff is short sighted (in my honset opinion - sorry Sandro). FD tries to create a realistic universe. But no realistic ship manufacturer would design their ship in such a limiting way. An explorer without two class 1 slots and space for all the necessities for exploring is stupid. A dedicated (luxury) bounty hunter that could be outrunned by any other ship in terms of high waking away makes no sense at all. The list goes on ...

o7
 
Frankly, all the ships are fine in my book. :) They all have benefits. I don't even own an Anaconda, and have never felt the lack (I did fly one - didn't like it, though probably will get one again at some point).
 
But not maxing out the combat power of the corvette does not negate that you can still mount the same number of AX weapons on it as in the anaconda. I really hope this whole discussion (or the event that triggered it) is not that because of the new guardian weapons, the corvette can't have better weapons in its huge hardpoints.

The whole point of the discussion is about the jump range discrepancy (read the title), so I still think removing a couple of hardpoints (thus leaving the corvette more combat oriented) is a way to go and does not nerf the current conda jump range.
Not strictly true. The flak cannon doesn't count towards your total of four, so you can get two of everything on the Anaconda. I doubt that this discussion was started by the Guardian weapons; if anything, they have made it more balanced because before the Anaconda was the only ship with four hardpoints that could mount a class 3 or higher weapon (don't even mention the T10...).
 
I don't have much knowledge on ship builds, since I can only build one type of ship, but Sir Sarky Dunghead Stitch gets a lot of kudos for making me understand the subject matter quite a bit better then when I started reading the thread.

*hat's off*
 
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Good points. I wasn't trying to 'build' anything - just pointing out that the capabilities of the two are closer than they should be. I certainly wouldn't advocate the Corvette being turned into an 'I win' button either, just that it should have a reasonable advantage over other ships at its intended role.

I wasn't reprimanding you mate, just building off what you said :) I appreciate OP's sentiment but any suggestion thus far seems like an overcomplicated attempt to work around a very simple balance problem that FD won't look at because the 'conda is their favoured child.

I don't have much knowledge on ship builds, since I can only build one type of ship, but Sir Stitch gets a lot of kudos for making me understand the subject matter quite a bit better then when I started reading the thread.

*hat's off*

Hey, let's not have people think I can be constructive here bud...I've spent a lot of time fostering a reputation as a sarky dunghead, pls don't greef my forum reputation :D
 
I'll say it.

Nerf the damn Anaconda already. No amount of buffing other ships will change the fact that a multipurpose ship (aka jack-of-all- trades- master - of - none) is the number one exploration vessel, one of the best traders, one of the best Thargoid solo'ers thanks to it's freakish hull, one of the best all around combat ships despite some turning issues,... it's too broken unless you bring it in line with the others. It also is like the only ship i think to show combat damage (maybe cobra does too, can't remember).

It's disgusting how much it dominates to the point that everyone keeps taking it over other ships for a lot of roles.

Nerf it
 
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