Should ED go down the same path as SC

I have backed both games .... Just backed ED a heck of a lot more than I backed SC.
I am sure both will be great games, but I cant help but wonder if ED should do some of the same stuff SC is doing to raise more money.
In case you havent been following Star Citizen(SC) then they have been quite succesful selling ships ect. to bring in extra cash.

In the end that will bring us a better game, so I for one wouldnt mind it at all.

Thoughts?
 
I have backed both games .... Just backed ED a heck of a lot more than I backed SC.
I am sure both will be great games, but I cant help but wonder if ED should do some of the same stuff SC is doing to raise more money.
In case you havent been following Star Citizen(SC) then they have been quite succesful selling ships ect. to bring in extra cash.

In the end that will bring us a better game, so I for one wouldnt mind it at all.

Thoughts?

FD & David are creators of ED, and they have clearly indicated that they don't want to go down this road. Any other discussions are quite useless.

My personal opinion is - no, no, no, and third time no. I pledged for 80 pounds for lifetime pass for expansions, and I got three ship options (including Cobra and Eagle), however I know will start with Sidewinder as most of the people, because otherwise I don't see reason to play this game. Yeah, I play for challenge, not to show how big....my wallet is ;)

FD profit model is a) retail sales in very long time period b) advancement of COBRA engine trough ED, they are licensing it now to other dev houses, so ED also plays a demo platform role here;
 
Frontier selling ED ships

Carsten

Interesting idea, though maybe a little late for Frontier to start.

However, once the game is released and the two major updates as well (in ship movement and planetary landings) maybe this could be a great idea for Frontier to raise more money and for us to fly cool ships. Maybe ships even more specialised for exploring, pirating etc
 
Short answer: no, I think it never should.

Long answer: I don't like the very idea of selling ships or equipment for real money. If I'd want to play a game where real money gets you the good stuff there are hundreds of f2p/p2w games out there.

New ships added in the future should come in the form of expansion pacs or DLC which do not just hand out the ship, but grant ingame access to them the regular way. Let's say months after release there is a DLC "New Ships Pack", and buying it would then enable you to earn the new ships from that pack through the same means as all other ships.
 
Must... Resist... Pedantry...

Do as me: resist anything but temptation* :D

Anyway, on the topic, no. It is too late in the game to implement a piecemeal sellling of ships model. It makes some sense in SC, as they have designed a business model around it: create all the logic and environment (e.g. ships have their own marketing material as they would have in the ingame future society). But it would not make any sense in ED.

(note: this about selling ingame assets for real world cash, not the access to content).

Could ED deploy a similar system in the future? Maybe, but only in new features/assets associated with an expansion. Not sure it would make much sense even then, but I'm sure it is somethign that can be analyzed when the time comes.



*all credits to Oscar Wilde
 
Definitly no.

Your logic is flawed if you think, more money = better game. There are tons of examples out the past 10 years proving this is not true.

However, game made from interest rather than greed = better game is also a pretty much proven fact.
 
I have backed both games .... Just backed ED a heck of a lot more than I backed SC.
I am sure both will be great games, but I cant help but wonder if ED should do some of the same stuff SC is doing to raise more money.
In case you havent been following Star Citizen(SC) then they have been quite succesful selling ships ect. to bring in extra cash.

In the end that will bring us a better game, so I for one wouldnt mind it at all.

Thoughts?

A big no from me. I've been reading the SC forums for months and its like a feeding frenzy everytime CIG announce another ship for sale. A bit tacky and pathetic the way some drool over pixels they paid real money for imo. But its what CIG have had to do to essentially raise the $30 million they have so far, so its worked for them, but Frontier haven't had to do that with Elite as most of its development money has come from non-public avenues as far as I know.

I'm glad Elite has kept it low key and haven't compromised game play issues too unfairly. The way they've rewarded backers is well thought out it seems and people joining the game a year or two into release shouldn't feel too disadvantaged.

Surely part of the fun is to earn in game credits to buy better ships, gradually working your way up? Not a short cut to the top? I think FD realised this from the earlier games. Its the journey that counts, not the destination.

One of the developers (Chris Roberts or David Braben, can't remember which) said the initial idea for their game was for the player to start WITHOUT a ship. Probably doing in-system shuttle runs, or courier jobs for a NPC company until you could afford your own ship and leave the bounds of the Solar System and travel to the stars for the first time. I would have loved that! It would have made your first ever ship purchase have real meaning behind it and be a lasting memory. Like your first ever car in real life, even if it was a piece of junk you never forget it :smilie:
 
Last edited:
I'm glad Elite has kept it low key and haven't compromised game play issues too unfairly.

ED - Understate and undersell it .. keep the hype down ... we should all get exactly what we expect, or perhaps it will blow us away .. both results are acceptable and welcomed.

SC - blow trumpets from the rooftops .. keep the hype in a frenzy state .. If they can deliver then it will be awesome .. if they can deliver ...

That's the difference.
 
I don't like the path that SC has gone down, to be honest. I've backed it because I'm interested in the game, but I feel they're concentrating too much on raising money and not enough on making a tight, stable and fun game. Obviously I don't know what's going on behind-the-scenes but I do know that throwing money at a development team doesn't necessarily make for a better product. It'll help with production values, but the core gameplay won't change. To be frank, I expect the majority of the money they've raised to either go directly into the company's profits, or to be used to market the game.

The main reason I prefer what FD have done is that they have genuinely limited the scope of the project to something achievable in a relatively short timescale without overpromising features. The majority of the money raised seems destined to go into the production of the game, with any profit coming from post-release sales. This feels much more in keeping with the Kickstarter philosophy.

If FD were to offer in-game incentives for real cash, I would hope that they're non-functional. For example, different designs of the same ships, decals, paint jobs, etc. All of which should also be available using in-game currency but obviously so much harder to achieve that way.
 
All this is assuming FD don't think they have enough money already. The lack of a sales push suggests otherwise.

Or they have too high moral standards :) for a money grab like this hehe.

Anyways some added ships wouldnt be bad even if it meant we "had" to pledge something extra ;) at least not in my book.

Your logic is flawed if you think, more money = better game. There are tons of examples out the past 10 years proving this is not true.

There are tons of examples of it being true as well

FD & David are creators of ED, and they have clearly indicated that they don't want to go down this road. Any other discussions are quite useless.

I missed that ... do you have a link?
If that is true then the discussion is kinda moot :)
 
ED - Understate and undersell it .. keep the hype down ... we should all get exactly what we expect, or perhaps it will blow us away .. both results are acceptable and welcomed.

SC - blow trumpets from the rooftops .. keep the hype in a frenzy state .. If they can deliver then it will be awesome .. if they can deliver ...

That's the difference.

I agree, somehow it's seems a very British way of doing things! ;)
 
I missed that ... do you have a link?
If that is true then the discussion is kinda moot :)

Current ship pledges were added after two weeks lobbying in the middle of KS. They were clearly not found of idea, but I like how they add descriptions for those tiers. They are even very conservative to idea selling in-game credits for money.
 
I don't like the path that SC has gone down, to be honest. I've backed it because I'm interested in the game, but I feel they're concentrating too much on raising money and not enough on making a tight, stable and fun game. Obviously I don't know what's going on behind-the-scenes but I do know that throwing money at a development team doesn't necessarily make for a better product. It'll help with production values, but the core gameplay won't change. To be frank, I expect the majority of the money they've raised to either go directly into the company's profits, or to be used to market the game.

Well... I'm sorry to say but it seems that you haven't been reading what Chris Roberts has been saying about these kind of things for months now.They have most of the stretch goals planned out far in advance. It's just that the money keeps pooring in and they become available pretty fast. So it isn't scope creep or something, he's planned this for about a year in advance, he just couldn't guess at what rate it would go.

I think the major difference is the big bucks SC was able to get from the get go and their American style of bringing it to the people. (shout BIG!!) This somehow seemed to work early on, which now also gives them a sound marketing budget to do things FD either can't or doesn't want to do.

FD have always said they are happy about how the KS went. Although I myself sometimes had my doubts about their initial presentation which I think hurt the KS more than they could immagine at that time. Still I look at their presentations and feel like: Yep, they still don't know how to do this properly.
I don't know if that is their laid back English approach, if they just don't bother or if they really can't. That last one really would surprise and scare me because that would become a future problem. All the other reasons don't really matter. We'll have to see around launch of retail in what way FD has evolved on that subject.

By all means, this doesn't mean I don't like what they are doing now (in respect to marketing, presentation and such) I just have a feeling it could have been much better.
Quality wise the things we're shown are looking super. So I have no doubt a very nice game is in the making here.
 
This is the $30m stretch goal in SC...

Origin 890 JUMP – The rumors are true: Origin Jumpworks has a larger ship in the works! The Origin 890 JUMP is an interstellar super-yacht with exquisite styling and an array of high quality upgrade options. Travel the stars in style with multiple decks, high visibility windows and a small boat bay. Whether you’re outfitting it to explore new worlds or to take a pleasure cruise through Terra, the 890 JUMP is the epitome of luxury, class and refinement!

Another ship.

Just what the game needs.

Personally I'd have preferred to see the money go to more galactic content - like more systems to explore, true atmospheric flight instead of cutscenes, a frame shift drive akin to what ED will have to give the player true freedom of travel and exploration.

I guess this is why I'm reluctant to pledge to SC, as at the moment the goals seem to be aimed at raking in more revenue than adding things I'd personally find more appealing. I'm still looking forward to the game though, I think it'll be a fantastic experience as its attention to detail is second to none.
 
Well... I'm sorry to say but it seems that you haven't been reading what Chris Roberts has been saying about these kind of things for months now.They have most of the stretch goals planned out far in advance. It's just that the money keeps pooring in and they become available pretty fast. So it isn't scope creep or something, he's planned this for about a year in advance, he just couldn't guess at what rate it would go.
To be fair, I haven't been keeping that up-to-date. All I'm going on is my perception of the Kickstarter and those stretch goals. I honestly can't believe that with a $500k initial target they were really planning on achieving $30m before launch.

The main issue I have with their stretch goals are that I don't think that a lot of them are really connected with reality, and that some of the more superfluous ones (e.g. customisable cockpit) are only likely to have a detrimental impact on the chances of delivery of the game. Some of them are sensible (e.g. $1m for a custom mo-cap studio), but others seem far-fetched ($500k for a new ship, or $3m for a space suit).

I think one of the main reasons money keeps pouring in because they have revenue mechanisms beyond the simple pledge levels, not because of the stretch goals. I'm astounded at the number of people who are willing to pay $500 or more for an in-game asset. I'd much prefer to have something tangible for my money (e.g. FD's physical 3D models of the ships, not that I can afford it).

I think the major difference is the big bucks SC was able to get from the get go and their American style of bringing it to the people. (shout BIG!!) This somehow seemed to work early on, which now also gives them a sound marketing budget to do things FD either can't or doesn't want to do.
That's true. They were well organised in their Kickstarter appeal, and clearly knew how to grab interest. But bear in mind that the vast majority of the funding they have received is post-Kickstarter, and IMO down to their desire to bring in as many $$$ as possible through the realisation that people will pay for these extras. Take the hangar module for example -- the amount of people who went crazy over what's effectively a static environment with nothing to do is phenomenal.

I'm not really knocking what SC have done; they've obtained a large amount of funding in a relatively short period. I just prefer the way FD have gone about it, that's all. :)

FD have always said they are happy about how the KS went. Although I myself sometimes had my doubts about their initial presentation which I think hurt the KS more than they could immagine at that time. Still I look at their presentations and feel like: Yep, they still don't know how to do this properly.

I don't know if that is their laid back English approach, if they just don't bother or if they really can't. That last one really would surprise and scare me because that would become a future problem. All the other reasons don't really matter. We'll have to see around launch of retail in what way FD has evolved on that subject.
There were many problems with FD's Kickstarter. I think one of the main ones was that they were relying on the nostalgia of the name, so didn't think they needed a real sales pitch other than "It's a new Elite, people!". That was flawed: 20 years is a long time, and FD haven't done anything similar to Elite in the intervening time, so even some hardcore fans of the series could have their doubts. Without much to show in the way of screenshots or video, we were pledging for an idea, and that's a scary thing for us Englishmen who find it hard to part with cash at the best of times. Kickstarter was also a new thing to the UK at the time, and for many of us it was the first we'd heard of it.
 
Without much to show in the way of screenshots or video, we were pledging for an idea, and that's a scary thing for us Englishmen who find it hard to part with cash at the best of times.

Oh I dunno ... when I read about the KS I pledged instantly.

Good post otherwise :)
 
FD have always said they are happy about how the KS went. Although I myself sometimes had my doubts about their initial presentation which I think hurt the KS more than they could immagine at that time. Still I look at their presentations and feel like: Yep, they still don't know how to do this properly.
I don't know if that is their laid back English approach, if they just don't bother or if they really can't. That last one really would surprise and scare me because that would become a future problem. All the other reasons don't really matter. We'll have to see around launch of retail in what way FD has evolved on that subject.

By all means, this doesn't mean I don't like what they are doing now (in respect to marketing, presentation and such) I just have a feeling it could have been much better.
Quality wise the things we're shown are looking super. So I have no doubt a very nice game is in the making here.

This really ...... couldnt have put it better myself :)
 
Chris Roberts has always been saying that for the game to be properly made he would need at least $20M, that would be 23-$24M in real money because revenues out of KS and Paypal/Stripe need to be payed to these respective organisations. He also explained recently that indeed a stretchgoal for another million not nessecarily would only mean that item. So In my perspective they are very open about that.

He always had the plan to have the $20M partially funded by the crowdfunding and partially by investors. So when things got rolling he had time enough to work out plans that he had in the fridge of which he thought would take years before he'd reach that. But still ... he had them planned.

Recent days have been madness by ... guess what: YES! Selling ships!! It's the 1 year aniversary sale with:
  • about $300.000,- on the first day for the M50
  • about $450.000,- on the second day for the 350R
  • about $330.000,- on the second day for the Drake Caterpillar
It will go on until next Tuesday.... I guess they will make more with this one weeks' sale than the whole Elite: Dangerous Kickstarter! So... probably a lot of people think different and are willing to invest in virtual objects. And that's something a good marketing person should be able to explain I guess... because... neither can I!
(Still, I already have 3 ships and I don't know why either!! Planning on getting a 4th... why ... I DON'T KNOW! Darnit! Help me!! :S :D)
 
Top Bottom