So vets think it is fun to kill new players with no words
- Thread starter ryoken12
- Start date
rootsrat
Volunteer Moderator
Hang on there. So you're saying psycho NPCs are part of the game to add realism and challenge, and REAL psycho players that are a challenge are... what? Not part of the game? Bad for the game?
We've established here that the difference here is the intentions. Some (SOME! Not all) of the real players do it for pure pleasure of being able to destroy a fellow player in a weak ship.
The NPC's do it, because that's how they've been programmed.
Now, what is the final effect of both actions? The player in a weak ship is being destroyed. He has a bad game experience. His fun is spoiled.
The reasons are different, the effect is the same. Why don't you (not you personally) complain and moan about NPC's being programmed as psychos if they cause EXACTLY same effect as player psychos (btw, I use that term loosely)?
Now what would have happened if you couldn't distinguish NPCs and Cmdrs on the scanner? Would you come to the forums and complain every single time you get destroyed by another ship in game JUST IN CASE it was a real player and not an NPC?
Scudmungus
Banned
Goin wid 'Yuh'. Each mon takin responsibility. Responsibility to makin Open a place welcomin to new players. Place we all sharin wid fellow gamers.
I like gamers! Dey play games like mi! D
Intention.
A player does something for a reason. He knows hat he is doing and he knows what consequences it will have for the attacked player. A NPC does what ever the game is designed to let the NPC do.
If a player attacks an other player for no apparent in-game reason the attacked player can assume that the reason is to hurt the player in some way. It's simply an aggressive and hostile social behavior and humans react to such behavior in a strong way.
If the ship of a player gets destroyed by an NPC it's just the game. If the ship of a player gets destroyed by an other player than the other player decided to destroy the ship knowing that this will hurt the attacked player in some way (time spend to earn the credits needed for insurance and/or cargo for example).
For the same reasons using "bad words" and "naming and shaming" isn't allowed on this forum. It's all about the intention and the result it has to humans.
And not being able to distinguish between player and NPC doesn't work. It would make it worse as players will have to assume that every scanner signal is a human player. And player hunters will learn how to spot CMDRs giving them an advantage and a better method to cause grief/harm/unenjoyable gameplay.
It's not my responsibility to make a safe space for new players, that would be the responsibility of the system security. The security ships that interdict me are only slowing me down, not really preventing it. Perhaps Frontier could increase security response to Psychos like me? Sending an Eagle after a Python is not very wise of them.
Now that's one whole lot of assumption right there.
Maybe if players couldn't tell if they were being attacked my humans or NPC's we wouldn't have posts like this? There would be no further discussion about what a griefer is? People would play and would no longer be able to blame their miserable gaming experience on other people??!
Sounds great to me. No more whinging.
rootsrat
Volunteer Moderator
See my post above.
Also, you claim that hunters would learn how to spot Cmdrs. What makes you think that non-hunters wouldn't be able to learn how to spot a Cmdr hunter?
Last edited:
Cradle2Grave
Banned
But... It's part of the game that players can shoot other players... So, what's the problem exactly?
No but being nice to ppl who cannot ( yet ) help themselves is considered good while bullying them is considered bad.
Pirating is part of gameplay, a means to an end and can add to the experience of both pirate and victim, if done right, although I don't really like it.
And again, you know this, you are just using obtuse arguments to justify your attitude.
The difference between being interdicted by NPCs as opposed to Players is that the NPC encounters are typically balanced, giving you a great chance to win the fight or get away.
Typically when interdicted by a player, it's overwhelming odds - either your ship is far outclassed or you're facing more than one player. It's the strong preying on the weak, nothing more, there's nothing noble or even brave about the attacker's actions. But such is life in an open pvp environment.
Typically when interdicted by a player, it's overwhelming odds - either your ship is far outclassed or you're facing more than one player. It's the strong preying on the weak, nothing more, there's nothing noble or even brave about the attacker's actions. But such is life in an open pvp environment.
I hate to say it but you behave exactly like an . Welcome to my ignore list.
Because it's not fair and you can only shoot other players under certain circumstances even if the mission in the game wants you to kill the other player. It's just not allowed because... er... it's not, and people get very upset about it and threaten not to play any more.
So don't ask such a silly question again.
Last edited:
The in game effect is the same. The effect on the player certainly isn't the same. Saying there is no difference sounds very much like trying to deny any responsibility for the actions.
If NPCs would be programmed to act like some players play this game - big ship hunting weak ships, new players - the game would have a problem in a very short time. The NPCs in this game need to get better, not in combat but in "reasonable understandable in-game motivated behavior". NPC pirates should pirate (hatch breaker limpets and stuff) and not just try to kill after a few moments. There should be bounty hunter NPCs that actually search CMDRs with a bounty.
The problem is, that this game doesn't encourage players to play in a better way than NPCs (meaningful in-game reasons and understandable in-game motivations), it encourages players to act like mindless NPCs.
Last edited:
This then renders the whole hypothetical situation moot. If you hide NPC from CMDR but players can still recognise each other then you haven't actually hidden NPC from CMDR.
Last edited:
Agreed, if they had implement some sort of proper escalating response, in high security systems, this would be much better. this is the problem with the game, it's a free for all everywhere.
I don't mind less responses in lower systems, and if you are in an anarchy and get attacked for no reason, it's fair also.
I've suggested before a lot more variety in secure and low security systems. The high secure ones should have fast an lethal responses until you're destroyed or chased away.
The lower ones should be more dangerous, but more lucrative for trading etc. Would bring a much needed element to risk/reward and allow new players to stick to safer paths and more experienced players, or just players who accept and embrace the danger, can risk it.
Time spend learning that skill. Someone specializing in hunting players will always have the advantage. New players will be in a much bigger disadvantage than they are now.
And if all players learn how to distinguish players from NPCs - what's the point in not distinguish them in the first place?
rootsrat
Volunteer Moderator
And being bad in Elite is perfectly valid way to play it...
Allow me to make a real-life comparison:
- strong wind blows dirt in your eyes, eyes water and hurt
- some random dude throws sand in your eyes, eyes water and hurt
The effect is the same, but for some reason people seem to be angrier on the latter case.
Scudmungus
Banned
Yuh be missin a trick. Gud game design bout providin obstacles - challenge to overcome drough empowerment. A challenge got to have an outcome oder dan, 'YOU DIE! BAM!' - else not challenge. Challenge be about competition. Wi know wo goin to win? No competition. Skip to de end!
NPCs in ED be designed to provide challenge. We seein dis wid Mistress of Minions reluctance to have NPC target power plant. We seein dis wid somtim signal - broadcast from NPC. We seein dis wid NPC ship type vs player ship. Examples of gud design choices. Wise lady know that NPC can be flyin better than most mons. Wise lady be choosin to present challenge to player, makin gud gamin. Ting be, rare human player be choosin to present challenge. Dey want to win. Makin choices to aal but guarantee win. Again, it be ok widdin de system wi got. But it not be providin challenge.
Quality challenge bringin quality gamin experience.
Ok, system support human choosin not to present challenge. Dis it? Dat all wi got to work wid? Ha! System need to be providin more empowerment to aal choosin to be involved. Gud ting be wi got many choices fuh empowerment. Empowerment bein education. Empowerment wid betta communication tools, groupin options an NPC assets. Empowerment drough better signallin an feedback. Empowerment drough betta education an adjustment of expectation.
All designed to be providin higher quality of challenge.
Be possible an wo know? Maybi wi seein more bodies in Open!
Last edited: