So you want to play in Open, eh?

This sounds like an exploit. If each of the original 4 are still able to see their former wingmates' nav beacon, then it is definitely an exploit as I'm sure FD didn't mean for this to happen.

Plenty ways to avoid that happening to a lone pilot. Watch your bandwidth meter and look out for movement lag in SC. As soon as your bandwidth starts to skyrocket, hyperspace out someplace else or drop out of SC.

The "W3 PWNZ U BAI NUMBRZ" crew have a thing or two to learn.
 
The way I see it is: you play the game the way you want and we'll play it the way we want....~S~

That would be ideal, but as we can see, some people don't want us to play the way we do. Despite that we are listening to the complaints from the other side while not receiving any backlash from FD, whatsoever, but an invitation to an official event.
 
We don't o-o, I'm a huge supporter of a flag system in Open.

You don't? You only have to look on youtube to see members of your group blowing up helpless traders and running away from combat ships. There isn't a "Yup please shoot me" flag system in Open, and likely never will be. That is why modes exist, so people can choose to play how they want whenever they want.

Your groups (or is it the mosquito guy's group?) is perfectly legitimate gameplay - although some find it distasteful, and some of what has happened has absolutely not been legitimate. I'm happy to see you are making changes to that though.
 
(NOTE: the following public service announcement is Nonya's opinion only and is not an official communication from Code itself)

Seems like the blockade of the Hutton Orbital CG has angered a lot of players who thought the CG would be a 1.5 hour "cakewalk" for them and a lot of ideas about how to "fix" such a thing are being floated around, all of which can be subverted and used against the very players who suggest them.

Here's one reason why Code was so successful against the CG participants - organization and coordination. The CG players had none, Code has it in spades.
Here's another reason - knowledge of the in-game mechanics. Code members have spent considerable time and in-game credit expense in working out the different play factors of the game.

1. Did you know that if you kill enough system police in an instance that no more will spawn in that instance? Nope, you didn't. We did though. But we didn't do it in this case because we were much too busy chasing you all out of the system, and quite frankly we had a much easier way to tie up the system po-po and make them ineffective.

2. Did you know that if a commander sits on a pad they're invincible to attack? You should know since a lot of you suggested that happen because during the early betas prior to game release players were able to be killed on pads and the uproar against that was right here in these very forums.

3. Did you also know that once a wanted commander is scanned prior to docking their docking privs are immediately revoked and they cannot dock?

4. Did you know what once a wanted commander is docked and then scanned by system security forces the sec forces IMMEDIATELY open fire on them on the dock until the commander is destroyed?

5. Did you know said commander cannot be destroyed because YOU didn't want to be vulnerable on the docking pad to attack so you had FD make it so.

6. Did you also know that when said forces are firing on said commander on the docking pad that they also ignore all other wanted players - including YOU if you accidentally fire at the station - and remain fixated on the docked wanted commander?

7. Did you know about anchor wings?

8. Do you know about exactly how instancing works?

9. Do you know the real difference between a combat log and regular save-and-quit?

I could go on and on with things about this game that 99% of you didn't know existed until you read this post but I digress. The problem isn't with what Code was able to successfully achieve utilizing their knowledge and skill of in-game mechanics, coordination, and lines of communication, it's with what you don't know about the game you're playing because the vast majority of you are either playing in solo/private groups and have been so safe in there that you haven't felt the need to practice combat against other players or to really understand how this game works.

Face facts people, there are not a lot of Code members. Maybe a max of 20 participated in this at a single time for an hour or two in and instance or two, most of the time it was 10-15 in a single instance.
The fact that this tiny infinitesimal number of players were able to pretty much grind the Hutton Orbital CG to a halt at-will should push everyone to practice combat skills and tactics a lot more. We saw a couple of really good 1v1 combat commanders out there but they weren't enough in numbers and they weren't a match for our completely-legitimate combat tactics.

It should also push more of you out there to group up and form Trade Organizations complete with your own lines of communication (Teamspeak, Discord, etc.), coordination (forums, sub-sections here, etc.), and tactics (trade wings, combat wings, scout wings, organizational roles, etc.). Get out of your bad habits treating open like it was solo or private group. It's not and nor should it ever be. It's different and much more exciting. Here are few ways you can help yourselves:

1. If you want to trade in open, don't run shieldless ANYTHING.

2. Don't be alone, especially in any "Type" trading ship. We're more prone to go after loners who think Open is Solo than a wing of 4.

3. Have at least 1 dedicated combat ship in your trade wing to force us to focus attention on it first allowing you time to jump away and get to the closest station.

4. Don't ever, ever, ever combat log. Not only do we report every single combat log to FDEV you instantly go on our kill-on-sight list and there won't be a friendly warning.

5. When told to stop and submit to a cargo scan when you're alone - stop. This is why the majority of traders who think Open-is-Solo die.

Now for another shocker - most members of Code actually DO trade (mostly smuggling) and we mostly do it in open unless we're experimenting with something and don't want to be bothered during the experiment in which case we drop down to Solo to figure it out. And unless we've got combat wingmates we do it in Pythons, clippers, and condas that have shields and can fight.

Another pro-tip: friend EVERYONE you meet - even those you hate. Why? Because, not only does it show them where YOU are but it shows you where THEY are.
That means if you see a cluster of so-called "baddies" in a system you know to avoid that system like the plague and hold on to those profits a bit longer. It will also let you see hotspots faster, i.e. a CG you might not have known about or other event like a race that isn't built into the game menus like a CG is. I always laugh when someone I've never attacked and/or pirated or even talked to suddenly unfriends me. "OK buddy, now you have no idea where I'll be at any given time and doom on you if it all goes pear-shaped." I've had randoms direct message me in game asking questions and I've usually answered them with tips on where to find this or that or how to grind rank faster, etc. Unless I'm busy - i.e. in a fight or working on an experiment - I usually reply.

I guess the bottom line is we need you folks to get better at this because right now while your forum posts may be entertaining to read online, in-game you're boring us and we need you to start creating your own in-game content on-the-fly like we do. FDEV does not always have to create it. Look at those wacky races (which look like fun by the way) around stations, or out to Sag A. Where are the trade competitions? CZ Combat competitions (CQC does NOT count, sorry Xbox players)? Mining competitions (mine this much X from this exact RES in X amount of time)? Where are the trade wars? (heh, TradeWars2002 notwithstanding....)

The Hutton blockade was quite literally an off-the-cuff suggestion by me (yes, blame me for all of it, I have thick skin) as we were bored to tears in-game and were pretty mad at such a ludicrous idea for a CG already.
You haven't seen us truly plan for and execute a determined operation yet. You've only seen what we can achieve with hasty 5-minute planning.
But thanks for the great practice though! And for those commanders that made it through the blockade in open and who were actually in an instance with us, bravo!
You were very very lucky.

I have played every single moment of this game in Open
.

I'm mostly what you would call a trader; closing in on Elite status. I have been pulled over by the Code a number of times and the result has varied. Sometimes they let me go, sometimes they destroyed me; I think maybe once I got away. I never slave trade.

Thank you for this thread. Most of what you listed I knew, a couple things I did not!

I love the idea that they exist in the game. I avoided the CG this time because I knew they would be there and so what? I knew it meant that they wouldn't be in other places. If a few of my friends were around and wanted to go Bounty Hunt; I knew exactly where we could go.

Don't be afraid of the Code. They are in a very small part of space, and there are plenty of other places to make money. You can even play with the bear once in a while. I rarely wing and have never been part of a trade organization. That's not to say that you shouldn't, but don't feel that you have to. You can be perfectly successful in Open and avoid the code.

This thread delivers.
 
That would be ideal, but as we can see, some people don't want us to play the way we do. Despite that we are listening to the complaints from the other side while not receiving any backlash from FD, whatsoever, but an invitation to an official event.

That's at least in part because the game mechanics do favour the way you want to play currently - basically targeting easy marks and/or ganking them when they have no effective in game response in other words - the way you want to play requires the often unwilling participation of outgunned and outnumbered victims. The game mechanics currently prioritise your playstyle over the playstyle of many of your targets so I'm not surprised people don't like that.

Yes - I know FD support it and it's legitimate (in fact their stance softened towards it based on earlier statements). I'm not trying to eradicate piracy but I believe it's far too easy for you currently.
 
This is excellent.
.
Some CMDRs complain that there is not enough information in the outfitters.
Others go out and spend the time to learn these things themselves.
.
When people say 'fights are won by skill' it's important to include that DOGFIGHTING ABILITY is not the only form of skill. Sitting down and taking the time to learn things that aren't immediately obvious is an extremely potent incarnation of skill.
 
That's at least in part because the game mechanics do favour the way you want to play currently - basically targeting easy marks and/or ganking them when they have no effective in game response in other words - the way you want to play requires the often unwilling participation of outgunned and outnumbered victims. The game mechanics currently prioritise your playstyle over the playstyle of many of your targets so I'm not surprised people don't like that.

Yes - I know FD support it and it's legitimate (in fact their stance softened towards it based on earlier statements). I'm not trying to eradicate piracy but I believe it's far too easy for you currently.

...and yet...no changes to the game occur to fix this. And public recognition from one of the leaders of the company that it occurred, without penalty to the group.

I mean no disrespect towards you, or any other player that is upset over this issue...BUT...when does realization set in that these fixes, if they ever come in, will cause no change to the status quo?

Does the demand for removal of PVP start getting louder? And with the inevitable failure of that, what happens?

It is my firm belief this IS as core to the design of the game as the issues discussed in the Pit of Despair and there will be no wholesale changes that would compromise the ability to play immorally against others in the game. We just have to accept that this is how the game will be played and do what we can to change it....within the game. Socially, all that can be done is what is being done....try to shame people into playing with a better sense of the offended's morality...but if the players that are playing 'immorally' refuse to accept the definition of others morality...move on.


The devs have publicly stated that they DESIRE a morally ambiguous game. They also have stated that this type of gaming should be avoidable...and it completely is.
 
We don't o-o, I'm a huge supporter of a flag system in Open.

Surely just creating zones for dedicated PvP, or more mechanics which can pit CMDR vs CMDR would be a positive move too?

eg: In a couple of systems are zones for TV in ED who want air PvP combat taking place (think CQC). So 3-4 dedicated zones are created where PvP is fine to participate in, CRs are award for kills, and rebuys covered to some degree. Some CQC backdrops could even be re-used for some of these...

Would be nice if Comminuty Goal combat zones were also one side vs another too, so you could choose a side, and that's it for the week or so... With results (tiers levels) split between results in SOLO/GROUP and OPEN. So OPEN results could for 50% at least to prevent runnaway SOLO farming results dictating the results.


Basically just some mechanics to allow PvP in a more orchestrated way, rather than having to hunt around for hours trying to find someone else to fight.
 
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...and yet...no changes to the game occur to fix this. And public recognition from one of the leaders of the company that it occurred, without penalty to the group.

I mean no disrespect towards you, or any other player that is upset over this issue...BUT...when does realization set in that these fixes, if they ever come in, will cause no change to the status quo?

Does the demand for removal of PVP start getting louder? And with the inevitable failure of that, what happens?

It is my firm belief this IS as core to the design of the game as the issues discussed in the Pit of Despair and there will be no wholesale changes that would compromise the ability to play immorally against others in the game. We just have to accept that this is how the game will be played and do what we can to change it....within the game. Socially, all that can be done is what is being done....try to shame people into playing with a better sense of the offended's morality...but if the players that are playing 'immorally' refuse to accept the definition of others morality...move on.


The devs have publicly stated that they DESIRE a morally ambiguous game. They also have stated that this type of gaming should be avoidable...and it completely is.

I'm not upset by this issue but thanks anyway. I just get on with it.

But I can see why others are and when I see arguments with holes in them big enough to drive a bus through put belligerently that dismiss or just ignore any logical rebuttal I find myself getting involved.

I agree nothing will change though (almost certainly - you never know).
 
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