I have a purple fleet, does this top yours?
Something I'd like to say to those complaining about the new engineer system.
I have a purple fleet, does this top yours?
Sure, but I'm not sure why that should bother me I'm not into pvp.
But aren't you someone who just flyes the cobra all the time? A weird choice when it bothers you that others can have a better ship, no matter how much you engineer it others will have better ships.
I understand that max modules is not want everyone wants to do, but the logic being presented here is "One G5 roll on the new system take more effort that 1 G5 roll on the old system". In and of itself, this is an undeniably true statement, but...
If you dont want to be maxing out a module, can you please tell me what is the attraction of a single G5 mod? To me, it feels somehow like the worst thing to do. In the new system, you pay all the performance negatives on the very first roll, and over the course of 6-12 rolls, you gradually get all the improvements. A single G5 roll is the opposite of min/max - its maximum negatives for minimum advantage.
So, if you are happy with less than a maxed G5 roll (and I fully understand why, not challenging that), surely the next place to look is a maxed G4 or a maxed G3 mod? (And I'll say it again, on my Corvette with 28 mods on it, not one single Max G4 mod was worse than the legacy G5 mod it was converted from).
If you're real goal is best bang for your buck (most advantage for least about of mats grind), just forget G5 mods completely. The new G4 mods are in most cases superior or old G5 mods (if you were doing only a few rolls), and massively easier to get the mats for. Please dont ignore that lower grade mods requirer more common mats, and please, please dont ignore that under the new system, the "overlap" between adjacent grades has gone, and therefore G4 mods are entirely viable if your goal is maximize improvement for least effort.
Last edited:
OP you contradict yourself and end up proving the opposite point, the one you say "doesn't make any sense at all".
You basically wrote a long post saying that the people who were previously satisfied with an average G5 roll somehow are now better off because it's now much easier do get a god G5 roll than before, all while confirming that those same people that were satisfied with 3 or 4 G5 rolls to get an average now have to do a lot more rolls than before for every single mod, for every single ship...
If something doesn't make any sense at all, it's your opening post's logic. But that is because you still don't get it... some people didn't care about god rolls, they were satisfied with an average G5 roll, and those were better off before, this is completely irrefutable, regardless of how much easier it is now to get a god G5 roll.
You basically wrote a long post saying that the people who were previously satisfied with an average G5 roll somehow are now better off because it's now much easier do get a god G5 roll than before, all while confirming that those same people that were satisfied with 3 or 4 G5 rolls to get an average now have to do a lot more rolls than before for every single mod, for every single ship...
If something doesn't make any sense at all, it's your opening post's logic. But that is because you still don't get it... some people didn't care about god rolls, they were satisfied with an average G5 roll, and those were better off before, this is completely irrefutable, regardless of how much easier it is now to get a god G5 roll.
Last edited:
Deleted member 110222
D
Numbers. The percentage values of the modifications are the same whatever ship is being discussed.
Yes. Other ships will be better by virtue of not being a Cobra.
But it is nice to know that should someone choose to fly a Cobra, there's a good chance mine is more capable than theirs.
You know, I never thought I'd say this, but 90sKid might have been on to something with his pre-patch rambling.
Gold or Chrome trumps both.
On a more serious note, I have to agree with Ziggy in that not everyone is hung up on the min/max-train to the exclusion of other factors. However, I still believe the new system is actually better on balance. Especially given the changes to material inventory/stock management and the addition of material traders.
With the addition of material traders there is possibly less grind on balance since lower class materials and data can be both upgraded and downgraded as required if the RNG is not actually dropping the materials you need.
Last edited:
Deleted member 110222
D
But why settle for less when you can have more?
Because you dont enjoy grinding mats? I think thats clear enough, and a lot of people will be in that category.
The more interesting topic is "whats the best bang for the least mats grind". I think the new system wins here.
[Edit: Also, in many cases I don't max out my power plant, cos I just dont need the power. If I dont need the power, I can avoid worse heat efficiency].
Last edited:
Simple answer - time/cost efficiency - sometimes the gains are not worth the expense.
Far as I see it, the new system caters to both.
People who want the max, can get it, easily.
People who are okay with "average"...well, my very best G5 Clean Drive Tuning on the old system was handily matched by the top of the new G3 in terms of speed, while giving it lower power draw and better thermal reduction. My best Dirty Drive Tunings were about matched by the G4 of the current system, and with less power draw and less thermal increase. So there it is. Old G5 performance, current G3-G4.
Seems like it works for everyone, and for whatever your performance target is, you have fewer rolls to get there.
People who want the max, can get it, easily.
People who are okay with "average"...well, my very best G5 Clean Drive Tuning on the old system was handily matched by the top of the new G3 in terms of speed, while giving it lower power draw and better thermal reduction. My best Dirty Drive Tunings were about matched by the G4 of the current system, and with less power draw and less thermal increase. So there it is. Old G5 performance, current G3-G4.
Seems like it works for everyone, and for whatever your performance target is, you have fewer rolls to get there.
Because not everybody thinks getting an extra 0.2% turning rate, or 0.2 ly extra jump range is worth the work. Or maybe collecting materials is not everyone's cup of tea.
On the old system, the max number of G5 rolls I ever did for a single module was 6, and was just one single time on thusters for a Clipper, usually I did no more than 2/3. Does this means someone else out there got better modules than me? Zero frags given!
I don't dispute that the new system, as a whole, is much better than before. But still, it's completely undeniable that it favoured the god-roll obsessed people by a lot, but trampled on the people who just wanted an average G5 mod and off they went.
Last edited:
Well, you talk about maximazing and whatnot and I try to explain it again: any kind of maximazing (whatever grade) or most efficent way of doing this and that is not something I ever think about.
And also I did like the randomness of the old system tbh, got some weird mods here and there that gives some of my ships strange quirks (good or bad) and I like that. Now its all just designed for the purpose that everybody gets the same thing, which isn't necessary a bad thing and I understand why most will like this but at the end of the day to me its just a very weird new outfitting thats a hassle to engange with.
I mean I did test it, converted some stuff on my T9 to the new system and that wasn't a pleasent expierence to me. And while the stats are a bit better now it was not worth it going through that hassle for a little bit of increase in numbers. And I didn't have to start at G1 there.
Granted in parts the new system has its upsite even to me, where it beats the old one is in cases where I just want a small little tweak from a G1 mod like the overcharged powerplant. In those cases the new system is better since its still just one roll like in the old system but now with remote engineering I don't have to go to the engineer to do it.
But all in all I like the old system much better. What I hope gets more stuff is the techbroker, I like getting some sorta engineered stuff from there much better then using the new engineers.
I totaly agree with the original post.
Although I was reluctant at first I love the new engineers now.
If Frontier keeps it the way it is now then I'm very content.
Maybe a little adjustment at the mat broker would be nice, 6 for 1 is a bit steep imho but it's not gamebreaking for me.
Although I was reluctant at first I love the new engineers now.
If Frontier keeps it the way it is now then I'm very content.
Maybe a little adjustment at the mat broker would be nice, 6 for 1 is a bit steep imho but it's not gamebreaking for me.
Well yeah, but surley you should understand my point of view given that explanation. You are not flying the best possible ship and are happy with it and not botherd by others having better ships, just like I don't use the best possible mods and are not bothered by others having better mods. Its not all that diffrent.
You were never guaranteed a mid role though. My G5 FSD after 5-6 G5 rolls is at 32%. Even a hi end G3 roll beats that in the old system. When I convert it to a G4 new system it will be a guaranteed improvement of 10%.
That is the issue with the old system. I am happy with an average G5 or top end G4 in the new system. I am very much a casual player, lucky to get three hours a week to play, and I find this new system a million times better.
One of the reason why I like it is that the lower grades are important. I don't feel like I am wasting my time putting a grade three upgrade on my ship as they are now a requirement for higher grades.
Last edited:
Why convert stuff if you were happy with what you had and not bothered by getting higher end mods?
The blueprints are great, as is the new materials filter. There were always going to be people who hate the new system. Those people are the lucky ones. Whenever I visited the old engineers I never got any experimental effects. I was always watching that roulette wheel spin around before another lose.
If that's the case then it shouldn't bother you slowly upgrading when its convenient. You should be happy with Grade 1s and 2s then.
Gold or Chrome trumps both.
On a more serious note, I have to agree with Ziggy in that not everyone is hung up on the min/max-train to the exclusion of other factors. However, I still believe the new system is actually better on balance. Especially given the changes to material inventory/stock management and the addition of material traders.
With the addition of material traders there is possibly less grind on balance since lower class materials and data can be both upgraded and downgraded as required if the RNG is not actually dropping the materials you need.
Yep. The new system is an improvement. The fact it isn't an improvement for me in all aspects doesn't negate that. The enjoyment of those using it regularly beats a small dissatisfaction from those who don't.