Something I've noticed with the animals (Also applies to JW:E)

[tigris115]

After watching quite a bit of footage from both YouTube and playing the 2 games myself, I've noticed something that seems to be the reason why people don't feel that the animals are immersive. It's because they always walk and run in straight lines. If one looks at an animal from a birdseye view, they always walk or run straight, and then stop to turn. Frontier should implement turning while walking or running to make the movement of the animals feel more natural. This is the most apparent in the big dinosaurs of JWE who screech to a halt before turning which looks really silly.

I don't want to be angry but I feel for a company that prides itself on realistic/immersive depictions of a wide variety of animals, this can only be described as a gross oversight on the part of the game developers.

 

[LN]

I can only describe this as nitpicking (no offense).
I've been looking at my zoo and my animals some time last night. Not a single moment I had the thought: O, that's not real, they only walk in a straight line.....
I was looking at loads of animals doing loads of things. but that particular thought was not on my mind for a single moment.

 

[ShadowLilly]

I agree, all the movements etc are the same, there is no individual personality (which they advertised with). If you have 4 cubs they all walk, sleep, eat the same and most of the time also at the same time....

 

[paul78]

I have to agree with LN on this one. Sure I too wish the animals would show more personality traits. And very true frontier did advertise this to the point where most people assumed you’d have a elephant that liked being alone. Or a nervous animal who was shy around guests and ect. But the animals movements there self is a little too much imo. This is a game after all so in terms of real life like movement down to a tee is asking too much. I’m sure frontier could no doubt made animals as real as they wanted them to be but keep in mind their are timeframes for development and what not. I’m a firm believer that if you expect or want more in one area of the game it does take away from another area of the game in return. Sure someday games will be so life like and the technology will be there to do that but it’s still a ways away yet. So in all I think frontier has done a good job so far and overall I’m very pleased with the game and definitely feel like I’ve gotten my money’s worth from this game.

 

[tigris115]

I ain't trying to be unreasonable in this regard. I just feel that this is a simple thing that could be fixed easily if some work was put into it. And it doesn't ruin the 2 games, it's just one thing that I feel is kind of distracting and makes the animals feel a little robotic.

 

[Urufu1997]

I think the Animals in every Zoo Game I've played so far, do stop to turn. But I'm pretty sure Frontier can implement turning while walking/running. Just look at the great Climbing System that was never in a Game before. It still needs to be fixed a bit, but it shows that they do their best if they want something to be in the Game

 

[tigris115]

Yea Frontier can easily implement turning if they wanted to.

 

[Swjosdotschka]

Hmm... I admit, I'm out of the honey moon stage with Planet Zoo and Frontier lately, but I can not say that the path finding of the animals in Planet Zoo are what doesn' make them feel not fleshed out enough for me. For me, they walk just fine. It's personality and difference in that I miss. And for me Frontier begins to always take the easy way on things. In the Australia pack foe example, the joey getting out of the pouches is a one time birthing animation. The baby will never crawl back into the pouch (like they would do in real life). The apes do not really interact in a meaningful way with their offspring either. Every interaction and animation just scratches the top, there is no depth to it. That is what bothers me more than them animal path finding and moving in PZ.

However, in JWE it's terrible. There is no denying that.

I don't know, maybe I watched to many indie companies lately putting all their heart into the tiniest of details that I feel like Frontier is not doing this LATELY. I loved the Australia pack and the very genourus free update we got with it, but if you play with both for a while, you see that it's not as shiny. I really hope Frontier can step up their game again in the future and put much more love into details.

 

[NL_Mutso]

I ain't trying to be unreasonable in this regard. I just feel that this is a simple thing that could be fixed easily if some work was put into it. And it doesn't ruin the 2 games, it's just one thing that I feel is kind of distracting and makes the animals feel a little robotic.

Never paid much attention to it and while I'm not bothered by it (same goes with personalities, btw) - I can see your point though.
Seen some YT videos and when you focus on it, it is more noticeable..
I think small changes could do wonders for some people.

Hmm... I admit, I'm out of the honey moon stage with Planet Zoo and Frontier lately

Took you long enough Tbh, haven't been able to commit to the game since July - maybe a few hours per week. While I fully appreciate the last DLC/free update and really glad that a lot of people liked, this wasn't my thing.

I don't know, maybe I watched to many indie companies lately putting all their heart into the tiniest of details that I feel like Frontier is not doing this LATELY. I loved the Australia pack and the very genourus free update we got with it, but if you play with both for a while, you see that it's not as shiny. I really hope Frontier can step up their game again in the future and put much more love into details.

I think this one is a bit tricky. A lot of people are asking for more content/animals/building pieces but people also want more detail. I don't think asking for both is a reasonable "demand".
Indie companies do put a lot of effort in details but I think replayability for a lot of games is a bit lacking. But still a big fan of indie gaming companies, at the right price a good buy.
I agree, hope they can step up their game because my interest in PZ is fading away slowly.

 

[Swjosdotschka]

Indie companies do put a lot of effort in details but I think replayability for a lot of games is a bit lacking. But still a big fan of indie gaming companies, at the right price a good buy.
I agree, hope they can step up their game because my interest in PZ is fading away slowly.

Depends on the game, I think. Both indie games I follow currently are not yet released, but so far I see high replayability. Remember, when Planet Coaster launched, Frontier was indie as well. (At least to my knowledge). Lately, it feels like they loose their contact to the base, including the player base. Can't really put my fingers on something, but if I compare communication even during beta and now it is visible, and even more so if I compare it from indie developers with Frontier. They don't turn into EA yet (thankfully) but things are not changing for the better.

Anyway, back on topic (kind of): With details it is a small line, I know. For me, having more fleshed out DLCs every 6 month would be much more reasonable than half-baked DLC every 3 month. If DLCs would be fleshed out more, in my opinion the demand for new stuff wouldn't arise as fast as well. Currently it feels like eating fast food: Makes you very happy for the moment and it is tasty, but you will be hungry a few hours later again. It's time for a well cooked, healthy meal or we will all get fed up with this game way too soon. I mean, not me, obviosuly, as I have yet to reach 5 years of buiilding in a Planet game while for Planco players it is same old, same old, but the people who actually want a management game and a zoo simulation aren't always unreasonable, when they complain.

And some details aren't even too hard to implement. I mean, speaking of the joeys, half of the animation is already there. I don't think it would be exceptional hard to take the animation and make it appear also out of the birthing scene. But parent to offspring interaction would make the animals already feel a lot more lively.

And speaking of the Australia pack (though off topic again), the problems with the editable signs are also what I would call attention to details (or lack theiroff) and are quite simply sloppy. And THAT is something I'd never thought I expierience in a Frontier game. Still have hopes though and hope they just take a breath, collect their concentration again and turn back to be a down to earth company that do care to release the best game possible. And looking at the last time I was in that mood with them, they will knock me out of my socks with the next big free update anyway.

 

[giu94]

After watching quite a bit of footage from both YouTube and playing the 2 games myself, I've noticed something that seems to be the reason why people don't feel that the animals are immersive. It's because they always walk and run in straight lines. If one looks at an animal from a birdseye view, they always walk or run straight, and then stop to turn. Frontier should implement turning while walking or running to make the movement of the animals feel more natural. This is the most apparent in the big dinosaurs of JWE who screech to a halt before turning which looks really silly.

I don't want to be angry but I feel for a company that prides itself on realistic/immersive depictions of a wide variety of animals, this can only be described as a gross oversight on the part of the game developers.

I agree, I see this with my lions every time. Don't know if it happens with every animal though

 

[NL_Mutso]

Remember, when Planet Coaster launched, Frontier was indie as well. (At least to my knowledge)

Maybe 15 years before they released PC They've been around long enough.

Anyway, back on topic (kind of): With details it is a small line, I know. For me, having more fleshed out DLCs every 6 month would be much more reasonable than half-baked DLC every 3 month. If DLCs would be fleshed out more, in my opinion the demand for new stuff wouldn't arise as fast as well

Fair point, but I'm not sure the "demanding part" would change. Maybe a jab at ZT/ZT2 but they added fleshed out features for the base game behind paid DLC. At least they're not doing this. Never liked that but a lot of people don't know this because they bought the complete collection (with all features)

And some details aren't even too hard to implement. I mean, speaking of the joeys, half of the animation is already there. I don't think it would be exceptional hard to take the animation and make it appear also out of the birthing scene. But parent to offspring interaction would make the animals already feel a lot more lively.

Oh I agree with that. Changing some details would change a lot for players. I don't think we can expect huge overhauls, especially with the original animal roster and especially not this much time after release.

 

[AndyZoos]

For me, this falls into the category of something that would be cool but... I don't know how much more it would add to the game versus what it would take to program (and the CPU it would take to accomplish). Maybe it wouldn't take much but still, I can think of a bunch of other stuff that I'd like to see (diving for animals that swim!) rather than this.

 

[LN]

For me, this falls into the category of something that would be cool but... I don't know how much more it would add to the game versus what it would take to program (and the CPU it would take to accomplish). Maybe it wouldn't take much but still, I can think of a bunch of other stuff that I'd like to see (diving for animals that swim!) rather than this.

I'm pretty sure that what the OP wants requires a constant calculation for the animals regarding the area they walk.
As people are already complaining a lot about drops of performance due to the amount of stuff that needs to be calculated, I think this would only worsen things.

That's why the animals always check if there is enough room for them to perform a certain animation before it even starts the animation. And why I think it's a bit to much of demanding them to make these calculations on the go and keep updating them while they move around the habitat. I don't think a lot of the machines people play on are up to that task. And the game needs to be played by more players than only the ones that invest a lot of money into their machines.

That is my fair and honest opinion on the matter.

 

[Jeminyne]

For me, a better fix would be if the animals just... didn't move around so much in the first place. I can't think of any zoo trip where I walked up to an enclosure and saw all the animals sporadically walking and jogging around in all different directions. Not just the lions and grazing animals-- ALL animals. They like to lie down and stand together in groups of their own kind, grazing or sunbathing or just snoozing. It's especially weird in multi-species habitats, when you see your elephants and zebras and giraffes all randomly walking past each other. It makes the game look extra fake and silly, because that's not what you're going to see in real life. You're going to see the zebras all clumped together, the giraffes all clumped together, the elephants too probably... you're not gonna see a baby zebra randomly swimming in deep water while a giraffe runs headlong into a fence, and the elephants completely ignoring each other.

I don't know how they'd fix this, maybe have the RNG (?) for interaction set so high, that they're almost always herding, grazing or snoozing...

 

[AndyZoos]

I'm pretty sure that what the OP wants requires a constant calculation for the animals regarding the area they walk.
As people are already complaining a lot about drops of performance due to the amount of stuff that needs to be calculated, I think this would only worsen things.

That's why the animals always check if there is enough room for them to perform a certain animation before it even starts the animation. And why I think it's a bit to much of demanding them to make these calculations on the go and keep updating them while they move around the habitat. I don't think a lot of the machines people play on are up to that task. And the game needs to be played by more players than only the ones that invest a lot of money into their machines.

That is my fair and honest opinion on the matter.

I think you're right. And while I respect suggestions like the one made by OP related to the in-game animal behavior, more often than not they feel infeasible due to the current tech restrictions. For a lot of the behavior modifications that people are wanting, something else would have to give. What that would be, I'm not sure. I can think of a few things that I'd remove, but they're a part of the core game so they aren't going anywhere, hah. You could reduce some of the enrichment/social interactions but then you'd have people griping that the animals aren't doing that enough (which would be a fair critique, I think).

It's all a balancing act, really. They could implement more complicated animals, but to do that something else would need to drop. The same thing comes into play when people have suggestions for things like more detailed interactions with animals (e.g., breeding animations, fighting)... You have to weigh the value-add for the player against the stress it's going to put on the game.

If Frontier could pull it off, I think that would be amazing. But I'm not sure it's feasible at this point.

 

[AndyZoos]

For me, a better fix would be if the animals just... didn't move around so much in the first place. I can't think of any zoo trip where I walked up to an enclosure and saw all the animals sporadically walking and jogging around in all different directions. Not just the lions and grazing animals-- ALL animals. They like to lie down and stand together in groups of their own kind, grazing or sunbathing or just snoozing. It's especially weird in multi-species habitats, when you see your elephants and zebras and giraffes all randomly walking past each other. It makes the game look extra fake and silly, because that's not what you're going to see in real life. You're going to see the zebras all clumped together, the giraffes all clumped together, the elephants too probably... you're not gonna see a baby zebra randomly swimming in deep water while a giraffe runs headlong into a fence, and the elephants completely ignoring each other.

I don't know how they'd fix this, maybe have the RNG (?) for interaction set so high, that they're almost always herding, grazing or snoozing...

While this is a decent possible resolution, I think you'd find a decent chunk of the base complaining about animals then "not doing enough" if you went that route. It would be more realistic for sure but I kinda get why people wouldn't want to sit around and wait for their lemurs to wake up to get a good screenshot. I kinda like the level of activity, myself, but would be down for them reducing it slightly to enhance something else... I can just see a lot of other people taking issue with it.

Of course, this flies in the face of my stance on birds/aviaries (just put 'em in the game with limited movements--birds in zoos don't fly constantly, just have 'em go from perch A to perch B and be done with it). But that's a whole 'other topic.

 

[NL_Mutso]

It's all a balancing act, really. They could implement more complicated animals, but to do that something else would need to drop.

That's were I think OP's comment could work.
Quite a few people wanting unique personalities because they want to feel their animals are too robotic.
I think smaller changes could help change the "robotic" feel of animals.

For me, a better fix would be if the animals just... didn't move around so much in the first place

To me, that would be similar to OP's comment - less robotic behavior
People wanted more and more interaction but you're right - a lot of animals in RL zoos aren't that active and jogging around.
When some animals in a habitat are more resting than others, it wouldn't look robotic.

So both changes would be nice !

LN did point an issue with the constant calculation/more animation, maybe even creating new clipping issues.

 

[tigris115]

To people saying curved movement would create issues, JPOG did that in 2003 and it was pretty smooth. And 2003 is a long time ago, I was just 8 at the time.

 

[AndyZoos]

To people saying curved movement would create issues, JPOG did that in 2003 and it was pretty smooth. And 2003 is a long time ago, I was just 8 at the time.

Different games, different engines. That game was significantly more limited than Planet Zoo in terms of functionality.

And I would put money on those in-game dinos being significantly less sophisticated than the animals in PZ are.