Star Citizen Thread v6

[Tippis]

Is making everything the company owns as collateral normal as well?

No, but it's not like CIG has all that much of value to put up, and chances are that a bank would classify them as a very risky venture, making the credit rating of what they can offer rather low. So requiring “everything” for even a fairly small loan wouldn't be all that surprising.


As a bonus, it might also introduce the first proper pledging in this whole venture.

Oh, and as someone pointed out, there's this funny bit at the end:

24. LICENSE

24.1 The Chargee [Coutts & Co.] hereby grants the Chargor [CIG UK] an exclusive license, revocable only in accordance with Clause 24.2, to develop, produce, exploit and otherwise deal with the Game.

24.2 The Chargee may terminate the license granted persuant to Clause 24.1 above upon the happening of an Event of Default which remains unremedied on the date falling 60 days after the Chargee has given written notiec the Chargor of such Event of Default.

Translation: Coutts now owns the game. CIG may develop it if they keep paying their bills within 60 days of Coutts asking for the cash. Otherwise, snip-snip. CIG is now leasing the rights to develop the game they were given $150M+ to develop.

 

[Thargon]

Found it.

Here was my previous prediction: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/259596-The-Star-Citizen-Thread-v5?p=5557796#post5557796

Could be pretty accurate if they are taking out loans

 

[Dice Dev.]

That Bank only loans you money if your financially secure..lol nothing else needs to be said....do your homework really...

 

[Dice Dev.]

Also the narrative on this forum for over 10000+ posts and 6 amazing long threads is that SC/CIG/S42 etc. Is a scam why would any bank loan them money if you guys were right ? .. pls do explain..

 

[Marak]

Interesting, so now if Star Citizen fails NO ONE will get a refund. All the assets will be owned by Coutts & co, so there is nothing for the backers.

With CIG being a limited company, all CR's assets are safe.

Looks a bit dodgy to me.

 

[AJW]

Interesting, so now if Star Citizen fails NO ONE will get a refund. All the assets will be owned by Coutts & co, so there is nothing for the backers.

With CIG being a limited company, all CR's assets are safe.

Looks a bit dodgy to me.

The backers didn't own the assets before, and they don't now. Nothing has changed there. Refunds are only ever going to be available while the company is a going concern, and anyone who expects a refund if it fails has a pretty poor grasp of economics.

 

[Thargon]

I still can't believe they are taking in 1.3M - 2.6M USD a month still. Is that enough to cover their outgoing costs? Getting a loan suggests they have cashflow problems.

300,000 odd USD was spent yesterday

I guess we will not get a clear response from them until after the fact.

Derek has been very quiet lately, still waiting for the bombshell he hinted was in the wings.

Also, separate topic - been looking at the old stretch goals on the rsi website. So many broken promises there.

For example:

$12,000,000

- Build professional sound studios. We’ll move Star Citizen’s sound production from a home office to high tech facilities that will give us access to cutting edge sound effects and Hollywood voice talent!
- The Hangar Module will feature Oculus Rift support.

Really? Oculus Rift support? I thought they ditched VR support?

 

[Marak]

The backers didn't own the assets before, and they don't now. Nothing has changed there. Refunds are only ever going to be available while the company is a going concern, and anyone who expects a refund if it fails has a pretty poor grasp of economics.

Totally agree with you here, but if the game fails and CIG still have assets then they would be obliged to liquidate them and attempt to give some compensation to backers.

Now if it all goes (boobies) up they can walk away with no hassle.

 

[Asp Explorer]

300,000 odd USD was spent yesterday

Quality handbags are expensive!!!

Seriously though - where has all that money gone?

Even if they pay every person they have ever employed a minimum of $1000 a week, and they have 330 people, over 52 weeks and six years that's only just
shy of 103 million.

 

[ZeeWolf]

- The Hangar Module will feature Oculus Rift support.

Really? Oculus Rift support? I thought they ditched VR support?

No no, they nailed that one already...The Hangar Module had (native) DK1 support over three years ago. It involved messing around with console commands, creating a config file yourself and initially had the L/R screens the wrong way around. It doesn't work anymore. $12mil Stretch goal completed. Chris has done it again everyone!

 

[Thargon]

Quality handbags are expensive!!!

Seriously though - where has all that money gone?

Even if they pay every person they have ever employed a minimum of $1000 a week, and they have 330 people, over 52 weeks and six years that's only just
shy of 103 million.

I'm guessing there are the mocap studios/sound studios they set up. Business costs for setting up multiple offices (rent/facilities/computers/electricity?).

Trying to think of some other massive costs - servers? Website costs?

Also, there should be a profits & Loss accounts somewhere detailing all their assets (at least for the uk side) on Companies house. Not sure if there is an equivalent anywhere on the US side.

 

[Asp Explorer]

I'm guessing there are the mocap studios/sound studios they set up.

I was thinking that too. Multiple mocap studios set up by CIG to perfect their high-fidelity movie, and rent capacity and expertise out to other parties and make a bit of extra cash.

So how do they then have to do mocap in a lunch area that takes about 30 minutes to set up, and require repeated repeats?

 

[Tippis]

Quality handbags are expensive!!!

Seriously though - where has all that money gone?

Even if they pay every person they have ever employed a minimum of $1000 a week, and they have 330 people, over 52 weeks and six years that's only just
shy of 103 million.

Well, let's look at that, then. Going by F42, we have £44,800 a person a year in 2015 and £44,400 in 2016. That's already $1100 a week — 10% more — before we add in other overhead costs of having people around (easily on the order of an additional 20–30%). And that's for what's probably their cheapest studio. The other half of the company will cost more.

Before we've even considered external costs — consultants, outsourced services, mocap studios — we're already skirting close to the additional 50% that would put them over what they've collected from backers so far if your final number is right.

 

[ZeeWolf]

I bet Mark Hamill, Gillian Anderson and Andy Serkis don't come cheap either.

 

[Maruun]

That thematic is normaly outside my league but i think its worth checking on.
There are alot of shellfirms and i doubt just because "CIG" is being loaned away it will probably not touch RSI or any other of their shellfirms.

 

[AJW]

Totally agree with you here, but if the game fails and CIG still have assets then they would be obliged to liquidate them and attempt to give some compensation to backers.

Now if it all goes (boobies) up they can walk away with no hassle.

In the event of it going base-over-apex the value of tangible assets is likely to be too low to amount to much anyway, in comparison to how much the backers have put in. They have been mostly funding wages and running costs, and that isn't going to be recoverable regardless of bank loan terms or anything else.

 

[Asp Explorer]

I bet Mark Hamill, Gillian Anderson and Andy Serkis don't come cheap either.

I am sure that Genuine Roberts will sell enough used cars / take out loans to cover their fees. It's his lifetime goal to achieve the SQ42 movie, absolutely nothing is going to get in his way.

 

[ZioYuri78]

Don't worry guys, CR is ready for a new kickstarter to buy all the assets from the bank if they will fail.

 

[Marak]

Another interesting thing - I looked at Spectrum about 30 mins ago and there was a thread about CIG's bank loan.

Just checked back (it was entertaining) and it's disappeared, not closed but gone.

I so wished I'd screenshotted some of the comments 'cos some were really funny

 

[Asp Explorer]

I so wished I'd screenshotted some of the comments 'cos some were really funny

Set your browser to offline and go back through the history, and Alt - Prtsc