The core gameplay is boring

[lysan]

First we need to define "good game play" what is it? My daughter loved angry birds, played it all the time, is that good game design?

I played Raise of the Tomb Raider the other day, completed it in two days, ok didn't find all the stuff on the maps, however after the main story was done, I lost interest for the game. Is that good game play?

Games I repeatably come back to are;

DCS
Prepar3D
ED
ArmA 3
DayZ SA
IL-2

I do agree that ED need to evolve, however I sure this is also the DEVS goal. Rome was not build in one day, and I don't believe ED will be build in one day either

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

PP does not really influence the galaxy, it's impact is negliable, thats one issue with PP.

It does influence galaxy quite a lot, and they are looking for ways to tie both BGS and PP in more balanced way that would make sense to us. I expect PP to receive some streamlining in any of Season 2 updates.

ask yourself why Elite recives a mixed on steam and many other games not? Yes all agmes have people complaining yte other games make a mostly positive and others just a mixed. Mostly negative games are those that in nearly all cases aren't working properly. Ed works quite well, its technically rather stable. So when her eis so much "complaints" its probably somethign to take serious. Because the true investors are NOT the ones havign shares in your company it's the gamers who buy stuff and make sure that your shareholdes get a statisfying interets rate on their shares. And if that is in danger they even may retreat. While your gamers only retreta if you make them unhappy.

Other games also receives mixed reviews, however ED case is special, because it has been constantly attacked by various unhappy people. Ways how review scores are calculated gives them ways to express their dislike despite not forming majority opinion. In overall, majority of players are happy with game. However FD doesn't cave in or doesn't carter special groups of people...and that engages them. Latest score push down was deliberately done by people not liking Horizons price tag. Again, nothing to do with the game really. If players want to retreat they do so - they don't threaten projects to do their bidding, because frankly that's some screwed up toxic nonsense to do communication.

So sry but no matter what function Frontier impelmented they all were shallow and half heartly done. Thats why people kept complaining, not for the sake f complaining, becasue the change, or addition was just not done properly.

Shallow and half heartly done is just opinion. For someone its good enough. For someone, he wants Excel for trading and individual thruster control for flight. But that's not the game he looks for here.

 

[Ziljan]

The OP is unfortunately correct. The repetitive tasks in this game are not addictive or compelling, nor do they feel connected in any way to each other or to a greater sense of purpose. They can be fun, but they don't make me want to lose sleep just to do one more mission, or scan one more planet. It's pretty easy to walk away from. I am not so sure that's an entirely bad thing since it also makes for a healthier relationship with our game

That being said, if you start looking under the hood and trying to decipher the mechanics of the game, there is quite a bit more on offer. Knowing this deeper info won't give you much marginal benefit, but it's still fun to puzzle it out.

 

[Jex =TE=]

These forums are not always a very welcoming habitat for players who actually like the game! Positive comments are usually construed as "white knighting", and the predictable, objectionable accusations of mindless "fanboi" [sic] adoration are thrown around.

I have more fun playing the game than reading about why I am an idiot for enjoying it, despite some of its acknowledged shortcomings.

It's the people who say they love the game, that it doesn't need updating and that if you don't think the same as them, you just need to use your imagination. I don't think anyone who likes the game gets called a fanboi unless they are resolutely saying the game is perfect and everyone should just shut up about it.

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

It's the people who say they love the game, that it doesn't need updating and that if you don't think the same as them, you just need to use your imagination. I don't think anyone who likes the game gets called a fanboi unless they are resolutely saying the game is perfect and everyone should just shut up about it.

You just tried to call out people who you want to call "fanbois" without calling them fanbois

 

[Lily from anim.o.v.e]

No, that is your opinion that you know facts. All you have is opinion, nothing more, nothing less. Said that, you really think FD are stupid enough to listen just to positive feedback - well, you haven't worked in big software company, have you. I will let you have a secret - positive feedback is usually cast aside. Negative feedback gets much more visibility in dev eyes, because it indicates that someone ain't happy. And for them it doesn't matter is it based on facts or not - they feel obliged to do something about it.

Now, there are two groups of negative feedback - feedback about fundamental dislike about the game, which FD can do very little about it. Then "this is our game, that's how we designed it, sorry if you don't like it". You accept it and move on. And then there's feedback FD can work upon. Sometimes feedback hides some more fundamental issues. Good QA/support and design easily gets why some of input comes in.

See, relationships, even between players and game development company of such ongoing longterm projct, are complex. It is constant re-balance and looking for long term solutions. If you treat it like a math problem which needs solution you won't get nowhere far. It is not something you can easily solve, or even solve at all.

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"So many people" are about maybe 100 - 200 people at best. It is effective echo chamber. Doesn't mean there's no problems to solve, but doesn't mean there's fundamental issue with the game either.

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"So many people" are about maybe 100 - 200 people at best. It is effective echo chamber. Doesn't mean there's no problems to solve, but doesn't mean there's fundamental issue with the game either.

I work in VERY big software development, just not gaming, and its all about facts, if we would hop on "opinions" we soon would pay a lot fines beyond imagination. fines where FD could close their studio even.

it is no opinion to say there is no economy system in ED.
it is no opinion to to say gameplay is unbalanced, (otherwise robigo runs would not make the outstanding 20Millions/hours comapred to maybe 5 in mining.
it is no opinion that PP has bad mechanics when it cna be exploited by "within players" undermining it. Thats just a fact based on bad desing. If we would implement such designs in our software we would brake so many SLA's that we could close in a week due to the fines in those SLA's. Elite is "just a agme" in worts cae you get some complaints on the short term, and in long term people stop palying. But thats still somethign that can be critically, if you are a game having to run a server. in B2P games it doens't matters once you sold your copies.
FD desicded to ad rocky asteroids, and minerals nearly no one mines there and these minerals because they are pointless. These ARE fundamental design issue within the Minign module of the game, because someone had to implment and put work (money) towards these things that in the end no one actually intercats with ingame. How is that a flaw made of an opinion. That was a lot of development ressources wasted for dead content.


Proper game design comes from understanding the facs in the complaints (not the opinions) to fix the bad game designs holes. Listeing to opinions is a marketing startegy of what target audience you want to focus onto. But this is seperated form the fact based feedback towards your design your decided to put into your software.

If studios like FD would make connected car or even upcoming healthcare software, OUCH!! A lot people would probably die by the most basic mistakes and holes in the design. So we can be happy they just make games.

 

[Colonel Kenney]

If you actually read the forum posts from the devs and read the newsletters, you will see that they have acknowledged the "problems" and have already said mechanics of the game will be upgraded. Fixed is the wrong term as they generally work at the moment, expanded upon is what will be happening and looks like the first part of that will be 2.1 Engineers.

I really can't stand the term white knights.

Sorry .. how about bobblehead? Fanboys are now considered a swear word here and you'll get reprimanded or banned for using it. Sycophant is similar as well but there really is no real clear term for someone who hopelessly engrossed in their love for their masters that it would be impossible for them to do any wrong. There is no term for it. White Knights are what the internet sort of chose and its being used across forums across many many games. Its the cleanest form. Forum mods won't bat an eye at someone if they are called a "whiner" or "complainer" though.

Spoiler

 

[Roybe]

I work in VERY big software development, just not gaming, and its all about facts, if we would hop on "opinions" we soon would pay a lot fines beyond imagination. fines where FD could close their studio even.

it is no opinion to say there is no economy system in ED.
it is no opinion to to say gameplay is unbalanced, (otherwise robigo runs would not make the outstanding 20Millions/hours comapred to maybe 5 in mining.
it is no opinion that PP has bad mechanics when it cna be exploited by "within players" undermining it. Thats just a fact based on bad desing. If we would implement such designs in our software we would brake so many SLA's that we could close in a week due to the fines in those SLA's. Elite is "just a agme" in worts cae you get some complaints on the short term, and in long term people stop palying. But thats still somethign that can be critically, if you are a game having to run a server. in B2P games it doens't matters once you sold your copies.
FD desicded to ad rocky asteroids, and minerals nearly no one mines there and these minerals because they are pointless. These ARE fundamental design issue within the Minign module of the game, because someone had to implment and put work (money) towards these things that in the end no one actually intercats with ingame. How is that a flaw made of an opinion. That was a lot of development ressources wasted for dead content.


Proper game design comes from understanding the facs in the complaints (not the opinions) to fix the bad game designs holes. Listeing to opinions is a marketing startegy of what target audience you want to focus onto. But this is seperated form the fact based feedback towards your design your decided to put into your software.

If studios like FD would make connected car or even upcoming healthcare software, OUCH!! A lot people would probably die by the most basic mistakes and holes in the design. So we can be happy they just make games.

All those you posted are opinions! LOL! All those things are answerable with...'because I say so!'. The devs disagree. <shrug> All those are design choices the devs made for 'their game'. You do not like it...express your opinion (which you did)...and hope for the best...or leave and wait to see if they are changed (unlikely!). Good luck!

 

[Lily from anim.o.v.e]

It does influence galaxy quite a lot, and they are looking for ways to tie both BGS and PP in more balanced way that would make sense to us. I expect PP to receive some streamlining in any of Season 2 updates.

How does it truly influence the galaxy? It's negiable, it does for most peopel even happen rather unnoticed. if it had a real impact peopel woudl notice it and care about these events. Most don't because it's impact is insiginificant.

Other games also receives mixed reviews, however ED case is special, because it has been constantly attacked by various unhappy people. Ways how review scores are calculated gives them ways to express their dislike despite not forming majority opinion. In overall, majority of players are happy with game. However FD doesn't cave in or doesn't carter special groups of people...and that engages them. Latest score push down was deliberately done by people not liking Horizons price tag. Again, nothing to do with the game really. If players want to retreat they do so - they don't threaten projects to do their bidding, because frankly that's some screwed up toxic nonsense to do communication.

Elite isn't special, its just one of many games.

Shallow and half heartly done is just opinion. For someone its good enough. For someone, he wants Excel for trading and individual thruster control for flight. But that's not the game he looks for here.

No dead content and illogical addition of submodules with exploitable holes and partially bein broken is whats make them shallow and half heartly done. Choosing these words was opinion, could also have said flawed and partially broken/bugged. But this sounds probably more "negative" while it's in it's menaing rather much the same.

 

[Henri]

[video=youtube;Ue-1O5sbxSc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ue-1O5sbxSc[/video]

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

I work in VERY big software development, just not gaming, and its all about facts, if we would hop on "opinions" we soon would pay a lot fines beyond imagination. fines where FD could close their studio even.

it is no opinion to say there is no economy system in ED.
it is no opinion to to say gameplay is unbalanced, (otherwise robigo runs would not make the outstanding 20Millions/hours comapred to maybe 5 in mining.
it is no opinion that PP has bad mechanics when it cna be exploited by "within players" undermining it. Thats just a fact based on bad desing. If we would implement such designs in our software we would brake so many SLA's that we could close in a week due to the fines in those SLA's. Elite is "just a agme" in worts cae you get some complaints on the short term, and in long term people stop palying. But thats still somethign that can be critically, if you are a game having to run a server. in B2P games it doens't matters once you sold your copies.
FD desicded to ad rocky asteroids, and minerals nearly no one mines there and these minerals because they are pointless. These ARE fundamental design issue within the Minign module of the game, because someone had to implment and put work (money) towards these things that in the end no one actually intercats with ingame. How is that a flaw made of an opinion. That was a lot of development ressources wasted for dead content.


Proper game design comes from understanding the facs in the complaints (not the opinions) to fix the bad game designs holes. Listeing to opinions is a marketing startegy of what target audience you want to focus onto. But this is seperated form the fact based feedback towards your design your decided to put into your software.

If studios like FD would make connected car or even upcoming healthcare software, OUCH!! A lot people would probably die by the most basic mistakes and holes in the design. So we can be happy they just make games.

So you basically have opinion ED doesn't work like it should work. That's fine *opinion* to have. But that's all.

Also game development differs hugely from those industries - and even those have huge screwups for big projects, despite having solid design documents and long year planned projects. Stuff just doesn't happen you would like to.

 

[Lily from anim.o.v.e]

All those you posted are opinions! LOL! All those things are answerable with...'because I say so!'. The devs disagree. <shrug> All those are design choices the devs made for 'their game'. You do not like it...express your opinion (which you did)...and hope for the best...or leave and wait to see if they are changed (unlikely!). Good luck!

you don't udnertsand,

Elite should have an economy system. Thast an opinion.
Elite not having an economy system. Thats a fact.

despite having solid design documents and long year planned projects. Stuff just doesn't happen you would like to.

These design documents do NOT at all in elite have a very detailed description. That is something I can tell you because playing the game even without these documentation shows in many aspects major flaws that a proper softwaredevelopment (no matter if game or not) should reaveal itself already in the design documentation. Those documents aren't solid.

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

How does it truly influence the galaxy? It's negiable, it does for most peopel even happen rather unnoticed. if it had a real impact peopel woudl notice it and care about these events. Most don't because it's impact is insiginificant.

Ask people who trade routes get trashed when system changes allegiance. Most don't because THEY DON'T CARE. It's not like PP stuff should open gateway to hell or anything.

 

[Ian Skippy]

You just tried to call out people who you want to call "fanbois" without calling them fanbois

Not only that, he also used his imagination (ha, the irony!) to conjure up non-existing people who claim the game doesn't need updating. Of the 1.4 million people exactly zero people have ever said that. Its a non-sensical statement, everybody wants everything to improve all the time. Its a perfect strawman argument, unfortunately neither deep nor wide.

 

[Jex =TE=]

Quoted for reference



I see comprehension of words is not your strong point. I was replying directly to the OP's comment, that much was made very clear from the start. As for nonsensical arguments... I have read your comments in the various threads and find them to bring nothing to the table other than negativity as shown above - hence I normally ignore most of what you say rather than make wild claims about the validity of another's opinion.

If you find my posts so 'nonsensical' may I suggest using the ignore feature, it will save you seconds of your life.

I'm not the one with a comprehension failure, which is why I pointed yours out, again. Like in other threads where you're failing to understand things and I've pointed that out there also. I see you accuse me of negativity also but show your hypocrisy as well

 

[KaizoMK]

First we need to define "good game play" what is it? My daughter loved angry birds, played it all the time, is that good game design?

I played Raise of the Tomb Raider the other day, completed it in two days, ok didn't find all the stuff on the maps, however after the main story was done, I lost interest for the game. Is that good game play?

Games I repeatably come back to are;

DCS
Prepar3D
ED
ArmA 3
DayZ SA
IL-2

I do agree that ED need to evolve, however I sure this is also the DEVS goal. Rome was not build in one day, and I don't believe ED will be build in one day either

ED should have good replay value since it's sandbox like. The repetitive nature of it isn't inherently bad, but every encounter just feels the same, except for some combat. I think putting faces and persistence to missions will be great, although I still think we need non-credit rewards as well. And yea, FD will constantly improve the game, but it's worth it to really analyze what's up with the game, especially since they do care about our input.

 

[Ian Phillips]

This has got long, bitter, repetitive and personal (and boring )

Go and calm down. Cool down time.