The General BugFixing/Playtesting thread for FFED3D+mods

[AndyJ]

I know Steve goes for the 'full-fat' experience as he has >4GB and 64bit Windows, so loads everything. I have seen the same issue once or twice with the same model when other programs were loaded in memory. It most likely failed to load the texture.
I've been extending the error checks when loading models and hopefully this won't happen in future. This area also seemed to be the main cause of start-up crashes so will see if that is improved in the next version.

v1.06 is still current as I ran out of time before Christmas to really test / expose cut-off distance values for drawing planets/asteroids. Flying into a busy asteroid field or near by a gas-giant with several of its asteroidal bodies/moons on screen would destroy frame rates. Doing some final testing and hopefully 1.07 will be out later today...

(the model is 74 for 4-arms, 77 for 2 arms and by default use large 2048x2048 textures. There are smaller versions within the skinpack folder of model 77)

 

[AndyJ]

v1.07 is available in the usual places...

 

[gunbladelad]

...I thought the Cloaking Device was never implemented into FE2 or FFE, but trust Steve to find a base that's using one...

I'll go have a peek at the latest version once I remember where the coal burner in this ancient system of mine is...

 

[Steve]

@ Steve,

Did you do a complete reinstall recently? If so don't forget you need all of AndyJ's files not just the patch update one?

No, I make a copy of the previous version's folder and then paste the new files into it.

If it is not that, then yes it may well be the memory threshold issue, you could try tweaking your ini file to reduce the number of new skins etc? There is also my texture mod that will easily reduce the memory overhead, you'll get FFED3DAJ running with all models+skins loaded under 1 gb, and without a noticeable loss of quality.

As AndyJ mentioned, I have plenty of memory and a 64 bit OS so the models have loads of room to fit in. It doesn't do it all the time, and hasn't done it at all under v1.07 so I'm hoping the problem has gone away

 

[Steve]

So.... v1.07 :smilie:

The star chart has become very Christmasy!

However the stars look great now, and increase in size gradually instead of popping into view as you fly toward them.

The engine flares on the Courier and Trader are very cool! Any chance they could be an option on other ships??

Thanks for fixing the star chart centering bug Andy. One of my pet hates!

I've yet to experiment with the custom textures for planets and suns. Will have to report back on that one.

Just for the record, my buttons still disappear

Also, it may be my imagination, but sometimes - not always - the sound and images on the bulletin board videos seems to be out of sync. Just checked with v1.06 and that's ok.

 

[AndyJ]

Oh... baubles!

I suppose this is one issue with only releasing a patch rather than a full package - peoples textures can vary and so not give quite the desired result! I've updated the core textures package to resolve this. [a v1.07 core textures pack is available to download]

I'll check the videos - I wouldn't have noticed as have been developing most of the year with a X-Fi Fatal1ty sound card that simply refuses to work most of the time under Windows 7, and unfortunately it doesn't look like Creative are going to fix the drivers. Finally switched it out last week with a PCIe version that came free with the motherboard (but lacks the front panel connections) and that now seems to be happy - as well as adding back the 4GB of memory that died in the summer.
If I have broken something though, I'd expect 1.06 to be where it's happened -I moved the video frame render call in the .asm code, so 1.05 vs 1.06 should show any difference I'd think.

As I've updated the core-textures file, I've included my up-scaled & darkened cabin images. They're not fantastic given the source resolution, but better I think than the bmp versions that are in the shareware download / original install. (drawCabin=2 in the config file to use them)

The engine flares on the Courier and Trader are very cool! Any chance they could be an option on other ships??

Thanks
The reason though that I added them back was because a player over on the Russian elite-games forums highlighted that they were different for these ships in Frontier and made the Courier/Trader a little more "special" to own versus other ships. I did ponder adding them to the Imperial Explorer as well but decided to keep with the Frontier canon that the flare is unique to those two ships... the explorer also has retro-flares and I wasn't so sure it'd look too good.

 

[nanite2000]

Hey AndyJ!

Just want to say a big THANK YOU for maintaining this. I've not had a chance to be involved in the game's development in any way for the past year, but I still keep downloading your latest releases and playtesting, and love seeing the improvements you are making.

I downloaded v1.07 recently and noticed an issue with the draw distance for planets. It works perfectly for stars (sweet!), but still has trouble with planets.

Go to Sol and set a course for Mercury. Get to just under 1AU and drop your dream timer from 5 to 4. At around 2000000km, the planet still 'pops' into view.

Is this a known issue? Was the draw distance only intended for stars and asteroids? I've tried modifying the draw distance for planets in the .cfg file, but they don't appear to have any effect. Could you tell me what the upper and lower bounds should be, and what effect they have?

 

[AndyJ]

Cheers nanite2000, and sorry about that - seems that I missed a late setting from the release .cfg file...

Try adding this into the config file after the planet cut-off setting:

cutOffDistance_SmallPlanet=28

Hopefully this should help a little! (The internal default value is 25, decrease the setting towards this if frame rates suffer)

If there are any more issues, or if people find some exceptions where the setting doesn't fit well enough I'm happy to hear as it's a work in progress. It might yet need to be tied closer to planet diameter or per-planet type.

A side effect that I've noticed from the extended draw distance is that the moons can now more frequently appear to be 'inside' the atmosphere of a planet when landed - e.g. at the start position if you accelerate time.
This existed before to a lesser extent and I'd thought that it might be a fundamental Z-issue, but I was taking another look yesterday and it just seems to be because the draw order of planets isn't ordered by distance at all - so the current planet & atmosphere can be drawn and then maybe a moon is drawn over the top of them. Oops!

I've previously added multiple-pass drawing to move stars so that they appear within the sky so it should be relatively easy to draw other moons/planets before the atmosphere.
However, I've also noticed that drawing a distant sun in the sky, that would previously have been a dot, can now be drawn over a planet that should really be eclipsing it ... quite rare that it happens, and I guess it'll just have to be the trade-off for being able to see the graphical sun in the sky & planets outside of it.

[edit]
as far as upper/lower bounds well too be honest it's a change that I put in over the Christmas period and only had limited time to test, but wanted to get it 'out there' for people to play with!
The default values are about right I think, slightly conservative for asteroids as you can easily run into a field of ~60 at places like Lave. Increasing the value by 1 to 4 is probably all you'd need to make a noticeable difference if you're still seeing pop-up, but you just have to be wary of frame-rates with asteroids or increasing too far for planets so that you don't see anything in the system view, e.g because the planet is in shadow and drawn as a pixel in size.

 

[nanite2000]

Cheers nanite2000, and sorry about that - seems that I missed a late setting from the release .cfg file...

Try adding this into the config file after the planet cut-off setting:

cutOffDistance_SmallPlanet=28

Yep - that fixed it! Thanks!

Over the course of playing the game I've noticed a few minor niggling issues that aren't related to your specific mod (i.e. have been there forever).

Would you be OK for me to raise them in this thread? They're minor, and may not be fixable, but I bet if anyone can fix them, you can!

 

[AndyJ]

Sure nanite2000, by all means highlight them in this thread because if nothing else, they can then be added to the 'known issues' list for FFE and it'll save someone else reporting them. No promises that I'll fix anything else historical though, it's generally very time consuming to debug/decipher the .asm code.

One thing that I noticed last night when testing the videos is that it always seems to be a bloke in the BB video for hiring crew, but the name might be for a woman.
In the original FFE there was a bug where crew members were always female, JJFFE fixed this to generate male names too. Unfortunately though, all of the crew videos are of the same chap (bb22-32). I must admit to being slightly curious and have dug in a little to see if I can ultimately identify where the first name index is being held in the Bulletin Board item data at display time - and then perhaps to alter the call to display an alternative video names - so either not showing anything with the standard set or a female face with the replacement videos. (also thinking to load an image where the avi file is missing, and which could be greater than 120x120. not at all influenced by recent Pioneer screenshots, no - not at all, lol)

@Steve: As far as I can tell, and there were only so many that I could endure watching before wanting to scour my eyeballs and stab my eardrums, well the videos do still seem to be in sync for me.

 

[Steve]

Ha ha, I know what you mean about the cheesy videos. They get more out of sync the longer my ffe session goes on, but given my disappearing buttons issue I've come to the conclusion my d3d install is a little... different

Staying on the subject of the videos, it seems there are a lot of files in the DATA directory which the game never uses. It might be interesting to adjust that and get some more variety during the game.

 

[AndyJ]

Yeah there do seem to be errors in the original FFE tables that define which videos to choose from.

From just a look at the code in FUNC_000333, which gets called for the initial comms screen, I'm thinking that these videos probably never get played:
i19 to i34 - imperial mission completion messages
c9 to c13 - alliance greetings?
c33 to c47 - more alliance messages (41 & 42 aren't even in the tables)
f1 isn't in the correct table
f8-f23 are in an unreferenced table.
m1-m4 - marshal law station welcome messages
r1-r4 - religious commune welcome messages
f29 & f30 - federal cargo check messages
f37-f51 - federal mission completion messages
g9 & g10 - alliance system, should be for damaged ship

I've also found the flag there that stops the 'welcome' message from repeating when you open the comms screen after the first time. I'll wrap that so it doesn't take effect next build for the alternate video faces, but maybe it should just repeat anyway as all the others do?

btw Steve, in what way do your videos get worse? I'm surprised they'd increasingly get out of sync?

 

[Steve]

The sound gets out of sync with the movements of their mouths, like you occasionally get on tv. Once you've noticed it, you can't ignore it!

But as I say, like my disappearing buttons, the issue isn't there to begin with. It just creeps in after around 15-20 minutes real time :S

Personally, I think the welcome video should only play once per docking, especially that dozy Federation bloke! It'd be great if you could get the appropriate video(s) to play when you arrive at a martial law system, Alliance system, or religious commune

 

[Zak Gordon]

I must admit i have not yet tried the latest build, i was a bit 'scared' by Steve's image of the navigation screen (xmas-themed look thing!). Has that been resolved yet? What was it that caused the issue in the first place?

I have some spare FFED3DAJ time coming up soon and will dive in, try the fix for the distant planet pop etc and give impressions.

On the original video clips for the BB, yeah well i originally never had them, having come late to the game (as in my linked thread) and that version (free to download then send in £5 to 'Saxon Farm' (iirc)) was sort of share-ware like, and didn't include those on-the-CD video clips. Having tried them over recent months i think i prefer not having them, good for a laugh/curiosity, but i much prefer the mod that put the computer faces from 'Frontier' in or just having it blank.

IF they had been more like the ships computer from Red Dwarf (overall), i could see them working really well.

Has anybody ever tried to re-create the video's perhaps? I can't see a fan made effort being that much worse than the originals and maybe we have people here that would know what it takes to do that?

And just a final thanks to AndyJ and his dedication. Without you we'd be sunk, so thanks for putting up with all the questions and requests from the rest of us, and being able to make the fixes you have been. Please don't stop

 

[AndyJ]

I must admit i have not yet tried the latest build, i was a bit 'scared' by Steve's image of the navigation screen (xmas-themed look thing!). Has that been resolved yet? What was it that caused the issue in the first place?

It was a difference in the image that I was using. I've updated the core textures zip to rectify the problem, just be sure to download that too for v1.07

Has anybody ever tried to re-create the video's perhaps? I can't see a fan made effort being that much worse than the originals and maybe we have people here that would know what it takes to do that?

The only 'remake' has been the static 'Frontier faces' alternative. v1.07 now just draws 1st frame of those and there's been some chat over at SCC since adding support. It could be that the original 'faces' author has uploaded some reference videos - they essentially just display the video filename so that it could be worked out what was being used and where.

It might be more plausible to support some higher resolution images in place of the videos, I guess if any one was interested in creating those then it'd be an easier task.

 

[Zak Gordon]

It was a difference in the image that I was using. I've updated the core textures zip to rectify the problem, just be sure to download that too for v1.07

Sorry to be a pain, but what image file is that exactly, just so i can check vs my own textures, just in case it is over-writing something i'd rather keep (smaller sized texture version) etc?

The only 'remake' has been the static 'Frontier faces' alternative. v1.07 now just draws 1st frame of those and there's been some chat over at SCC since adding support. It could be that the original 'faces' author has uploaded some reference videos - they essentially just display the video filename so that it could be worked out what was being used and where.

It might be more plausible to support some higher resolution images in place of the videos, I guess if any one was interested in creating those then it'd be an easier task.

Yeah i have a build with those 'Frontier Faces', and it might become my default choice. You are correct they could all do with some adjustments to look better in FFED3DAJ (etc). The colour tones are a bit faded and as you mention the base resolution is too small so they look a bit to enlarged. Ok well this is something i can work on (possibly).

So anyone know what program coverts these .avi files into something Photoshop can work with? Would i lose anything important from the image simply by remaining them (.png etc)? There is not much info in the readme that came with them, and i've not worked with .avi files before (but know they are 'video' format type etc). If no one knows right away, don't worry about it, i can do some research on the internet etc

 

[AndyJ]

the following extra files were added:

cabin0-5.png (not loaded unless drawCabin=2)
tex602 (centre of 2-colour lights)
tex603 (lights & sector map points)
tex701 (sun)
tex702 (this is unreferenced now and was included in error)
tex704 (space dust)
tex705 (lasers)
tex706 (flash/shield strikes)

I wouldn't downsize the sun & lights too much as these can often be drawn full-screen and larger, you'll lose the gradual shading as well as the sunspots otherwise.

Personally, I think the welcome video should only play once per docking, especially that dozy Federation bloke! It'd be great if you could get the appropriate video(s) to play when you arrive at a martial law system, Alliance system, or religious commune

I'll leave it as one-time for standard 'welcome' vids then and just repeat for the replacement vids so that there's always a face on the screen.
I've figured out how to derive the allegiance/government of the current system and now have the religious dictatorship & martial law systems playing their lost videos!
Haven't looked at the Alliance systems yet - are you thinking they should use the c33+ avi files too?

 

[Steve]

I've figured out how to derive the allegiance/government of the current system and now have the religious dictatorship & martial law systems playing their lost videos!

You are a legend! The full horror of the FFE videos is about to be unleashed!

Haven't looked at the Alliance systems yet - are you thinking they should use the c33+ avi files too?

Certainly c33 - c47 would seem to be suitable for Alliance systems, having had a quick browse through them. This however has brought something else to my attention. There appear to be no fewer than 324 separate avi videos in the DATA folder! Unless you've figured out a cunning way of grouping them according to the system you're docked in, there's going to be a lot of work involved. If you want assistance in grouping them though, I'm happy to help. Just let me know. The filenames do have some meaning, but quite a few are somewhat ambiguous in their content

 

[Zak Gordon]

hold on....just a second. Do you mean this will work with those 'Frontier Faces' avi files also????

 

[AndyJ]

@Zack: Well it's just a different set of files, so yes - if I understood the question. The religious dictatorship pictures (r1-r4) aren't very monk-like in that set though. There also seems to be about 30 fewer files in total but I've not checked what's missing.

@Steve:
The filenames are all grouped already in FFE's data as tables. The video playback function is given a pointer to the top of a table and a count of how many videos there are in it, then it picks one at random from the set. This is how I know that those I listed in the previous post aren't ever going to be played. e.g. there might be 30 listed in a table but it only selects from the first 8.
It's not too difficult to create a new table and make use of it - did that for the m1-4 and r1-4 .avi files. The playback function uses two data variable that I can simply search for in the code (now I know this is what they're used for) so I can figure out from there how most are being used.

The welcome message function branches depending if you're in a Federal, Imperial, Alliance or Independent system. (Thargon systems have no videos)

The independent systems have the most variation and choose from several tables. It'll check if you have an outstanding fine above a certain value (50cr?) and play from a group that comment on this, or if your hull condition is <75% will comment on the fight you had etc. And I think the lower tech systems can also play another subset of welcome messages from some generally soap-shy individuals! I think there's a 66% chance of these alternatives playing rather than the usual welcome.

Imperial and Federation systems each have a standard group of welcomes, and will play from an alternative 'unwelcome' group if you're too highly decorated with the other side (call you a spy etc).
For Federation systems there's a chance of comment when your ship is damaged but not for Imperial systems. There's also no test of outstanding fines or comments on that at either Imperial or Federation, and Alliance systems simply play the group g1->g8 & g11.
What's really odd is that all of the non-alliance systems also have a final 20% chance of overriding the initial choice and playing from this group, which seems like a bug to me...

When I get more time, I'll document which videos are grouped together and what uses them.
I'm sure that once, many years ago, I found a webpage that listed all of the videos with a description of what each one said including the goofs. Shame I can't find it now as it'd certainly save a lot of time!