The Mining nerf was likely the worst implementation of a Balancing in Years...
- Thread starter Sunleader
- Start date
And aside from alot of Whining from the Miners and Trolling of the People that didnt care for Money either way.
What kind of Feedback do you think they can get now ?
In terms of Balancing nothing has Changed. So no Feedback we dont already know can come up.
We already know that Bounty Hunting doesnt Pay and that Exploration only pays if you already got a Fleet Carrier.
We already know you can Stack Passenger Missions in Colonia etc etc etc.
So what new Feedback do you think they could get from this aside from the Community saying.
Yeah. Its a Flat out Nerf of Player Income pls go peeeeep yourself. ?
Its a pretty broad line. Cause if you did this kind of thing in reality you would now be Bankrupt or Face massive Layoffs....
Thing is. In terms of Balancing nothing has Changed really.
No Balancing was done here.
None of the other Methods has even been looked at.
They did nothing different compared to the last few Years.
They just Ended a Gold Rush and now everyone is waiting for the next one.
So why do you think they would do something different this time ?
Well. Maybe actually do something to Improve Balancing between Money Earning Methods ?
It doesnt matter if Mining is 5-20-40-1500000 Million per Hour.
What matters is how close each Activity is to each other.
Back there we got.
Activities
A=1
B=9
C=3
D=10
E=65
F=18
G=150
Million per Hour
Now we went to
A=1
B=9
C=3
D=10
E=65
F=18
G=80
Million per Hour.
Notice something ?
Sure. We lost the 150 guy.
But the Balance between everything is still Horrible and in the Ranking nothing really Changed either....
We made 0 Progress.
The Target has to be to bring things closer to together.
to that end we need something more like
A= 40
B= 45
C= 42
D= 48
E= 51
F= 50
G= 52
Where we have an Balance between different Activites which therefore means that Players can actually do different things to earn Money.
Maybe with some relations to Economy and BGS so that these Values Fluctuate by 10-20% thus resuting in the Ranking Changing slightly in the Background.
So what would I have wanted them to do ?
Well maybe. Instead of just doing the Same they did the last few Years. Of just Nerfing the one Gold Rush we got and thus having the Community wait for the next one.
How about they had for the first freaking time done a Proper comprehensive Update ?
Increase Bounties a bit. And maybe add a Mechanic that High Traffic or certain BGS States can cause Bounties to be Inflated.
Thus making Bounty Hunting more Competetive.
Increase Mission Rewards especially for Missions which deal with Topics currently not very Active in the Community. Thus shifting Activity to that part of the Game.
Maybe throw in some Addition towards providing better Rewards for Exploration.
And since we are on it. How about Buffing the Powerplay Options by Increasing the Weekly Payouts there.
Even if you wanted to have made a First Step thing. One Grand Step would have been to add Painite etc to the Sell List of Stations.
So that we got Mining Stations that actually SELL stuff like Painite too.
Thus Indirectly Nerfing Mining Heavily due to Traders now Filling that Demand.
And at the same Time likely Creating some High Profit but also Highly Competed for Trade Routes as Traders now Compete with Miners and with Supply and Demand possibly Shifting Heavily between different Mining Produce as we dont just have Demand filled but also have Supply Filling up while stuff that isnt Mined alot currently has ever lower running Supplies but ever higher rising Demand etc.
You know.
Long Story Short.
Why did we do another "Nerf the Gold Rush" Update instead of Finally after so many Years going to work on actually Changing the System to have more Balanced Activities in the First Place ???
Let me explain again.
Balancing of mining/trading is not finished yet.
They said it's going to be a process, not one time changing of numbers, so you should post feedback, but wait.
When they will think that trading commodities and mining is in the right place, they will turn to other parts of the game.
Maybe just watch this:
Can all flamethrowers please print this
and keep above screen for some time?If it could all be implemented at once, it would. It couldn't, so it isn't.
Thanks.
Can all flamethrowers please print this
If it could all be implemented at once, it would. It couldn't, so it isn't.
Thanks.
Thing is Mate.
Its a Process for the last 5 Years.
And every time. Its basicly just ONE SINGLE CHANGE.
Which means we never get any actual Balancing.
We only get either a Gold Rush Removed or Added to the Game.
What Sense does it make to just do a Single Horrible Change which Improves absolutely Nothing ?
You Say its a Process.
Its not Finished etc.
But why Wait with any actual Improvement for later ?
What Reason could there possibly be to start a process by doing something that Improves absolutely nothing and then wait with actual Improvements till later ?
We have Years of Feedback for the current Situation and Tons of Options how to Improve it.
So why do you Implement a Change which Ignores all of that Feedback and doesnt Improve anything.
Just to then wait for new Feedback ????
This isnt a Process Mate.
They said its a Process to Placata the Gullible Masses.
As always they did something they didnt think through properly and created a Gold Rush.
And as always once that Gold Rush went out of Control they then removed that Gold Rush by Nerfing the Gold Rush method into Oblivion.
The only bad thing I'll say about the rebalance, is that it's not going far enough, and that with mining being at the bottom of the skill ladder, other more involved activities will have to be brought up to unreasonable levels of income if they keep up with the (perfectly reasonable) idea that they are deserving of better pay.
There is a lot you could do to improve things. My personal 'wish' would be this:
Winds up in the 30 range. But-
This means that Powerplay bonuses actually mean something. A double bounty return would bump 30 into 60, if you went back to the old PP bounty bug that would jump to 120 and be meaningful in a way that fits the game. Zemina Torval should get a mining bonus and trading powers get adjusted (along with LYRs exploration bonus being on a lower tier).
Mining- I'd like to see proper automated gold rushes- imagine a mining megaship that acts as a multiplier for mining profit in that system. Profits handed in at that ship could be 150 (i.e. pre nerf) but its more dangerous because its focussed in one place).
The only exception would be AX which should pay really well escalating to high returns with the harder Thargoids.
In short make 'vanilla' gaming less profitable but use the features in the game as multipliers (with the BGS acting as a secondary temporal modifier).
Deleted member 182079
D
I wouldn't put mining at the bottom of it (laser mining, maybe) - you still need to locate suitable mining locations, and core mining does require some flying and targetting ability. I would say that hauling (as in missions) is probably the easiest of all the professions, and that pays rather well for what you're actually doing. I do agree though that mining is still very (too?) high in terms of earnings.
Piracy and combat (to some extent, most certainly AX though) I'd consider the most skillful activities that need (and will hopefully get) a bump in earnings.
The mining nerf is a good first step for me. I'd go further and make the most expensive commodities much rarer. I mean, why is it so valuable if it's so abundant and therefore mined by absolutely everyone? Finding LTDs should be like hitting the lottery jackpot.
Anyway, who cares what we think? Let them finish the balance pass and then judge. If it's all too much to handle, then go play something else.
Anyway, who cares what we think? Let them finish the balance pass and then judge. If it's all too much to handle, then go play something else.
The mining systems seem just as busy as ever. Sure, as a percentage of total traffic my usual haunt has dropped a bit on the inara table, but traffic is up across the board which is diluting things a bit.
It's not as lucrative as it once was but it's still a pretty good way for a new player to make bank. Seriously the wailing and teethgnashing from people mad that their crazy outlier activity is now only slightly better for making stress-free credits instead of vastly better.
It's not as lucrative as it once was but it's still a pretty good way for a new player to make bank. Seriously the wailing and teethgnashing from people mad that their crazy outlier activity is now only slightly better for making stress-free credits instead of vastly better.
I'd still put mining below hauling missions in terms of risk presented by the game. Unless you're doing it in the open in a popular system (where a new miner arriving in the hotspot can trigger a new NPC spawn, to say nothing of players with less friendly intentions) you don't get threatened by NPCs anywhere near as often. At most you've got to run the gauntlet once on the way from the rings to the sell station.
There is a good argument for them doing the buffs before the nerfs, but if we are to understand correctly, its all coming within the next few weeks, so its hardly onerous. Plus mining still pays way more than most other activities, so its not exactly a big issue if people still want to mine for the big bucks. I'm guessing that Robigo is perhaps more profitable now though.
Deleted member 182079
D
I presume the game will apply the same logic when spawning NPC pirates? That's why I ranked hauling lower as you have the same for mining, but with mining you expose yourself (hur) towards attacks in normal space, often without system security being around; if you're not geared up to defend yourself (my mining vessels are shielded/armoured but don't carry weapons) you will have to run. For hauling this only happens as you say when going towards the destination station in SC, and you can easily win the interdictions (against NPCs at least), even in a T9. Though admittedly if you stack delivery missions the number of NPCs spawning will be potentially higher so from that angle, yeah, there's more risk involved.
I think the fundamental problem is the risk itself. Currently NPCs are weak, and its far too easy to take off in total safety, have only one NPC interdiction and drop down into total safety.
I would dearly love drop zones of stations to be much bigger, so that traders (like in 84 Elite) have to scramble to safety. It would also magnify the security aspect with anarchy being tricky / high sec more secure.
To me ED has the triple problem of a disconnected BGS, ineffectual NPCs and copious money. Bolt these together and you can keep high earnings but you have to risk something to get there.
Why are you constantly ignoring the fact that FDEV said they want to look at the other professions next?
Deleted member 182079
D
Agreed. I would also add the fact that you can escape an NPC merely flying above 300 odd m/s in any ship, despite the NPC flying something much faster.
Release those handbreaks and make Elite Dangerous Again!