Wings is not a Wings-only game mode. It's just a set of features that will allow players in All Online or Private Groups to coordinate in small groups, tracking each other more easily as they fly (manually) in and out of SC and Hyperdrive.
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Wings is not a Wings-only game mode. It's just a set of features that will allow players in All Online or Private Groups to coordinate in small groups, tracking each other more easily as they fly (manually) in and out of SC and Hyperdrive.
So lone Wolves will be subject to Wolf Packs?
EDIT: query only, no implication, sorry. meh, its an Open/Group feature.
EDIT: query only, no implication, sorry. meh, its an Open/Group feature.
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As far as your bullets above the conclusion go, I respectfully ask why you are playing in open then, if there are no benefits to it?
And what exactly is the unfair advantage that you believe people switching between modes is? While the argument that solo players progress in the game faster keeps being given, where exactly is the proof? Yes, they have no risk of interdiction by CMDRs, but can certainly get interdicted by NPCs, and in any case, surely a persons progression in trading is going to depend on all sorts of variables, such as the size of their ship, the lucrativeness (if that's a word) of their trade runs, not just whether they get interdicted by a human CMDR who takes 5 tonnes of cargo every couple of runs. And don't forget, players trading in open and NPC's also affect the market. I really think this argument is just poor cover for PvP pirates wanting more prey. And what progression are you referring to? Accumulation of wealth / ships? Plenty of people who trade in open say they do just fine, so presumably you are not at a disadvantage there. Progression in combat skills? Plenty of people think that NPC's aren't great fighters, so their combat skills aren't going to improve faster than yours in open fighting real CMDRs. Reaching Elite status? So what? My understanding of ranking progressions is that only progressions made in open play get counted, at least towards the 'Race to Elite' so that shouldn't be a worry. Just because a CMDR has a higher combat ranking than you doesn't mean that you will lose to him in a dogfight.
Everyone has the choice to play open, solo or group, including the people who are complaining. I believe the general consensus on the forum is that most of the vocal pro-PvP lobby are players who wish to play as pirates and want more prey. I could be wrong, so I'm not stating it as a fact. The other complaint that get's thrown in and equated with cheating is that pilots in solo will acquire huge wealth, a lovely Anaconda armed to the teeth and then come into open play just to mess with the PvPers, which is so, so unfair.
Especially as some of those PvPers will have spent the time messing with less experienced and lightly armed traders, but I guess that's Ok. You obviously feel strongly that you are being disadvantaged by choosing to play in open, and that's a shame. I really don't think you are, as this game isn't a race to get somewhere first, certainly not a competition, and I imagine that the little competition that Frontier set up as the race to Elite is not the focus of that many people playing the game.
Edit: I just read your rare goods scenario too. I trade in rares in Lave and Leesti, and I will often do it in open. I see plenty of CMDRs, none has interdicted me yet. I stay in open mode if that is how I have chosen to play. It's not a hard and fast fact that every person trading in rare goods in Leesti is going to be interdicted by a human CMDR, sorry.
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With all respect - if you are going to state such as fact, you had better have some hard data to back it up.
What is the control between your two scenarios? What evidence of test can you provide? What is the credit gain difference? What is the death count difference? What is the fuel/repair cost difference?
You obviously haven't attempted any such test yourself yet, so it would be interesting to see how you come up with data to back up your claims. Good luck with it!
AJ79
Banned
From the Kickstarter;
*And the best part - you can do all this online with your friends, or other "Elite" pilots like yourself, or even alone. The choice is yours...*
*you will be able to control who else you might encounter in your game – perhaps limit it to just your friends? Cooperate on adventures or chase your friends down to get that booty. The game will work in a seamless, lobby-less way, with the ability to rendezvous with friends
*Play it your way*
Your reputation is affected by your personal choices. Play the game your way: dangerous pirate, famous explorer or notorious assassin - the choice is yours to make. Take on missions and affect the world around you, alone or with your friends.*
*You simply play the game, and depending on your configuration (your choice) *
*We have the concept of “groups”. They can be private groups just of your friends or open groups (that form part of the game) based on the play styles people prefer, and the rules in each can be different. Players will begin in the group “All” but can change groups at will,*
From the forum archives;
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=6300
All Players Group– Players in this group will be matched with each other as much as possible to ensure as many human players can meet and play together
Private Group – Players in this group will only be matched with other players in the same private group
Solo Group – Players in this group won’t be matched with anyone else ever (effectively a private group with no one else invited)
(All by a Lead Designer)
Also DB on Multiplayer and Grouping and Single (01:00 - 02:01)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5JYRyhxYhI&list=PL7glm5rbPHKyBblUEjmm2PFkwJ4ykuz6s&index=18
DB on "Griefing" and "Griefers"
(Listen out for the part where FD can move them in to a private group of just each other)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kb5hqjxmf4M
Rededit Topic on "unusual event for players to come against players" (With Twitch Video)
http://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDanger...will_be_an_unusual_event_for_players_to_come/
Direct Twitch Link; (Note DB use "Occasonial" and "unusual" regarding players interacting)
http://www.twitch.tv/egx/b/571962295?t=69m00s
Also, MMO does not mean "social" (It means lots of people connected)
A massively multiplayer online game (also called MMO and MMOG) is a multiplayer video game which is capable of supporting large numbers of players simultaneously. By necessity, they are played on the Internet. MMOs usually have at least one persistent world, however some games differ.
If I missed anything, let me know.
Here you go, the "core" game, as designed.
PvP has always been optional and not the focus. Sure it could do with some love, but it is not the point of the game.
As far as your bullets above the conclusion go, I respectfully ask why you are playing in open then, if there are no benefits to it?
And what exactly is the unfair advantage that you believe people switching between modes is? While the argument that solo players progress in the game faster keeps being given, where exactly is the proof? Yes, they have no risk of interdiction by CMDRs, but can certainly get interdicted by NPCs, and in any case, surely a persons progression in trading is going to depend on all sorts of variables, such as the size of their ship, the lucrativeness (if that's a word) of their trade runs, not just whether they get interdicted by a human CMDR who takes 5 tonnes of cargo every couple of runs. And don't forget, players trading in open and NPC's also affect the market. I really think this argument is just poor cover for PvP pirates wanting more prey. And what progression are you referring to? Accumulation of wealth / ships? Plenty of people who trade in open say they do just fine, so presumably you are not at a disadvantage there. Progression in combat skills? Plenty of people think that NPC's aren't great fighters, so their combat skills aren't going to improve faster than yours in open fighting real CMDRs. Reaching Elite status? So what? My understanding of ranking progressions is that only progressions made in open play get counted, at least towards the 'Race to Elite' so that shouldn't be a worry. Just because a CMDR has a higher combat ranking than you doesn't mean that you will lose to him in a dogfight.
Everyone has the choice to play open, solo or group, including the people who are complaining. I believe the general consensus on the forum is that most of the vocal pro-PvP lobby are players who wish to play as pirates and want more prey. I could be wrong, so I'm not stating it as a fact. The other complaint that get's thrown in and equated with cheating is that pilots in solo will acquire huge wealth, a lovely Anaconda armed to the teeth and then come into open play just to mess with the PvPers, which is so, so unfair.
You obviously feel strongly that you are being disadvantaged by choosing to play in open, and that's a shame. I really don't think you are, as this game isn't a race to get somewhere first, certainly not a competition, and I imagine that the little competition that Frontier set up as the race to Elite is not the focus of that many people playing the game.
Read what I wrote above and it will answer your questions
Yes, Lone Wolves will be subject to Wolf Packs in All Online and Private Groups where PvP is encouraged.
It will be interesting to see to what extent that changes the dynamic in All Online. Encountering Wings may still be rare just because it's rare to encounter other players at all, outside the core systems. Also, it looks like the interdiction mechanic will still be 1v1 even when you're flying in a Wing, with your other wingmen (and any escorts for the interdicted target) having to follow the interdiction wake manually. There will still be strength in numbers though, as long as everyone can manage to fly into the same instance quickly enough to help out.
The FSD wakes also could use some fleshing out, cant wait for this to happen.
Sorry. The reason I wrote my post is that it doesn't answer my questions, and I don't think you are doing your argument much good by dismissing my questions in that manner.
Edit: Oh, other than the fact that you don't do PvP and hate it. Lol. What on earth is your problem then?
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Sorry. The reason I wrote my post is that it doesn't answer my questions, and I don't think you are doing your argument much good by dismissing my questions in that manner.
Edit: Oh, other than the fact that you don't do PvP and hate it. Lol. What on earth is your problem then?
Read between the lines on what I wrote and get your answers there. If you can't find it then its not my problem. Sorry but I don't answer questions just for anyones convenience or just to appease anyone.
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AJ79
Banned
Seems to be a common theme in the thread for those complaining about mode switching.
They all say they are PvE traders in open and solo is unfair to them.
Although I don't do PVP, Even Human Pirates who only plays in Open Play are GREATLY disadvantaged " to those who trade now and switch modes then buy anaconda later on" type of player.
Why / How?
How can Human Pirates who only play in Open Play mode compete with players " who gets Anaconda QUICKLY by negating all risks posed by human pirates by switching modes when trading" ?
Since I don't PVP, Can anyone tell us how much a Human Pirate earns on an average when pirating on Open Play?
and you call this game balanced?
The Devs should rethink this as it greatly impacts the game balance tilting heavily to those who prefer to swtich between Single Player mode and Open Play mode in order to gain unfair advantage over those who only play in Open Play mode.
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There's nothing between the lines, and throwing junk like that at people trying to debate your issues is pathetic. I'm not asking to be appeased, and after your responses to me I could care less about your views.
(Sorry mods, but I really don't think this person is contributing constructively to this thread. I hope I haven't broken any rules with this final reply)
There's nothing between the lines, and throwing junk like that at people trying to debate your issues is pathetic. I'm not asking to be appeased, and after your responses to me I could care less about your views.
(Sorry mods, but I really don't think this person is contributing constructively to this thread. I hope I haven't broken any rules with this final reply)
Sorry but I believe I've answered most of your questions even before you asked them. You just didnt read my other posts and I don't think I have to repeat them all over again just because you didnt read them.
Stick to the topic and let's not start with any personal attacks shall we?
You could argue that the balance between the two mode is not equal but there is not an unfair advantage in anyway because everyone gets the same choices.
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Hi Amze, actually I agree to your statement to a certain extent. But remember that imbalances are tend to be exploited if left un-fixed.
I could actually care less and just grind fast credit by switching modes as I know thats the fastest way to get ahead in CR and buying the best ships in game, rendering all human risks out in the galaxy.
I could just trade confortablly switching mode when danger arises, sooner or later I can buy an Anaconda and just go back to Open Play and show everyone how great my ship is....
I could choose that path but no, because I love the game and knowing that there's any imbalance like this in the long run will eventually creep up to the player base and destroy the potential of the game to be great..
The problem here is not about my convenience in playing, its about game design and I'm just giving my opinion, not based on my own preference, my own convenience nor my liking but looking at the mechanics as a game designer perspective.
I don't want to tell you my background in the gaming industry for the past 20 odd years as other may say that I'm speaking in authority, but these are just unbiased thoughts in benefit the whole community, not sa single group who only prefers this and that, but in general for the benefit of the game.
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Come and destroy? What? lol.
Frontier have people with more experience, oh yes including whose baby this really is David Braben. Trust me, this whole mode thing was in at the beginning and not something they made up on the spot, let see how it goes over time and if its truly damaging and Frontier decide they have to make changes (based on what they determine, not a player, you're still on the outside) then they will at least get a lot of support.
Then those same human players need to start a solo/group save and get the same (alleged) advantage that they have identified. Then there would be no (preceived) advantage.. Problem Solved.
Surely it cant be that simple, because it isnt. The people complaining the loudest about solo/group players need to get the same advantage and create an even playing field. No one is stopping them.
This wont solve the problem though. They want to PUNISH solo/group players, make it WORSE for them and BETTER to be in open play.
And that is precisely why they are getting no traction, no sympathy, and .. nowhere. This thread is a whole lot of nowhere. Its good reading, popcorn in hand, but is an exercise in futility. The dishes are done with this issue, the damage is done too. Too many people have been griefed, abused, insulted and flamed ... and they aint coming back. The only hope pro-open-pvp people have is to influence new players coming into the game to join open play, and so far they have made no progress in that area because they are still too busy making trouble for solo/group players.
And just lastly .. if the pro-pvp lobby and all its participants are so important, and such a large part of the playerbase, then the group lists should be swollen with pvp groups. It should be wall to wall pvp groups, and the word should have spread far and wide how big and central pvp is to the whole game. But..., it isnt .. there isnt tonnes of groups (yes a few), there isnt tonnes of threads with players talking about their pvp experiences, and there isnt the MASSIVE disadvantage that is being alluded to.
WHATEVER advantage is on one side, is available to the other side, they just dont want to take the advantage, they would prefer to act like pariahs.
Of course, no one is saying that a design will be changed because of a single player is airing a concern.
This mode has been here since the beginning, but it doesn't mean that all decisions made were correct.
Even world renowned gaming companies do make bad decision once in a while and a good company should act and realise on those bad decisions sooner than later.
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Its what you call a "which one came first, chicken or egg" scenario.
If you recommend those players who only choose to play Open Play to go switch to Single Player mode to negate all human pirate risks, then Ill throw back the "most used rebuttal" from most of those who prefers to switch modes: We are given a choice and no body can force anyone to choose what type of playstyle I will do.
This is a never ending cycle, which is a clear indication that the mechanic is FLAWED.
As mentioned, Im not saying to remove single player totally. What i'm proposing to to keep Single Player Mode and Open Play Mode as seperate. All progression made in Single Player Mode stays in Single Player and have a totally unique CMDR on Open Play.
and as I mentioned, this thread is not about convenience nor personal preference. I prefer to look at it as discussing game design.
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