Modes The Solo vs Open vs Groups Thread [See new thread]

[Robert Maynard]

I refer back to my previous comment :

Hopefully, NPC ship types and difficulty in a particular area in solo / private group will in some way be made to resemble that of the average Open instance in the same area.

 

[SteveLaw]

lol it doesn't work like that, there's no diplomatic solution because diplomacy doesn't have a game mechanic in ED

Yes it does; multiplayer interaction.

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Hopefully, NPC ship types and difficulty in a particular area in solo / private group will in some way be made to resemble that of the average Open instance in the same area.

I definitely read something about there was going to be far fewer shieldless NPCs planned in the future. I was going to go and try and find it. We know AI improvement are being made all the time.

 

[EdzUp]

I think what he meant was hundreds of solo players can do more for one of the factions in power play than open players fighting it out, quite simply as there is no players tl shoot em down. Everyone here will agree that npcs aren't as dangerous as human pilots shooting ya down.

 

[Distance]

Yes it does; multiplayer interaction.

The only multiplayer interaction in ED is via shooting unless I've missed something since beta.

 

[SteveLaw]

I think what he meant was hundreds of solo players can do more for one of the factions in power play than open players fighting it out, quite simply as there is no players tl shoot em down. Everyone here will agree that npcs aren't as dangerous as human pilots shooting ya down.

Who is to say that an NPC isn't as dangerous to me as a human is to you? It's not a competition.

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The only multiplayer interaction in ED is via shooting unless I've missed something since beta.

I don't know, did they have chat channels in Beta?

 

[Distance]

Who is to say that an NPC isn't as dangerous to me as a human is to you? It's not a competition.

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I don't know, did they have chat channels in Beta?

That's the thing with the one size fits all category as described above. NPCs might be hard for you in solo but for me in open I swat them like flies that's the main argument against people switching to solo and group to do community goals.

Yes there was chat in beta and we still use it for piracy today. The diplomacy boils down to "stop and drop me cargo or I'll kill you".

 

[SteveLaw]

The diplomacy boils down to "stop and drop me cargo or I'll kill you".

I know, its a real shame. If that improves a lot I might venture in Open a bit more.

 

[Bomba Luigi]

I think what he meant was hundreds of solo players can do more for one of the factions in power play than open players fighting it out, quite simply as there is no players tl shoot em down. Everyone here will agree that npcs aren't as dangerous as human pilots shooting ya down.

you assume that all open players work toward one goal all solo players towards the other. Chances are you have people in open and Solo for both sides. Community goals are not Open vs Solo with a guest appearance of Groups to slam a Chair at the back of Open. Chances are there are many Solo players supporting the same goal as you.

 

[atak2]

I think with players and groups now in greater direct and indirect competition over territory - the modes should have separate save files and background simulations.

Just for the sake of clarity over whats happening in a particular power if anything. I could potentially see players confused over why their contributions to a power are not making a difference and trying to figure out if a group in another instance is influencing combat/trade goals and wondering how they can counter it. It would be frustrating to encounter an invisible force from another instance ruining your efforts.

 

[Distance]

you assume that all open players work toward one goal all solo players towards the other. Chances are you have people in open and Solo for both sides. Community goals are not Open vs Solo with a guest appearance of Groups to slam a Chair at the back of Open. Chances are there are many Solo players supporting the same goal as you.

It isn't that simple, it does all boil down to the rewards players get. I was number 1 in one of the trade community goals and 3 of the other top 5 players were all in open with me. The only reason why we managed to hit the top 5 was because the rewards at the other trading goal were more lucrative so there were more players doing that in solo for the money.

We also failed the community goal due to more players going where the money was.

 

[SteveLaw]

It isn't that simple, it does all boil down to the rewards players get. I was number 1 in one of the trade community goals and 3 of the other top 5 players were all in open with me. The only reason why we managed to hit the top 5 was because the rewards at the other trading goal were more lucrative so there were more players doing that in solo for the money.

We also failed the community goal due to more players going where the money was.

If winning is so important then why don't you follow them? Seriously, the modes are open to all to use as they choose.

 

[Distance]

If winning is so important then why don't you follow them? Seriously, the modes are open to all to use as they choose.

We supported the faction through personal choice as we were attempting to influence the background sim before the community goal. It was the same in Lugh, the Lugh guys worked their asses off then there was a community goal slapped down in it and everyone went fed as that's where the money was, most of them grinding it in solo or group.

People don't think it's a big deal with the mode switching but to open it's the equivalent of you playing in solo on your own and then suddenly you're interdicted by a wing of real players. 4 vs 1 and you have no chance against them. Whilst it's not the best analogy, that's how it feels when you're attempting to do something in the game and players switch to solo to work against you.

 

[Bomba Luigi]

It isn't that simple, it does all boil down to the rewards players get. I was number 1 in one of the trade community goals and 3 of the other top 5 players were all in open with me. The only reason why we managed to hit the top 5 was because the rewards at the other trading goal were more lucrative so there were more players doing that in solo for the money.

We also failed the community goal due to more players going where the money was.

Sooo... 4 of the top 5 Players where playing Open. ähm... God damn these unbeatable God-like Solo Players?! And how do you know all the players doing the other goal where all doing it in Solo? Where do you get that info? And when all these People did that other Goal because it gets them more Money (and how do you know the reasons all these People have for doing that goal?) surley then the Money is the reason they did that, what has that to do with the Modes?

I mean seriously, where do you get all that Info?

 

[SteveLaw]

We supported the faction through personal choice as we were attempting to influence the background sim before the community goal. It was the same in Lugh, the Lugh guys worked their asses off then there was a community goal slapped down in it and everyone went fed as that's where the money was, most of them grinding it in solo or group.

I'm not unsympathetic, I hope I've demonstrated that by the fact that this is one of the reasons I don't take part in CGs (the other main one being that it doesn't make any thematic sense to me - why are political situations resolved by a race to who can get the most X to Y?) but I will still defend the choice to move between modes.

And there, with another summoning of Ouroboros, I will leave it. (For today.)

 

[Kayweg]

lol it doesn't work like that, there's no diplomatic solution because diplomacy doesn't have a game mechanic in ED

Without even knowing if FD has any plans/ideas in the drawer, i'm tempted to add "yet".

I imagine that any sort of diplomacy mechanic would be a rather complex undertaking, one that possibly would require a standalone patch in itself to integrate.

100% pure speculation on my part of course, but with the 3 major and countless minor political factions present and all the new things 1.3 will add to that,

the game almost cries out for diplomacy mechanics of some sort.

And God no, don't even think about asking me how i'd think that could be done.

 

[damj256]

Lol I knew this thread would pop back up after the newsletter came out. Just going to get my popcorn, be back in mo.....

.....Right back again NOOOOOWWWW

GO!!

 

[Robert Maynard]

Presumably, Frontier will distil the essence out of the Vox Populi thread and take onboard the bits that they want to - we haven't yet had a response to it with respect to game modes and contributions to Community Goals - I would expect that any changes affecting CGs would apply to Powerplay.

 

[Distance]

Sooo... 4 of the top 5 Players where playing Open. ähm... God damn these unbeatable God-like Solo Players?! And how do you know all the players doing the other goal where all doing it in Solo? Where do you get that info? And when all these People did that other Goal because it gets them more Money (and how do you know the reasons all these People have for doing that goal?) surley then the Money is the reason they did that, what has that to do with the Modes?

I mean seriously, where do you get all that Info?

I know because I'm an active player. The profits at the other community goal were 1-2000cr/t. Our community goal we were trading at a loss. At one point I was losing 600k per run. The number of players contributing at each goal were also visible on the comunity goals themselves so easy to see how many were working for who.

I know lots of players in open who always go to group or solo when a community goal turns up. I know lots of pirates and traders in the game. When you're doing a community goal and get pirated most players who only care about the money take the easy option and go to solo or group to do it. It's not rocket science. You can call me out all you want but that's the way it is m8.

 

[Robert Maynard]

I know lots of players in open who always go to group or solo when a community goal turns up. I know lots of pirates and traders in the game. When you're doing a community goal and get pirated most players who only care about the money take the easy option and go to solo or group to do it. It's not rocket science. You can call me out all you want but that's the way it is m8.

The thing is - every player has the freedom to do exactly that - if they choose to min/max in Solo / Private Groups then that's up to them, regardless of how frustrating it is to players who refuse to leave open.

That is not to say that it makes for a fulfilling multi-player gaming experience with players avoiding each other in different modes rather than trying to avoid each other in open play, just that if Frontier want to improve the dynamic in Open then they'll have to find a palatable way to entice players into open.

 

[Bomba Luigi]

I know because I'm an active player. The profits at the other community goal were 1-2000cr/t. Our community goal we were trading at a loss. At one point I was losing 600k per run.

I know lots of players in open who always go to group or solo when a community goal turns up. I know lots of pirates and traders in the game. When you're doing a community goal and get pirated most players who only care about the money take the easy option and go to solo or group to do it. It's not rocket science. You can call me out all you want but that's the way it is m8.

Thats the way you think it is, don't confuse opinions with Facts. You could be right, but since we lack the facts you could also be wrong.

And that really is something you need to accept, the possability of being wrong. I know I can be wrong, how about you?