The Star Citizen Thread V10

When I refunded my participation in this mess way back in Summer 2016, they literally used your quoted line in an email to me along with "with full release nearly upon us" and how I'd lose all my "amazing" perks (towels etc).

Do yourself a cathartic and satisfying thing today....REFUND!. I rate the experience up there with donating a kidney.
Full release. Brings us back to the old question, did they intentionally lie or are they incompetent?
 
You make it sound alarming and awesome at the same time :)
To be honest and fair...most of these problems were introduced by the 3.5 patch. Whilst 3.4 had it's share of issues and niggles, it wasn't nearly as broken as 3.5...what's alarming is that Ci¬G released this patch after being asked by the devs, evocati and PTU testers to delay it until a date in May due to the stability issues. They ignored all that, I suspect the reasons being tied to the new investors pushing a firm patch release deadline as condition of their funding. 3.5 was promised in Q1 so out it went all broken. Not only did they release the patch to live, they also announced a week long free-fly event to try and entice new cash from 'suitably impressed' newbies.

It didn't quite work out like that of course since there were more than just a few cracks showing in the bug ridden piece of nonsense and the potential new backers just left in frustration for the most part having spent 2 days trapped at Lorville or the new showcase Area18 due to game breaking bugs.

It also doesn't bode well for future patches as I can see the content and features being dropped wholesale (with the exception of ship sales) simply in order to stick to a release schedule. Whilst Ci¬G aren't really known for their attention to anything other than nicely detailed ship models for the RSI store and pointless space filling fluff...it's going to get a whole lot worse.
 
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Without knowing Scoopa or knowing how good his english is (no source provided) here are some bulletpoints. While the questions are from a recent subscriber event done in LA the provided footage is actually from the famous "dune"-video a couple of years back (aka doesnt exist in-game) and other good-looking propaganda videos (no actual gameplay)

Q: is it possible to have separate thrust-controllers for forward thrust and strafing on ships? (also: HOTAS = Joystick)
A: we see no reason to not have this functionality in the game at some point, tho we dont have any plans for this at this time

Q: what tenhical problem is reponsible for the Caterpillars ramps to not work correctly/killing people
A: there is no technical blocker, the reason is that we currently have no developer working on this (not a very high priority)

Q: whats the status of procedural generated roads on planets including traffic events/logic?
A: there actually has been working prototypes for this in older (developer-) versions tho existing versions have been broken due to additional features so it was cut from life patches. We still like to have this feature in a future patch but it doesnt have a high priority at this time

Q: in what ways will the scanning mechanics affect or improve exploration gameplay?
A: basically we want to add all kinds of scannable things to the game making the scanning feature an intergral tool for a lot of things (number of crew on a ship, kind of cargo, how to best extract scanned minerals)

Q: will there be additional UEE (?) uniforms to allow roleplaying?
A: there currently are no plans for any new unforms tho this might be possible once SQ42 goes life.

Q: while we do have "some" persistence currently, what are the current state and next steps on the way to reach "full persistence"?
A: no direct answer provided according to scoopa the devs pointed to OCS as being interdependant for full persistence. OCS is a critical factor for Star Citizens development in general. Right now CIG is at the limit (servers? engine?) of its capacities. Until server side OCS is solved they cannt really proceed with additional stuff.

Q: when do we get our own volleyball in-game?
A: we could do this right now, our game is able to handle small personal objects.

Q: The Redeemer is currently manufactured by the Aegis corporation, what are the likely candidates for a different company taking over production? Also are there plans to give the Redeemer to a different race (Tevarin?)
A: There are currently no plans to change the responsible company for the Redeemer.

Q: are there plans to see/recognize character damage on the armor the avatar wears? (personal damage model)
A: we want to use the current ship model for personal armor as well as in ships have 2 texture layers on top of each other. At the moment armor suits dont have a second underlying texture to allow this (re-work incoming?) A possible solution could be to give armor different aspects according to their activity. For example an explorer armor suit wouldnt be as heavily armored as a trooper armor but would have additional sensors on it (I feel like somebody didnt understand the question, if thats scoopa or the developer I cant say)

Q: how exactly will the salvage mechanic (planned for 3.8 end of 2019) work in detail?
A: we cannot share any concrete info about salvaging at this point because (wait for it....) work on salvaging only starts end of 2019 (at which point CIG obviously first starts with ideas and designs as well...I m a bit speechless). The first iteration of salvaging is expected to look/work similar to mining (manipulation with an energy beam, picking up fragments). other mechanics/features that are co-dependant for salvaging: personal inventory, physical ship modules, ship wreck "behavior" (its dead Jim...)

Q: when will friendslist cap (current 250) be increased?
A: right now its an arbitrary number, there is no reason to not set it to a higher value at any time.

Q: how many ships/players will the new OCS allow in one place?
A: we want to have as many ships/players as possible in one place to create the living, breathing universe we aim for. Tho for this value to be as high as possible server meshing is more important then object container streaming.

Q: what are the plans to keep the player busy/entertained during quantum travel?
A: we have been playing around with a few ideas but are not comfortable to share these at this time to not disappoint people once they arrive.

Q: will we ever get a compass or at least directional orientation in-game?
A: planets do have a magnetic north so this functionality would be possible even now. We will look into how to best provide players with a sense of location/direction (simple compass points or coordinates)

Q: regarding character creation and DNA mapping. What additional features are planned and when can we expect them?
A: its an ongoing process tho we like scars to be aquired during gameplay rather then appointed at character creation. We also constantly improve existing features (hair-tech) to avoid those funny helmet glitches and allow visual identification.

Q: whats the status on ship-to-ship and ship-to-station functionality?
A: Chris Roberts himself is working on this feature right now and has actually managed to produce a playable version where this is easily done without any problems. Before players can experience this it still has to go through quality control and needs to be in synch with world persistence.

Q: something about the current subscriber model (scoopa never states the question but instead goes directly to the answer)
A: we are currently not too happy with the subscriber model and would like to reward our loyal subscribers with more in-game items and benefits. This wont be P2W. We actually have some advanced plans and designs already but wont share them until they are implemented.




I tried to stay as true to scoopas report as possible. Sometimes I had to use my own words because a direct translation would ve resulted in several pages of text and at other times the whole 5 minute segment was rather confusing without direct quotes to use so I had to listen to the same passage several times until I was able to formulate a Q&A

....ich habe fertig! (thats all folks) or with Asps words....."its full of lolz"


P.S. here are some random thoughts going through my head during this video
"cmon...like THATS important?"
"thanks captain obvious..."
"...uhhh, that wasnt the question?"
"are we still on the same page?"
"....what?"
"thanks for nothing again"
 
So 300i has been reworked (again?) and will hopefully be reworked again later when Chris will envision something never been done before, so all these pretty furnitures will have to be reworked too!
 
Q: whats the status on ship-to-ship and ship-to-station functionality?
A: Chris Roberts himself is working on this feature right now and has actually managed to produce a playable version where this is easily done without any problems. Before players can experience this it still has to go through quality control and needs to be in synch with world persistence.
I just broke 4 ribs reading this. Thank you.
 
We've got ship interiors people!
Now you could earn them in game....or for a low,low price you can make your favourite ship look different!
Large plants,that will probably help things along at some point....
Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6PxQqD2ratU
I'm watching that video, and then at 0:45, I start thinking, "Wait... I recognize that chair he's sitting in."



The DXRacer Formula series gaming chair.

Cost? Nearly $300.

I'm so glad I got my money out of this project when I had the chance...
 
So 300i has been reworked (again?) and will hopefully be reworked again later when Chris will envision something never been done before, so all these pretty furnitures will have to be reworked too!
It seems they’ve hit a road block,they’re unable to add anymore assets to “the verse”. A glaring over site and a fundamental element that should have been worked out at the beginning of development.
But that sort of roadmap doesn’t furnish your mansion.
So they’re currently in a look busy mode.
 
You know the funny part is that 6 years or longer is indeed not that uncommon especially for small companies to push a product out the doors. I ve been following various small projects for years already and even tho I m really frustrated about the never-ending-early-access or alpha-status there are other factors at work that make it bearable compared to SC.

  • I m just waiting. I am not invested with money, the concept sounds cool and I want that but I dont participate in active development nor feedback but simply wait for the game to finally come out of EA so I can make a valid decision to buy it or not
  • progression is slow but its just a handful of devs working on this in their freetime
  • community interaction and development direction are directly linked and can be recognized within manageable timeframes
  • had a couple projects so far that either terminated before completion or developed into a completely different game then advertised. Devs have always been very clear and open about these things tho
Now for SC fanatics and fanboys to come out and universally applying the "7 years aint that long....." argument is very disingenuous because its used in such a vague context without similar conditions trying to gloss over how drastically different this project is.

Current Status of Star Citizen: some argue "alpha" but honestly...I only call it that to save time because for all its worth...its simply a tech demo allowing you limited interaction to "whoosh" you. The PU basically is just another "mode" like Arena Commander, Star Marine or the race module.
Completion towards a finished product. On a timeline SC currently is sitting firmly in the first half of its development cycle without having finalized an actual alpha yet. The following steps require more effort, attention and resources and become increasingly more complex the further the project advances. This doesnt include the usual delays happening into late-stage projects...something SC is very very far away from. Alpha is for all its worth a prototype or basic construct. Usually an alpha is created very quickly then tested extensively in order to advance to the other stages. Star Citizen tho is firmly locked in pre-alpha status after going through these years and (if we can believe the various rumors) and all its money. How this is not a cause for concern or even being accepted by so many is beyond me really. If you really WANT a game like Star Citizen to actually happen....you absolutely SHOULD be worried at this point.
Or maybe get into other alphas to get a real comparison to how "well" SC is doing. I m talking gameloops, stability or feature-list. You will always encounter bugs and glitches in alpha...thats why its an alpha but usually from what I ve seen.....other alphas run rock-solid compared to SC, maybe not at the visual beauty but we love games for the gameplay they offer, visuals are just secondary. In this regard the "its an alpha" argument is on the same level as "7 years aint that long". It tries to lift Star Citizen to the same level as other games even tho its worlds apart at this point.

For all its worth....CIG is running the same project-manual that all the other companies run as well. They simply "cook with water". Nothing really special about what they have to do in order to get a game out the door. That they dont understand the manual is quite appareant by now and reflects in all the confusing decisions made over the years. At first SCs stunning visuals were perceived (and advertised) as a side-effect that didnt take a lot of effort. By now we all know that creating all the vids we loved in the past and also to maintain the visual quality of the PU is absolutely time-consuimg and costs a LOT of resources while simulatously blocking an effective progression in development. It looks like 90% of CIGs effort goes into flash and shine with only a meaasly 10% going into actual development. The progress rate certainly indicates this.

At first CIG was given a lot of patience and leeway to come true on their own words. By now its clear that they are doing the same things that other companies did in their development. CIG just uses different terms or mispresents its own state or applied techniques to create a positive image (procgen anybody?). Blatant copying of other games features aside CIG is also coming to the same solutions to problems that anybody who is experienced in these kind of things knew for some time now.

Well then...it should be easy right? Just do what all the other companies did and get the game out then. We still love you chris.

Not so easy.....by the completely messed up beginning of the project Star Citizen is now in various corners that make "normal" game development almost impossible. And for what its worth....I cant see them making the switch to "regular mode" at all. Everything is so final stage by now that it looks like CIG can only hope to maintain the current cycle in order to survive...change or improvement literally equal a mystery by now.

Cannot change the graphics because they are the main selling point. Polishing requires a lot of attention and is expensive in the industry. After a major overhaul in this regard CIG is still locked in having to redo old assets whenever they introduce something new to their tech-demo.
Cannot add new stuff or does so very slowly because the effort to keep this mess together is extreme and also taxes the engine to its limits. Various hacks and modifications in the past changed this but it was always operating at 80-90% capacity (my guess).
CIG requires more money to even complete the alpha-stage of the project. Mutliples of this value (once its done and can be evaluated) will be required for the other stages of the project. Yet CIG and the pro-community talk about releases and behaves as if an actual completion is very close complretely ignoring that the other 50% of a projects cycle can easily take 5 or 6 times as long as the alpha alone. That is the worrying aspect when people say "7 years and its still in alpha? What the heck". Something a lot of clueless people quite obviously dont understand.

Of course all of this is not common knowledge (even tho its very logical once you start to get into the topic). I hardly knew anything when I started to watch SC but the time has given me some good insight into what to expect and how things are done without knowing any of the details (in CIGs case hidden behind its non-transparency) beforehand

The extreme defense we therefore see in the SC community against anything remotely negative follows the very same paths real world discussions go. The absolute best they can hope for is to achieve a local or temporary victory if bystanders perceive them as outwitting all the accusers and haters. Whatever they do doesnt change reality or the state of Star Citizen. Its development and success probability is completely disconnected from any discussion about it. The 7 years so far have only shown how often the pro-crowd has been wronged and confused about SCs true condition. And while the consequence of arguments and mind-gymnastics becoming more and more extreme is also akin to real world arguments happening in bars or living rooms the result stays the same.....completely disconnected from these statements.


I d like to add that all projections and discussions are based on the 2012 and its modified version of 2014 (16?) advertisement. We all have this picture in our mind of what SC tries to become. Some bask in that glory completely disregarding actual developments, others understand that image with the implications and problems the current development so far has shown. This is why most people understand that the current Star Citizen is indeed very very very far away from completion, Not even CIG denies this.

Now imagine if this image we all expect is just a lie and CIG currently works on pushing out the current tech-demo as a final product instead? Not by necessity but planned because they understand they cannot do anything else. They ll just focus to increase stability (check, not done yet tho) and to provide the most basic gameloops required (check, years of work remain), optimize the whole thing (if possible) for a couple of set-ups then drop it on the market and be done.....

And SQ42.....is simply combining all the outdated Mocap footage they have with the current SC PU. This is already a monumental task for CIG and can easily eat up the remaining 18 months before SQ42 is expected. That means the PU will stay the same, THAT is what you will get. Already new features are sold on the premise of "we ll deliver these sometimes after release"...like the other 99 systems for example...right?

Just think about that for a minute.

If this really happens....how long ago do you think Star Citizen has turned into a scam? At which point did CR and cronies realize they cannot do this, have no hope to achieve the fidelity ande complexity they sold to private people for millions? 2013? Was THAT the real reason for the "community poll" back then? To buy them more time? And at which point did CR further understand that adding more stuff to the pile and making the whole idea even more complex is NOT the solution? 2015? Everything past that is pretty much the scam I refer to when I call it that. An impossible project and CR knows it yet he continues to sell it as the dream.

As I said in the past....Chris Roberts is not a child or trying out his first steps in this industry. He is a legal and (probably) mental adult, has a family and claims expertise in game and project development. He was given private money on the basis of being a responsible and proficient expert in the required areas.

An image he blasts into oblivion himself by trying to play his own game. Not my doing. Not the faul of all the haters and critics. This is Chris Roberts proving his qualifications to provide YOU with the BDSSE.....

Well I mean Chris Roberts bought a multi million dollar home. Somethings going according to plan. 🏰
 
Q: when do we get our own volleyball in-game?
A: we could do this right now, our game is able to handle small personal objects.
That was a joke question, right?
If not, then it just about sums up the dysfunctional expectation of the direction (some people) think this 'project' should be going.
 
This honestly saddens me. I like how the ceiling opens, the little bits of smoke, that fellow walking around etc. But the way the ship moves, I just don't understand it. Sure, ED is widely praised for its flight model, so I am not expecting SC to beat that. But this also looks worse than X4 (or X:rebirth). And NMS. Hell, this looks worse than Evochron and that was cobbled together by one dude.

Now I am not a coder. I don't understand game development. But surely if one dev at CIG would spend a lazy afternoon tweaking some numbers it has to end up so much better than whatever this is? The way the ship moves genuinely makes me think of how cars moved in a 3D race game I wrote when I was nine years old...
 
This honestly saddens me. I like how the ceiling opens, the little bits of smoke, that fellow walking around etc. But the way the ship moves, I just don't understand it. Sure, ED is widely praised for its flight model, so I am not expecting SC to beat that. But this also looks worse than X4 (or X:rebirth). And NMS. Hell, this looks worse than Evochron and that was cobbled together by one dude.

Now I am not a coder. I don't understand game development. But surely if one dev at CIG would spend a lazy afternoon tweaking some numbers it has to end up so much better than whatever this is? The way the ship moves genuinely makes me think of how cars moved in a 3D race game I wrote when I was nine years old...
This shows a reasonable flight model being used by an FPS player using a mouse and keyboard and purely digital inputs...nothing more. That may seem to be in defence of the current flight model offering..and I suppose it is in a small way.

An explaination...I fly the ships in SC very much as I fly the ships in E-D...and besides from SC's latest effort flight model still being too 'digital' and mouse oriented for my liking, the ships fly surprisingly well compared to the previous turrets in space offering. It's not nearly as good as E-D but it's certainly headed in the right direction.

The one thing that has translated well from the new flight model is the sense of weight or mass when flying the medium to large ships...might not be noticeable flying with M/KB (I wouldn't know) and the dinky toy fighters are still too pointy with overpowered thrusters even with the HOTAS...but that's due to the control focus being M/KB and catering to FPS players flying space ships like an extension of their FPS characters.
 
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