Time for FD to Bite the Bullet on Mission Stacking?

Now, I'm a sensible chap and it's obvious to scour the board for missions going to the same place you already decided to go, but I think it's safe to say that most of the credit exploits that have happened are down to the mission generation system and quirks of geography.

Generating multiple missions of the same type to the same destination is the root cause.
The combination of particular BGS states and few or even just one possible destination creates these situations.

I see a few things going on that maybe should be addressed.

First, the least controversial one - distance.
The missions seem to be 99% at 15ly or less.
Given the increases in jump range, there should be more missions in the 15-30ly range.

Just doing that would likely remove a chunk of the outliers by providing additional destinations to generate missions for.

Secondly, tone down the BGS impact.
Instead of what seems like 100% of the missions being determined by the BGS, turn that dial down to 50% and leave a random mix of other mission types available.

That would reduce the likelyhood of there being only one mission type available which I see frequently.

Thirdly, and this is going generate the salt, prevent mission stacking.
In general, it makes little sense for the same mission provider to be offering multiple instances of the same mission type to the same destination.

I think it's time for FD to bite the bullet on this and prevent the mission system from generating identikit missions.
But hey, you can just relog and take the next one.
Nope, the system should also check the missions you already have open.
Or, if that doesn't offer enough variety, generate multiple mission of the same type, but remove the others once one has been accepted. That would offer some choice - for example, do I want the 10 ship massacre or the 50 ship massacre mission.

Another credit nerf?
Maybe in order to stop these outliers that always seem to crop up and the continuous nerf bat, it's worthwhile thinking about it.

However, in general the base mission values need to be revisited.
I think many of the things FD have tried, like the destination distance factor, were good ideas in themselves, but were scuppered by identikit mission generation creating the exploits.

Mission stacking should still be an obvious thing to do, but it should involve a variety of tasks offered by different mission providers, and relogging should not offer a way around it.

I honestly think this would provide a reasonable basis to put appropriate values on the different base mission types and then take into account all the kinks - quantity, distance, level, etc.

Let the salt flow begin!

TL;DR because it's clear that people have trouble with long posts.

I'm only suggesting to remove the stacking of identical missions.
The same type of mission, to the same destination, from the same faction.
And that only as a first step to properly evaluating what values different missions should have.
 
Last edited:
I'm not going to make a huge salty post. I'll just say it quite clearly - the day they prevent any mission stacking at all will be the day I log out and uninstall. In terms of fixing a problem, it's using a bazooka to kill a housefly.
 
I'm not going to make a huge salty post. I'll just say it quite clearly - the day they prevent any mission stacking at all will be the day I log out and uninstall. In terms of fixing a problem, it's using a bazooka to kill a housefly.

I'm not saying it's a solution by itself, but I do think it offers a way forward for rebalancing mission rewards better.

Why take 5 x Massacre 10 ships if there's 1 Massacre 50 ships available that pays 5 times as much?
 
To be honest, we have seen the 12th "revamp" of the mission system now. Its a matter of fact that every single change made to the missions is leading to hundreds of unforseen side effects that are obviously ruining someones game. Since I know some of the guys at FD I will not say that they are too dumb to see the problems beforehand. My opinion is that it´s maybe just too complex. And when complexity and release-pressure come together, you get something like we have now: Banana-Software.
 
I'm starting to think that direct Credit rewards should be removed from missions or be very low 10 000-100 000 and fixed by rank.
Missions should reward Reputation, Influence, Materials and Commodities.
So the rewards are tools for other parts of the game.
Doing the missions should be for the fun or larger goal.
 
Last edited:
Thirdly, and this is going generate the salt, prevent mission stacking.
In general, it makes little sense for the same mission provider to be offering multiple instances of the same mission type to the same destination.

It makes absolute sense to offer several identical missions to the same destination. Ever heard of post offices?
 
I'm not saying it's a solution by itself, but I do think it offers a way forward for rebalancing mission rewards better.

Why take 5 x Massacre 10 ships if there's 1 Massacre 50 ships available that pays 5 times as much?

Well for me it's because the stacked missions may well be given out by more than one faction, which allows you to increase rep or affect the BGS for multiple factions simultaneously. It's not all about the credits.

There's also the fact that you frequently get multiple missions to the same system but not necessarily the same station. That in turn provides a reason to fly round say three stations in the destination system, collecting missions from all of them in the process, which is one of the reasons I've never really needed to do board flipping to stack missions.

There's also the obvious point that if you fail your mission to kill 250 ships because you only bag 220 before the timer expires you get nothing, whereas if you take 5 missions, each of which is to kill 50 ships and only manage 220, you can still have handed four of them in.

I do understand what you'd be trying to achieve with it, it just doesn't suit the way I choose to play the game. That's why I didn't say 'You're an idiot for suggesting it' but just that I think it would kill off much of my own enjoyment to the point that I'd be thinking 'Can I really be bothered with this any more?'
 
Last edited:
I don't see the problem with mission stacking, and it's an absolutely valid strategy for increasing your credit earning potential.

The problem is not that you can stack missions, it's that there are some situations where mission rewards are disproportionate to the effort required to do them.
 
Last edited:
First, the least controversial one - distance.
The missions seem to be 99% at 15ly or less.
Given the increases in jump range, there should be more missions in the 15-30ly range.
There would certainly be advantages to this, especially in the sparser parts of the bubble or Colonia - I wonder, however, if an (average) eight-fold increase in candidate systems might make the mission generator somewhat inefficient in the denser regions?

And I'm not sure it would help in many of the famous cases, which were much more isolated.

Secondly, tone down the BGS impact.
Instead of what seems like 100% of the missions being determined by the BGS, turn that dial down to 50% and leave a random mix of other mission types available.
Most mission types - courier, mining, haulage, source, salvage, surface scan, donation, assassination, etc. - are already basically available in most or all BGS states, just variations of the briefing text and sometimes other minor details.

Economy and government type do have more of an effect - you're not going to get many "haul cargo from here" missions from a non-production economy like Service - but all of them can generate a wide range of missions in theory.

That would reduce the likelyhood of there being only one mission type available which I see frequently.
I think the cause of this is something different - I see this happen a lot, but then the same faction in the same state in the same station on another day will be generating a different set of missions.

I vaguely recall one of the devs saying that the mission generator first selected some types, then generated missions to those types. That might cause problems if some of the types then turn out to be impossible to generate due to other factors.
(However, would adding more types mean that it became too inefficient? If it can be done, then this would be good)

Thirdly, and this is going generate the salt, prevent mission stacking.
In general, it makes little sense for the same mission provider to be offering multiple instances of the same mission type to the same destination.
Most types of stackable mission just aren't that big a deal, though.
- courier: they pay very little to start with, so a stack of 20 still pays less than a single haulage mission (the INF and REP gains are surprisingly high, though)
- haulage: they take hold space, so it's self-limiting how many you can stack
- surface scan, salvage, assassination, massacre: them being in the same system really doesn't save much time compared with different systems
- mining, source cargo, donation: really doesn't matter how many you stack up

I'd far rather - if they wanted to discourage stacking - they did it by making the "enemy sent to stop you" rather more effective. At the moment (even for Elite-ranked missions)
- the wrinkle only triggers after so long that you've basically already done the mission by then, unless you're messing around a lot
- half the time, the enemy then doesn't actually show up at all
- when they do show up, they're often stuck to a planet's gravity well, so they never catch up in time to interdict
- if they do interdict, they can be trivially evaded
- if you do mess that up, submit, boost, high-wake and they almost certainly won't still be there on attempt 2.

If stacking 20 Elite missions meant being attacked by 20 Elite ships and having to high-wake or die (or fly something which can take them and actually have a use for the ridiculous extremes of engineering, for a big payout bonus...), it might self-regulate...
(But most of the issues with that are not actually issues with the mission system, of course)
 
Just tone down the credit rewards, or perhaps limit the range.

I can take a 500kcr planetary can mission that is just as easy to complete as a 3mcr planetary scan mission.

Basically, I think FD should thumb their nose at the "moar credz" brigade and reduce the cr/hr potential of every activity in the game. I'd also accept a full wipe of every CMDR in the game to reset things.
 
Well for me it's because the stacked missions may well be given out by more than one faction, which allows you to increase rep or affect the BGS for multiple factions simultaneously. It's not all about the credits.

There's also the fact that you frequently get multiple missions to the same system but not necessarily the same station. That in turn provides a reason to fly round say three stations in the destination system, collecting missions from all of them in the process, which is one of the reasons I've never really needed to do board flipping to stack missions.

There's also the obvious point that if you fail your mission to kill 250 ships because you only bag 220 before the timer expires you get nothing, whereas if you take 5 missions, each of which is to kill 50 ships and only manage 220, you can still have handed four of them in.

I do understand what you'd be trying to achieve with it, it just doesn't suit the way I choose to play the game. That's why I didn't say 'You're an idiot for suggesting it' but just that I think it would kill off much of my own enjoyment to the point that I'd be thinking 'Can I really be bothered with this any more?'

I'm not suggesting taking that away.

It makes absolute sense to offer several identical missions to the same destination. Ever heard of post offices?

Are all those letters from the same person?
 
Back
Top Bottom