Vertical sync affecting enemy behaviour?

Has one of you ticketed this? If not, might be worth it.

I play exclusively with adaptive v-synch on. While it caps my FPS at 60 vs the 120-200 I'd otherwise see, I get minor screen tearing and juddering on a 60 Hz monitor without it enabled. I haven't compared the quality of the AI with v-synch on or off, but enjoy the game tremendously with v-synch on. The AI behave intelligently - for the most part - which can make the game challenging.
 
Bassman's terminology may not be 100% correct and there may be some confusion in the wording of his message, but there is nothing wrong with the foundation of his statement.

A locked VSync renderer has less CPU work to do than a non locked VSync renderer, this could potentially lead to less cycles available for AI, (depending on the engine), even if it is multi-threaded and/or multi-core. The logic is simple, if you are traversing a scene graph, culling, clipping and presenting draw calls, (this is all basic CPU rendering work), at 60FPS; it's obviously less CPU work for a given time interval, compared to doing the same thing at 100FPS.

With all that said, I would be terribly surprised if ED's AI thread was coupled to it's rendering thread; typically AI and physics are run on separate threads at semi-deterministic intervals, (e.g. 100Hz), whilst the rendering thread runs at a completely different frequency, (depending on factors such as VSync, GPU speed, game's chosen graphic settings, etc).

This is an interesting thread and nothing is black and white in complex multi-threaded and multi-core games, as I said I would be surprised if the AI and physics of ED was coupled in anyway to it's rendering, but I would also not rule out complex interactions due to issues such as:

- Not 100% decoupling of AI and rendering.

- A bug in the AI that makes it seem it is VSync dependent.

- The almost infinite variability in user's hardware and software configurations.

It's extremely difficult to test situations like this, unless the behaviour discrepancies become obvious, (such as the AI not firing, or coming to a dead stop, etc), and is subject to personal interpretation; with that said I would still ticket it so that someone at FD at least knows there is a potential issue.

The logic behind this is still ridiculous.

I played this game with G-Sync.. ...I'd love to hear the conspiracy theories on that one.
 
Link: How VSync works

Could it be that with VSync set to ON, on the frames that are not in sync with the monitors refreshrate (and are dropped) the hits on the targets are not accounted for?

I don't think so. It is like FromtonRouge said, they don't even try to attack. Also, it is much harder to tail Federal Fighters because they try to circle around you more intensely.

I will ticket this now.
 
Anyone tried MSI Afterburner/Rivatuner's framerate cap instead of v-sync? For example, I have it running when I play Skyrim and it helps reduce stuttering I had indoors. My preference is capping at 60, can't stand screen tearing.

Also I believe for Nvidia users if you go into the control panel and activate adaptive v-sync, from what I've read it has advantages of v-sync with less of the problems associated with it.
 
The logic behind this is still ridiculous.

I played this game with G-Sync.. ...I'd love to hear the conspiracy theories on that one.

The logic in everything that I wrote is sound, your counter argument which consists entirely of "The logic behind this is still ridiculous." is not.

Come up with some evidence to support your claim if you want to be taken seriously.
 
This is completely ridiculous. The processing is done on GPU and has nothing to do with the AI logic of the game.


No, it is not possible that V-Sync affects the AI difficulty level. This is a troll.

The CPU still has to do a lot of work for each rendered frame such as applying the game physics rules to work out where everything has moved since the last frame so infact increasing frame rate does increase CPU load. If this were not case then then you could arbitrarily increase the frame rate of a game by adding GPU power when in reality all games reach a point there they are CPU limited.
 
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I've made a video of the bug, I think it's not just a vsync problem : when I turn off vsync and also set the option "Frame Rate Limit" to 45 Hz the AI behavior is still ok. Looks like the AI quality depends on the framerate :(

Finally it's simple to reproduce, in Incursion Mission go to Wave 7 :

- Switch vsync to off, Federal Fighters don't shoot you or shoot a little (or maybe they just shoot but their aiming is really bad)
- Switch vsync to on => Federal Fighters shoot you properly
- Reswitch vsync to off => They stop...

etc...

It also works for Wave 9 :p

Bug Ticket #1245

[video=youtube_share;qhCSLYGzDbM]http://youtu.be/qhCSLYGzDbM[/video]
 
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I find this hard to believe, an MMO that gets easier by turning vertical sync off? Now I've seen everything.
 
I've made a video of the bug, I think it's not just a vsync problem : when I turn off vsync and also set the option "Frame Rate Limit" to 45 Hz the AI behavior is still ok. Looks like the AI quality depends on the framerate :(

Finally it's simple to reproduce, in Incursion Mission go to Wave 7 :

- Switch vsync to off, Federal Fighters don't shoot you or shoot a little (or maybe they just shoot but their aiming is really bad)
- Switch vsync to on => Federal Fighters shoot you properly
- Reswitch vsync to off => They stop...

etc...

It also works for Wave 9 :p

Bug Ticket : https://support.elitedangerous.com/tickets.php?id=1250

[video=youtube_share;qhCSLYGzDbM]http://youtu.be/qhCSLYGzDbM[/video]

Very nice video, it demonstrates the issue quite well. Ticket aside we should try to keep the thread of the first page so that devs can see it, it's kind of a critical bug that can lead to exploiting, and it's been found not even a week before release.
 
FromtonRouge, I already made a ticket about this. When I click your link it says invalid ticket ID, so they probably removed it as duplicate?
 
Strange, the link works fine here. The real ticket id is #00000001245 but in the link the id is 1250.

EDIT: Oops yeah we can't see other's tickets

From my twitter line it looks like Howard Chalkley a programmer at Frontier has seen the video
 
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Anyway, good if they have noticed this... This makes a big difference in the game. People could exploit it or just unintentionally play too easy game.
 
I wonder if it affects online play and instancing? For example, how the AI behaves when in an instance with one person having v-sync/limit on and another person having it off.
 
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