Wars ending in a "Draw" should not transfer assets!

[liveontimemitnoevil]

I just finished fighting for a faction engaged in a war in Orishis, and over 7 days the conflict finally ended in a "Draw." This was surprising because the News Feeds all stated that the faction I had supported actually won the conflict!

Afterwards, it appeared that the lowest value asset in our faction (which wasn't actually the lowest?) was transferred to the owning faction, Perez Ring Brewery. Now, I get that's a player faction, but they weren't even involved in the conflict directly. It's simply preposterous to award the ruling faction anything for a conflict that it didn't participate in, especially considering that faction controls 90% of the assets in the system. There ought to be some extra measure which determines whether or not they will actually seize assets at all in the case of a draw.

My biggest complaint here is that assets were transferred at the end of a Draw. That doesn't make much sense, and it just seems like bad game design. Further, the News Feeds in Orishis claimed that there was actually a victor, yet the actual results say otherwise.

Finally, I noticed that the ground conflict zones were still active (yet there were no markers on the system map). Upon arriving, they were actually "Team Deathmatch" with no objectives or reinforcement counts whatsoever. The two fights I participated in during this stage were devoid of any indicators to show that there was a conflict, besides the "Control Point" locations, energy/ammo, etc. being present and yet control points did not activate at all. These fights resulted in my faction's victory, but there was not a place to acknowledge this besides the Actors in the level.

Something seems off here, so if this is a bug, then I get it. But it's a pretty gross bug...it really makes me question the entire background simulation...not that any of us have ever doubted it before


Fly safe,
CMDR Concomitant

 

[Ian Doncaster]

My biggest complaint here is that assets were transferred at the end of a Draw

The main staked assets shouldn't change in the event of a draw, but I think other Odyssey bases can change hands between the two fighting factions normally. That said, checking the war results on 3rd party tools, it looks like it was a 4-3 victory rather than a draw: where did you get the information that it had been a draw?

A base going to the unrelated controlling faction can happen - indirectly - with the following sequence of events:
1) The war is an Invasion war
2) The losing faction nevertheless wins an Odyssey base through the normal mechanisms
3) It then retreats from the system, giving all its remaining assets (like the base it just collected) to the controlling faction

That doesn't seem to have been the case here, though, and it shouldn't happen otherwise. So, obvious question: how sure are you that your faction definitely owned that asset before the war started, and how sure are you that you don't now? (Which asset was it, by the way?)

Finally, I noticed that the ground conflict zones were still active

That's probably just normal lag. There are so many things which need updating when BGS state changes and they don't all switch over at once, so shortly after a major change things can end up a bit odd. It should shake itself out soon enough.

 

[liveontimemitnoevil]

The main staked assets shouldn't change in the event of a draw, but I think other Odyssey bases can change hands between the two fighting factions normally. That said, checking the war results on 3rd party tools, it looks like it was a 4-3 victory rather than a draw: where did you get the information that it had been a draw?

A base going to the unrelated controlling faction can happen - indirectly - with the following sequence of events:
1) The war is an Invasion war
2) The losing faction nevertheless wins an Odyssey base through the normal mechanisms
3) It then retreats from the system, giving all its remaining assets (like the base it just collected) to the controlling faction

That doesn't seem to have been the case here, though, and it shouldn't happen otherwise. So, obvious question: how sure are you that your faction definitely owned that asset before the war started, and how sure are you that you don't now? (Which asset was it, by the way?)


That's probably just normal lag. There are so many things which need updating when BGS state changes and they don't all switch over at once, so shortly after a major change things can end up a bit odd. It should shake itself out soon enough.

That's really interesting stuff, and I thank you for the response!

I just assumed that it was a draw because of the asset transfer...that was the only explanation which made sense. I saw it was listed as a "Win" in the news, but that didn't line up with what I saw happen. The settlement was Dukuly's Rest, which had been under my faction's control for some time - well before the war by at least a week, I'd say. I recently started supporting that faction, and we've held it for at least two wars - this one included. Until literally the last moment...it just didn't make sense to me. So I assumed it was actually a draw and something was bugged elsewhere.

A victory makes way more sense now...but maybe those buggy conflict zones did something strange...some "final showdown" after a long war like this. We DID come back from losing 1-3 and managed to scrape out 4-3. Do you think that might come into play somehow?

 

[Ian Doncaster]

According to Inara - I'm not in game right now to check properly - Dukuly's Rest is in the hands of the Allied Orishis Order, rather than Perez Ring Brewery (and the update time on that data is recent). So you may want to double-check the ownership in-game: possibly there was some temporary blip that made it look like it was PRB-owned.

If that's the case, this is what happened:

• You fought Allied Orishis Order, who had no assets, so they stake nothing and you staked the Empyrean Intelligence Hub
• You won the war, so you keep the Hub, but don't gain any more from that because they didn't have anything in the first place
• However, in a War-type conflict, Odyssey settlements are all (unless they're part of the main stakes) contested separately: whoever wins the most CZs at each settlement gets to keep it afterwards (so it's possible to win the war but lose all the Odyssey settlements involved, if you fight solely in space and your opponents fight solely on the ground)
• Whoever was knocking you down to 1-3 presumably did so by fighting primarily on the ground at Dukuly's Rest (whereas maybe your war-winning actions were more split across settlements and space CZs?) so that transfers to AOO: narratively, despite losing the war, they won the battle there.

So each war you have to decide:
- space CZs are significantly more important towards the overall war outcome
- ground CZs determine who gets to keep each Odyssey settlement
and plan your balance accordingly. Unlike the main war scores, there's also no way to tell who is ahead at each settlement, so you just have to guess...

 

[Screemonster]

Further to what Ian said, you can use this deliberately to your advantage by starting wars to transfer odyssey settlements to a faction while not allowing that faction to win the overall war - people have been doing this with anarchy factions pretty much since the launch of odyssey, either to hand off settlements to an anarchy faction in order to subsequently farm them for materials, or for anarchy controlling factions to hand off all their surface assets to stop people raiding them.

 

[liveontimemitnoevil]

According to Inara - I'm not in game right now to check properly - Dukuly's Rest is in the hands of the Allied Orishis Order, rather than Perez Ring Brewery (and the update time on that data is recent). So you may want to double-check the ownership in-game: possibly there was some temporary blip that made it look like it was PRB-owned.

If that's the case, this is what happened:

• You fought Allied Orishis Order, who had no assets, so they stake nothing and you staked the Empyrean Intelligence Hub
• You won the war, so you keep the Hub, but don't gain any more from that because they didn't have anything in the first place
• However, in a War-type conflict, Odyssey settlements are all (unless they're part of the main stakes) contested separately: whoever wins the most CZs at each settlement gets to keep it afterwards (so it's possible to win the war but lose all the Odyssey settlements involved, if you fight solely in space and your opponents fight solely on the ground)
• Whoever was knocking you down to 1-3 presumably did so by fighting primarily on the ground at Dukuly's Rest (whereas maybe your war-winning actions were more split across settlements and space CZs?) so that transfers to AOO: narratively, despite losing the war, they won the battle there.

So each war you have to decide:
- space CZs are significantly more important towards the overall war outcome
- ground CZs determine who gets to keep each Odyssey settlement
and plan your balance accordingly. Unlike the main war scores, there's also no way to tell who is ahead at each settlement, so you just have to guess...

Damn, well that might explain it. I did fight at Dukuly's several times, but I guess it wasn't enough. Without a counter, it's really just up in the air. The transfer to PRB was very strange, but if it truly ended up with AOO then I guess I'll just have to win it back!

Thanks for all of the great info! I'm glad it all mostly worked out in the end. I'll plan accordingly in the future o7