What is Going on with Elite Dangerous in 2020? Hawkes Gaming video

[Deleted member 38366]

IMHO it simply boils down to a mere few things :

1) "Balancing" and "FDev" don't go well together.
It used to be different, but that was in 2014. Went downhill from there. More and more unforced errors went into the Game and/or many of its features.
What was once intended to be a swiss watch with sub-millimeter precision mechanics got worked on with a Sledgehammer and a Crowbar over and over again.
In no other Title have I ever seen such knee jerk adjustments with original intended Balancing off by upto over a full order of magnitude.
This fundamental inability to get things about right on 1st attempt is quite unique, more often than not what should be Expert Balancing rather looks like : Trial & Error ¯\(ツ)/¯

So you play the Game after a Patch or see a new Feature being introduced.... And be like...

2) "Resources" vs "Live build" vs. QA/Testing
If it wasn't obvious by now... FDev conducts next to no testing whatsoever. "If it compiles - release it!" has often been their MO.
Results :

• ordinary Players log into a new build and discover obvious and in-your-face issues within Minutes. Hallmark signs of no Testing, as these could not have possibly been overlooked.
• Beta Phases - when existing - often result in only top tier bugs being addressed, with plenty medium and minor issues still making it into release. Reason : unrealistic Release deadlines vs. Code and Design Quality.
• what is called Beta is essentially an Alpha. And what its called Release is essentially a Public Beta. Rinse & Repeat often enough - and you'll have one hell of a customer relationship going on

On top, the amount of Resources going into this live build has been minimal to non-existing for almost 2 years now.
A skeleton team tasked with recycling as much of old/existing codebase as possible and make it into a new feature is being put out of their league. Pressure cooker. Never worked, doesn't work, will never work. It's plain unrealistic.
That's how half-baked features are born, that's how unrealistic deadlines combined with insufficient resources result in Damage Control with grim accuracy. Over and over again.

3) Learning Curve
Well, sorry. None observed for the most part.
Those who do not learn history are doomed to repeat it.

In a nutshell, that's what we're seeing. And lacking fundamental changes to the underlying structure of the entire Design & Development process, it leads to another classic.
All this has happened before... and it will happen again. And again. And again. And again. And again. And again. And again. And again.

 

[AkenBosch]

...a game about getting the biggest ship possible as soon as possible with every single thing I did along the way just something I did out of necessity so I could get the big shiny at the end....

Dangerous Discussion, a TL;DR.

 

[Pristine_Bump]

I hate bugs as much as the next person, but I've actually been enjoying ED quite a bit since getting a fleet carrier. The majority of the bugs that everyone is complaining about haven't affected me personally. I guess I've been hanging around Stigbob too long.

Disclaimer - I'm not refuting that these bugs exist, but rather that they do not intersect my gameplay, nor have they prevented me from using my fleet carrier in the way I originally envisioned.

They hadnt me either till Sunday morning now all I can do is wait.... and go back to normal business till the disapearing tritium x 2 mess is resolved ,its strange waiting to travel with other Cmmdrs also on board Ive never been a game critic but Im not happy now

 

[Kamiyoda]

I never said it would shut down !!!
(SNIP)
We're both suckers as we will make do with what FD gives us.

Never said you did.

And that's the difference between you and me, you think your a sucker because your playing a game your unsatisfied with.

I'm enjoying the game despite its flaws. I'm not even disagreeing about the stuff your complaining about... mostly. I just enjoy the game regardless.

p.s. I have been here much longer than you(If your forum joining date is same as your 1st playing date), and in the 'olden' days we were very vocal, but much happier and FD would oblige us much more(hearing us out) than now.
Things have got MUCH worse...

It is not but I'm sure its within the same year. Not that any of that stopped me from reading threads older than my join date, which I have had to do a lot of over the years because of posts like this and just general boredom.

 

[Stigbob]

I just think it's not helpful to always draw attention to that 0.1%. You seem to talk about them a lot, how many times have you linked that article by now? Probably a three digit number.

I'll stop posting it when it stops being incredibly relevant, so probably never.

It's always funniest when posted in reply to the question "why do these <insert insult> devs not want to talk to me".

 

[Rat Catcher]

...
I'm enjoying the game despite its flaws. I'm not even disagreeing about the stuff your complaining about... mostly. I just enjoy the game regardless.
...

You really shouldn't be enjoying the game so obviously...

I've had a lot of snide comments indicating my IQ must be lower than my shoe size, or similar, from disgruntled forum undead in the past, solely because, like you (and @Stigbob , I have fun playing the game as it is and have no desire to make sweeping changes to accommodate any particular playstyle, or 'balance' the things I can see no issue with...

Continue to enjoy yourself, playing however you wish, and thinking how much your having fun is annoying someone else

 

[Stigbob]

You really shouldn't be enjoying the game so obviously...

I've had a lot of snide comments indicating my IQ must be lower than my shoe size, or similar, from disgruntled forum undead in the past, solely because, like you (and @Stigbob , I have fun playing the game as it is and have no desire to make sweeping changes to accommodate any particular playstyle, or 'balance' the things I can see no issue with...

Continue to enjoy yourself, playing however you wish, and thinking how much your having fun is annoying someone else

Have you noticed we also we seem to enjoy ourselves much more in the forum than the perpetually disgruntled types. Bit of a pattern there I think.

 

[BDelacroix]

Really, my guess is spaghetti code that is in the midst of being detangled.

 

[Harlow Shapley]

I enjoy playing this game (and I'm guessing it's the same for most here) because it's complex, variable and all about space, space ships and cosmology stuff. Some of it I like, and some I don't. That's just opinion.

Will it change or end soon? SPECULATION.

And I blame Odyssey for the speculation
WAIT! I don't mean Homer's book.
WAIT! I don't mean the Simpsons when I mentioned Homer.

 

[[Diplomacy] Carnegie]

Have you noticed we also we seem to enjoy ourselves much more in the forum than the perpetually disgruntled types. Bit of a pattern there I think.

The forum gives me much gruntlement, even when the game is silly.

 

[Stigbob]

The forum gives me much gruntlement, even when the game is silly.

Silly can also be fun.

 

[Tyvolus]

I never said it would shut down !!!
The whole game gets worse and worse as each new feature lacks QoL and simple game mechanics & adds to features needing fixing,logic.
Remember multi-crew ? BGS/PP ? Combat? Economy? CQC? ...... All neglected, and I probably missed many more.

If you like low quality gameplay, so be it as it is your choice.
I prefer immersion, usefulness and QoL in my game, my choice.

We're both suckers as we will make do with what FD gives us.

Wo

I don't get this obsession, why "everyone" just "needs" to get their FC?

I have no desire to get one. Once I found out the maintenance requirements, I was done even remotely considering one. I play this game VERY casually. There isnt anything that the devs do with this product that makes me want to play more than 2 or 3 hours a month and/or spend any of my money on the game. Maybe the new DLC changes thay, but I HIGHLY doubt it will. No chance really.

 

[Tyvolus]

I'll stop posting it when it stops being incredibly relevant, so probably never.

It's always funniest when posted in reply to the question "why do these <insert insult> devs not want to talk to me".

just like people will stop asking for QoL improvements to the game "when it stops being incredibly relevant, so probably never." -- 2 way street.

 

[rustyxnails]

There's nothing in the game that demands you spend 7 hours grinding in rings and hotspots, in fact the entire time I have spent mining since I started playing wouldn't add up to even half that amount of time, if you aren't enjoying the game because you insist on doing activities that bore you surely that's not the game's problem, in fact that can happen in any game, just do what you enjoy.

Yes! People complain about the grind...well, then don't grind! You don't NEED to have the Cutter tomorrow. Go out and blast some NPCs, discover new worlds, steal some data from megaships. If people complain that it takes to long to mine to buy this or that, or to rank up for this or that, they're missing the point. Big ships and carriers are not meant for new players to take out for a spin.

 

[Stigbob]

just like people will stop asking for QoL improvements to the game "when it stops being incredibly relevant, so probably never." -- 2 way street.

Forum suggestions are very rarely incredibly relevant, practical or realistic usually they are the opposite.

That's why the dev's use focussed feedback threads instead of the forum.

 

[Dutchman141]

I don't get this obsession, why "everyone" just "needs" to get their FC?

Is it bad vibe to be obsessed with not having the need of getting one?
I get that others like them but I have no intention whatsoever of getting my own,......ever.

 

[Sir Ganksalot]

I've been hearing this since I started.

This forum is a neverending parade of the sky is falling and only "Insert group or player here" knows how to fix it, if only Frontier(Insert PP, open only, PvE Server, PvP Server, Offline mode, remove features, add features, whatever) the game would be saved!"

I'll be convinced when the game servers suddenly shut down because of it.

While I agree with you, the game is in a pretty horrible state right now. Multiple bugs that have been added and never fixed, some of them almost game breaking.
I was trying to leave a station yesterday while getting tritium for @Pristine_Bump and blue tunneled till I crashed every time I tried to jump to supercruise, only to find out today that all of my donated tritium had been deleted somehow.
Instancing for PvP matches is a nightmare and the SLF bug still has never been fixed. I would almost go as far as to say this game is currently, downright broken.

Many activities in the game have no content and have been completely ignored despite the constant outcry for it. I have never had as much spite for a developer as I have for Frontier.

 

[Sysmon]

IMHO it simply boils down to a mere few things :

1) "Balancing" and "FDev" don't go well together.
It used to be different, but that was in 2014. Went downhill from there. More and more unforced errors went into the Game and/or many of its features.
What was once intended to be a swiss watch with sub-millimeter precision mechanics got worked on with a Sledgehammer and a Crowbar over and over again.
In no other Title have I ever seen such knee jerk adjustments with original intended Balancing off by upto over a full order of magnitude.
This fundamental inability to get things about right on 1st attempt is quite unique, more often than not what should be Expert Balancing rather looks like : Trial & Error ¯\(ツ)/¯

So you play the Game after a Patch or see a new Feature being introduced.... And be like...
View attachment 182199

2) "Resources" vs "Live build" vs. QA/Testing
If it wasn't obvious by now... FDev conducts next to no testing whatsoever. "If it compiles - release it!" has often been their MO.
Results :

• ordinary Players log into a new build and discover obvious and in-your-face issues within Minutes. Hallmark signs of no Testing, as these could not have possibly been overlooked.
• Beta Phases - when existing - often result in only top tier bugs being addressed, with plenty medium and minor issues still making it into release. Reason : unrealistic Release deadlines vs. Code and Design Quality.
• what is called Beta is essentially an Alpha. And what its called Release is essentially a Public Beta. Rinse & Repeat often enough - and you'll have one hell of a customer relationship going on

On top, the amount of Resources going into this live build has been minimal to non-existing for almost 2 years now.
A skeleton team tasked with recycling as much of old/existing codebase as possible and make it into a new feature is being put out of their league. Pressure cooker. Never worked, doesn't work, will never work. It's plain unrealistic.
That's how half-baked features are born, that's how unrealistic deadlines combined with insufficient resources result in Damage Control with grim accuracy. Over and over again.

3) Learning Curve
Well, sorry. None observed for the most part.
Those who do not learn history are doomed to repeat it.

In a nutshell, that's what we're seeing. And lacking fundamental changes to the underlying structure of the entire Design & Development process, it leads to another classic.
All this has happened before... and it will happen again. And again. And again. And again. And again. And again. And again. And again.

I have to agree. The latest beta is a great example of that. We went from one extreme to the other, and then release with no real changes from the second extreme. That's basically why I keep wanting fleet carrier back out of the game: I like the concept, but testing was never finished.

S

 

[dognosh]

Never said you did.

And that's the difference between you and me, you think your a sucker because your playing a game your unsatisfied with.

I'm enjoying the game despite its flaws. I'm not even disagreeing about the stuff your complaining about... mostly. I just enjoy the game regardless.



It is not but I'm sure its within the same year. Not that any of that stopped me from reading threads older than my join date, which I have had to do a lot of over the years because of posts like this and just general boredom.

"Enjoying the game" & "general boredom" , an oxymoron if i ever saw one

You carry on playing this boring wonderful game, and us vocalists will try to change the game and make it better for all of us.
p.s. Even in this state ED is the BEST game I ever played(since the mid 80s)
p.p.s I am old

 

[Stigbob]

"Enjoying the game" & "general boredom" , an oxymoron if i ever saw one

You carry on playing this boring wonderful game, and us vocalists will try to change the game and make it better for all of us.
p.s. Even in this state ED is the BEST game I ever played(since the mid 80s)

Appreciate what you've got, maybe ED is just as good it gets. Certainly better than the couple of decades we went without anything in the genre.

Right back at kickstarter technical feasibility was always raised as a potential limiting factor, looking at the other games that loosely fit the same category they don't really come close to it. ED is the yardstick we measure them by, just like the original was, and the sequel will probably be one day.