What the new secret feature should be

[Ian Doncaster]

What game besides Elite has a more or less real universe ? Well, not about the name of the systems, but the distance between bodies in the systems, the rotation of these bodies, gravity, etc. ?

This is one of the things where people are "split on what a space sim actually involves", certainly.

The basics of distance + rotation + gravity aren't all that difficult in themselves - FE2 did that back in the 90s, for example - but in most games set in space implementing them would get in the way of the desired gameplay rather than add to it.

Kerbal Space Program is the other modern example with realistic distances, sizes, orbits, rotations, gravity, etc. ... and also realistic thruster capabilities and travel speeds, which Elite Dangerous avoids implementing because it wouldn't work for the sort of game Frontier wanted to make.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

have i missed something...... or am i being way to pessimistic? but is base building or dense atmospheric planet landings or even vast explorable deralicts even remotely likely as the elite feature update this year?

i really hope so but given we have not had so much as a squeek from FD about it, i suspect some people are setting themselves up for a dissapointment.

more likely imo is an extension to something we already have.... personally i would not be surprised to see limited ground combat like we already have, but with thargoids..... so mostly the work needed would just be a few new alien models.

if we are lucky maybe even some thargoid controlled structures with alien like goop plastered on the walls etc.

but new planet types with new terrains, or base building...................... please let it be so but i would wager it is not happening - at least not without a fully fledged paid update.

(currently the terrain generation cant even build caves on the surface its mostly just a height map)

 

[Ian Doncaster]

have i missed something...... or am i being way to pessimistic? but is base building or dense atmospheric planet landings or even vast explorable deralicts even remotely likely as the elite feature update this year?

It seems unlikely to be anything that substantial, certainly - whatever it is, it's something they've been doing in parallel with the end stages of the Thargoid war and building the repeatedly-delayed Powerplay, plus smaller things like SCO and the Engineering adjustments, at a time when the company as a whole certainly hasn't had the spare cash to do big side-projects.

That said, some of those features do have quite broad scopes for what they might include. "Base building" where you pick one of the existing Odyssey settlement templates, and an uninhabited planet (no more precise control over position), pay your credits, and you get something similar to the Carrier interface to purchase services for it ... well, that's all things the game already does, just in a new combination and purpose. Maybe that would be practical.
(Would it make everyone who'd asked for base building happy? No, but nor would any other implementation - player's visions of what base building would be for are too contradictory for that)

 

[Rat Catcher]

If the base building blocks do not include straight sections, circular structures and perhaps cylinders with 1 flat end and one round end, there will be incessant complaints by the building fans that they can't erect their ideal building...

 

[Nowski]

have i missed something...... or am i being way to pessimistic? but is base building or dense atmospheric planet landings or even vast explorable deralicts even remotely likely as the elite feature update this year?

All we know really is that it's "an exciting new addition to the core gameplay" and what Arf relayed from the first Frontier stream this year,

• "brand new feature",
• "not a rework"
• "super cool"
• "full scope" seen a few months before Jan 2024
• "really really cool"
• "going to be really really fun" for players to do
• "Oh yes!"
• "have to give time to sit down and go through and talk about what this featture entails, what you'll be able to do with it, the new stuff that goes in with it"

(full Arf quote)

So there's definitely material to project your base-building, planet type etc. dreams onto there, but it could also be something more on the level of a hover scooter or tractor beam..

Most likely is something in between IMO, no idea what but very excited to find out!

 

[aRJay]

If the base building blocks do not include straight sections, circular structures and perhaps cylinders with 1 flat end and one round end, there will be incessant complaints by the building fans that they can't erect their ideal building...

There should be domes or spherical structures as well.

I think @Ian Doncaster has it right that it would be just a rehash of the FC build mechanic using Odyssey settlement models and a few changes of wording in the UI, which would be a shame as it would be nice for the base builders to have to be more hands on and supportive of their toy than we have to be with an FC.

 

[Cosmo]

All we know really is that it's "an exciting new addition to the core gameplay" and what Arf relayed from the first Frontier stream this year,

• "brand new feature",
• "not a rework"
• "super cool"
• "full scope" seen a few months before Jan 2024
• "really really cool"
• "going to be really really fun" for players to do
• "Oh yes!"
• "have to give time to sit down and go through and talk about what this featture entails, what you'll be able to do with it, the new stuff that goes in with it"

(full Arf quote)

1. "brand new feature" = something that's currently not in-game.
2. "what you'll be able to do with it" = maybe build structures
3. "the new stuff that goes in with it" = maybe building materials and schematics

If it's new planet types then he probably wouldn't have said "new stuff that goes in with it".

There should be domes or spherical structures as well.

I think @Ian Doncaster has it right that it would be just a rehash of the FC build mechanic using Odyssey settlement models and a few changes of wording in the UI, which would be a shame as it would be nice for the base builders to have to be more hands on and supportive of their toy than we have to be with an FC.

Seconded, base building needs deep customization like PC and PZ.

 

[Jumpin' Jack Flash]

Hi

......
but new planet types with new terrains, or base building...................... please let it be so but i would wager it is not happening - at least not without a fully fledged paid update.

(currently the terrain generation cant even build caves on the surface its mostly just a height map)

A fully fledged paid update........another thought here...one question that springs to mind, how much actual development is there already, whether shelved, still in some sort of development, or maybe not even started.
As regards a paid update, personally I'd gladly pay...l was going to put a price in £'s, but then thought that would depend on what's included in it. My initial figure might shock some people...or not. Lets just say it would start around the price of some of the more modern game titles.... MS Flight simulator 2024?...maybe...at a push.

What the new feature should be?...yeah, I keep thinking about this, there's a whole load of stuff I'd really like to see added to this game, so just one of several new features I have in mind would probably cut it. I...don't...want...more...Thargoid...stuff though. Unless of course there's more interaction in a more constructive way, and not destructive.

Hmmm...MSFS...Yeah, Imagine the same sort of detail for just one planet (or Moon) in Odyssey, now there's a thought
Anyhow, carry on...I've got some mined metals & minerals to offload now, I'll just boot up the INARA site and see what's on the best price menu today.
(I was going to creosote the garden shed...pah!...it's wet and miserable, playing this game seems the best option today I think. )

Jack

 

[varonica]

have i missed something...... or am i being way to pessimistic? but is base building or dense atmospheric planet landings or even vast explorable deralicts even remotely likely as the elite feature update this year?

My personal opinion, not base building, that's a big update that will probably come as a separate paid update, if ever. Same with dense atmospheric planets, major update, but also not new, it has been done in previous versions of Elite. Explorable derelicts I would say possible, EVA would be entirely new and not seen in other versions of Elite either, and since we have the legs part already it just needs the EVA and derelict models to be worked on. Could be flying through gas giants, tech is already there for that really with lagrange clouds and the clouds around titans.

 

[Agony_Aunt]

(Would it make everyone who'd asked for base building happy? No, but nor would any other implementation - player's visions of what base building would be for are too contradictory for that)

Oh man, I can already hear Yamiks' voice criticizing FD for doing it like this.

 

[varonica]

Oh man, I can already hear Yamiks' voice criticizing FD for doing it like this.

Even if the new feature was Cockpit Cats, there would be people complaining it wasn't Cockpit Dogs, you can't make everyone happy, and if you try you will end up the unhappy one!

 

[Cosmo]

My personal opinion, not base building, that's a big update that will probably come as a separate paid update, if ever.

If the leaks are correct then base building has been in development, put on hold and resumed for a few years. The necessary tech could come from the Planet games. Also, base building could be monetized with lots of cosmetics for the exterior, interior, NPCs, creatures, vehicles.

I don't see much monetization potential for new planet types, EVA, explorable derelicts, fly through gas giants. Maybe as paid DLC which is a 1 time purchase. Cosmetics would be less relevant.

 

[aRJay]

As any settlement would be a permanent feature of that planet, you could tie it into the BGS and PP 2.0.

Yes, it could be a bit of a one-time-action but it could also be a serious credit sink with long term engagement as you upgrade it over time.

I was thinking less of a credit sink with upkeep funding required but more of a time sink with player actions required at the base by the owner to keep it running, the more you do the better it works.
Of course I have no idea how that would work but if we don’t get to build it rather than buy it then we should have to run it.

1. "brand new feature" = something that's currently not in-game.
2. "what you'll be able to do with it" = maybe build structures
3. "the new stuff that goes in with it" = maybe building materials and schematics

There was also Cool and Really Cool and Fun mentioned which rules out many of our suggestions.

If it's new planet types then he probably wouldn't have said "new stuff that goes in with it".



Seconded, base building needs deep customization like PC and PZ.

Yes but not as rapid.

 

[Nowski]

There was also Cool and Really Cool and Fun mentioned which rules out many of our suggestions.

Only guessing, based on the enthusiasm for Titan endgame, but to pass Arf's "super cool" threshold explosions might need to be involved. Big explosions. Planet scale WMD for PP2?

 

[aRJay]

If the leaks are correct then base building has been in development, put on hold and resumed for a few years. The necessary tech could come from the Planet games. Also, base building could be monetized with lots of cosmetics for the exterior, interior, NPCs, creatures, vehicles.

It could but since a spacesuit skin costs more than an entire ship I dread to think of the cost of those cosmetics.

I don't see much monetization potential for new planet types, EVA, explorable derelicts, fly through gas giants. Maybe as paid DLC which is a 1 time purchase. Cosmetics would be less relevant.

 

[thistle]

I guess the issue with ED using something like UE is the fact that planets are generated on the fly based on procgen values, which wouldn't be possible with UE. It would work for Store Citizen though, where each planet is a fixed asset.

Yeah, I mean Vista Pro on the Amiga could create landscapes, but it wouldn't be much use to create a galaxy of planets. I expect it's the same with UE, it's not really designed for what fdev did with the stellar forge. Sometimes I think SC is using vistapro (sorry )

 

[thistle]

If the leaks are correct then base building has been in development, put on hold and resumed for a few years. The necessary tech could come from the Planet games. Also, base building could be monetized with lots of cosmetics for the exterior, interior, NPCs, creatures, vehicles.

Raises a question in my mind, how would base building be done in terms of the UI?

For a game where we are largely in first person view even when sitting at the controls, or using menus in our ship/helmet, how would the UI for base building fit? NMS style out of body third person with floating walls snapping together?

Hmm.

Still, I've no interest in bases so I'd never use it.

 

[thistle]

have i missed something...... or am i being way to pessimistic? but is base building or dense atmospheric planet landings or even vast explorable deralicts even remotely likely as the elite feature update this year?

i really hope so but given we have not had so much as a squeek from FD about it, i suspect some people are setting themselves up for a dissapointment.

No I don't think any of it is likely tbh. Probably something we've not thought of.

 

[Rat Catcher]

Even if the new feature was Cockpit Cats, there would be people complaining it wasn't Cockpit Dogs, you can't make everyone happy, and if you try you will end up the unhappy one!

Cockpit Rat or nothing...
Think of the fun it would have with all those exposed wires!

 

[imski]

I'm sorry, I didn't quite understand your sentence.

I showed with screenshots that weather conditions can be simply made in the current Elite world without changing anything on the planet. Just by adding. As you can see from the footage in the movie.

It seemed to me that some people think that adding weather must necessarily affect the current state of the planets.

Adding weather would change the state of the planets as you've have to account for erosion by wind and liquids, as well as things as channels formed by flowing liquids and things like lake and sea beds.