Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Except for the case where a convenient "disconnect" occurred in the middle of a combat / chase scenario?
Why does it matter if some players make the game easier for themselves?
- Thread starter Zplintz
- Start date
Except for the case where a convenient "disconnect" occurred in the middle of a combat / chase scenario?
Your paranoia is as bad as Sayers ...
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Well - we wouldn't want a trader skipping out on Pirate Cap'n Liqua and changing mode on him now, would we....
Thread topic: "Why does it matter if some players make the game easier for themselves?"
To me it really doesn't matter .. if players happen to be in the all pilots group, spot me, panic, then pull the plug so be it ... however the majority of people won't do that as they aren't that pathetic. Yes, there is a small subset of players who would but frankly I don't care .. cater to the majority and govern the minority. (In this case add them to /ignore
)ETA: In this case someones internet connection dropping is a reality and a possibility so I personally would prefer to cater for them than worry about what some oiks will do .. It's not an MMO; it's not an eSport; it's a new kind of hybrid to which FD will need (cue your CVs
) Game-Admins to monitor and respond to tickets ... I am relying upon them to deal with the troublemakers rather than lock the game down so tight it becomes a chore to even log in. Naive .. perhaps .. but with the group system if the game becomes a joke I can lock everyone out bar close friends and carry on playing - I will get my moneys worth
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Thread topic: "Why does it matter if some players make the game easier for themselves?"
To me it really doesn't matter .. if players happen to be in the all pilots group, spot me, panic, then pull the plug so be it ... however the majority of people won't do that as they aren't that pathetic. Yes, there is a small subset of players who would but frankly I don't care .. cater to the majority and govern the minority. (In this case add them to /ignore
You have too much faith in human nature :smilie:. Believe me people will pull the plug when they're faced with a pirate group or gank squad. You may get some who will take on a lone pirate if they think they have a chance, I agree with that. But it won't be many.
To me, when you join a group at game start that's the group that particular avatar will forever live in. You should not be able to switch groups. If you want to go solo you start a new avatar and game. I know this isn't the case in ED but I can see it becoming that way once the moaning and whining on the forums starts - which is always inevitable when a game goes live and is opened to the masses and things need to be refined/tweaked/ironed out etc. It happens in most MMO's to some extent.
If FD stick with the current plan then allowing players to switch groups should be done whilst docked or so far away from any other human contact that it doesn't matter and they can switch to their hearts content.
We're at a stalemate then.
You have no faith in humanity whilst I do. Neither can prove they are correct other than to give anecdotal evidence which means nothing. I just prefer to believe that people on the whole are not like that. As I said some will but the majority won't*
*This is based upon a large amount of time playing various games. Recently (last few years) I haven't actively participated in PvP games as I haven't had time, but I can't believe that in that short period mankind has degraded to the point of becoming whiny kids with ultra fragile egos ... If it's true then that's a sad realisation for me to accept and in effect you are right
So what? They pull the plug they lose their session. It's their loss. Their character will probably die in cyberspace without them. Anyone can do that in any type of on-line game.
That's not going to work. The people you group with sometimes won't always be online. The friends you couldn't group with while they were at work will be available to group with at the weekend. And there is no reason to force players to roll separate characters for different groupings, solo or otherwise. Even an Ironman commander can make a one-way switch to normal if the player feels like it (and must do if he wants to ressurect one from permadeath).
How else coud it be done? Your session can't morph magically from one to another. There has to be some handshaking.
We're at a stalemate then.
You have no faith in humanity whilst I do. Neither can prove they are correct other than to give anecdotal evidence which means nothing. I just prefer to believe that people on the whole are not like that. As I said some will but the majority won't*
*This is based upon a large amount of time playing various games. Recently (last few years) I haven't actively participated in PvP games as I haven't had time, but I can't believe that in that short period mankind has degraded to the point of becoming whiny kids with ultra fragile egos ... If it's true then that's a sad realisation for me to accept and in effect you are right
Eve Online has its fair share of that sort of player (or did up until 2010 when I stopped playing).
"You have no faith in humanity whilst I do." 7 years of playing Eve will make you change your mind on that
. So I'm also speaking from experience - probably 15 years of playing all sorts of MMO's. Its often the case that a game has fundamental gameplay mechanic changes early after release when things don't work out just as the developers had envisioned them to - or when the majority of players call for changes. But I hope FD stick to their guns though because their vision on how to handle the groupings and the different playstyles in one world is interesting and could be fantastic for the overall game - as long as it isn't exploitable.@Cathy. Fair points. Do we really know how this mechanic will work in practice, or is it all still speculation at this point?
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There have been several suggestions (all with good points) about mode switching but they do all agree that at the very least you cannot do it in combat or if you're involved in a pursuit, or even if you're in an instance with others.
Random suggestions related to group switching that I recall...
Switching at login only.
Switching when docked only.
Limited group switches per day/week.
Paid switching between groups.
Only allowed to switch when you have no missions and no cargo.
Random suggestions related to group switching that I recall...
Switching at login only.
Switching when docked only.
Limited group switches per day/week.
Paid switching between groups.
Only allowed to switch when you have no missions and no cargo.
7 years of playing Eve will make you change your mind on that
That game attracts like minded people and for me EVE was the cesspit of humanity .. I can well imagine that playing EVE for 7 years is enough to warp your opinion
I played WoW / BF2 / BF3 / DAoC and those games had their fair share of clowns, don't get me wrong, but on the whole players there were decent.We can at least agree that there are idiots in all walks of life and ED will have its fair share
That game attracts like minded people and for me EVE was the cesspit of humanity .. I can well imagine that playing EVE for 7 years is enough to warp your opinion
We can at least agree that there are idiots in all walks of life and ED will have its fair share
Haha I was one of the good guys in Eve - I never killed anyone who didn't attack me first
Liqua said:
You've said you're going to be a Pirate in the All grouping.
I said in other posts I have no interest in killing other players as a playstyle and will go the trader / explorer route.
I find it a bit ironic that I'm the one arguing the case to keep your playstyle fun - to help stop a pirates life becoming a case of 'spot the target - see the target warp away and switch groups to avoid me'.
So if you ever spot me with my cargo of spices on a trade run to Zaonce - remember you owe me one Liqua
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question, did you ever play any Online game, to know what the level of creativity of people is to find exploits and use them to their advantage?
bots, exploits, hacks, cheats .. I wonder if FD will think about that.
I consider solo/private group switching a potential exploit and a method of griefing (e.g. steal stuff from under the Allgroups nose).
easy to fix. If someone pulls the plug, their ship needs to stay there and can be shot down and looted. "Pulling the plug" is cheating and needs to be adressed.
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And what if it's a genuine disconnect? I don't want to be flying through space as normal only to find out that my internet connection has hiccuped, and upon reconnecting suddenly find I've lost all my gemstones and some of my money because I was killed.
"Pulling the plug" may be cheating but "losing connection" isn't.
oh my, Ironman... what a huge missed opportunity to put them in a seperate group. Really, facepalm.
Imagine they would be part of the Allgroup. Total hero mode, like Jedis in Dtar Wars Galaxies Pre-CU, the most epic game ever in existance.
Killing Ironmen would like killing Jedis in SWG, who also had permadeath.
Later they scrapped the game with CU and NGE, people were so ed off it was an epic disaster and resulted in a huge community backclash.
"You have no faith in humanity whilst I do." 7 years of playing Eve will make you change your mind on that
it's really not EvE exclusive
Any MMO.. as well as Youtube comments
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This situation has been around since the birth of online games. To avoid a can or worms most developers put disconnects down as acts of god and the player just has to suck it up unfortunately.
On Eve they did have a reimbursement method where players could petition to get their stuff back but as it happened quite often (especially early on when the game was released) the GM's where swamped with having to look through gaming logs and begin replacing all the items a player may have lost.
I'm not sure how big a staff FD will have, but since its a free to play game, I doubt they'll have the manpower to follow Eve's stance on reimbursement unless the technologies have advanced enough to make it a pretty simple task. Plus you'd probably have to prove it was a connection issue and not a deliberate act - impossible in most cases.
I think if FD come out and state categorically from day one of release that there is no reimbursement policy in this game it'll become an accepted given by the players.
As to cheating, again how can it be proved? If you cheat and deliberately disconnect yourself your ship and cargo should float derelict in space until you log back in and take control of it again.
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It'll probably be like most online games - tough luck! If you're in an instance with others you can't expect to just disappear or it ruins things for more people than just you (and will be exploited).
Flaky connections (at the user end) shouldn't be the responsibility of the game. If they were REALLY generous I suppose they could profile your account somehow to see if you're prone to disconnects at certain times, and give some leeway with death penalties. If you're prone to many disconnects then personally I'd play offline.
![[VR] Shadowman](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/16/16608.jpg?1553527108){kind=avatar}
I think in this case, I would simply accept that through no fault of my own (or FD's), that I've had a bit of bad luck, add a few expletives and move on. A d/c is a d/c whether it's a fault or a purposeful act, so how can they allow for one and not the other? The only way to prevent abuse is to cover it as either. If you're unlucky as in the example you've given, then hope for more luck next time.
Not according to the DDF Archives.
Any and all of these seem improvements over "tough luck". I accept that if I lose connection in combat then it's tough luck, but outside of combat I don't expect to just have my ship sit somewhere in space until I log back in.
Out of all the proposals then, this one would be the least exploitable I think;
- Ship heads to nearest station on auto-pilot (still vulnerable)