YOU can decide the fate of Lave

[smiths121]

Well bunch of independent radio hacks want to overthrough a democraticlly elected pro-alliance government. Step backwards for Lave if you ask me. Time to put another dictator on the throne!

On a more out of game note it is time the "states" from the BGS affected Powerplay, and the penalties for non-aligned controlling factions were greater (in both BGS and Powerplay sense). This would at least avoid the situation where the Mahone powerplay groups are either "do not care" or supporting the "revolution" as the corporate government is the thing of benefit to them.

Simon

 

[chemicalbeans]

But LRN is a corporation faction which is favourable to Mahon's PP ethos. So I would have thought the Mahonites are in favour of flip and that was what suggested during the last broadcast.

 

[Ouberos]

Will a take over stop the production of Brandy?

 

[chemicalbeans]

Well bunch of independent radio hacks want to overthrough a democraticlly elected pro-alliance government. Step backwards for Lave if you ask me. Time to put another dictator on the throne!

On a more out of game note it is time the "states" from the BGS affected Powerplay, and the penalties for non-aligned controlling factions were greater (in both BGS and Powerplay sense). This would at least avoid the situation where the Mahone powerplay groups are either "do not care" or supporting the "revolution" as the corporate government is the thing of benefit to them.

Simon

Agreed. Aisling Duval has the same problem in that none of her favoured gov types are ever Imperial factions. So AD space becomes independent. Doesn't seem right.

 

[smiths121]

You misunderstand what the Alliance is. It is primarily a mutual defense agreement. That is, an attack on one Alliance system, is an attack on all. This is the core of what the Alliance is. This is what you sign up for when you join the Alliance. It is this mutual defense pact that allows the self-determination of that system internally.

Workers of Lave Liberals is the local power.

The idea that a PMF inserted into the system somehow gives them "rights" over the system over existing local factions is a strange one. And if LRN were so popular locally, how come they lost at their earlier attempt? Who is imposing what on whom by force?

What the Prime Minister says or doesn't say is of no consequence in this matter. This is a core Alliance membership matter.

Agree with most of your post - particularly about the sense of "rights", although to be fair to the radio crew they are at least going about it using the BGS. The bit I would add is the "single trading block", the economic advantages of joining a single market, this is the bit hi-lighted by how Mahone operates at the Powerplay level. Whilst the mutal defence lore wise is important at the founding of the Alliance to stop the Empire or the Feds getting tempted when Allioth kicked them both out, the Alliance is modelled more as a economic power house in ED these days. There is no central navy, or command structure (I think the system take it turns to head up the military if I remember). Lave is a classic example, economically other than a few tuts and letter writing (forum posts) - at the powerplay level there is no insentive for players or player groups to get involved.

I still cannot see why this war is the important one as I thought Workers own the asteroid base, and lave station - and I thought the least important station was won by conflcits started by matching influence. The last Laveradio suggested the opposite.

Simon

 

[DNA-Decay]

Old Worlds for the Alliance!

In 3300 a lot of these were red. Fed systems.
And The Code made a claim there in April 3301 calling the Old Worlds: "The New Caribbean".
They even put their PMF in Orrere.

But one by one The Alliance has won these systems. Red has become Green.
There are tourist beacons in Reorte and in Leesti marking where The Alliance has reclaimed our systems.

The Diplomatic Corps still refers to a pile of hard work as "A Leestian effort".

I respect Lave Radio Network. I understand their claim.

But in the absence of meaningful narrative development for The Alliance, what choice is there but to claim and protect lore-rich systems.

One day I hope to give that T-shirt to David Braben. But every system will be coloured green.

Old Worlds for the Alliance!

 

[Vasious]

Please allow me to be confused with these statements....

Note I am all for stuff like this, but this makes very very little sense.
Especially since.


So yeah, it would seem taking away an alliance system is NOT supporting Mahon?

Explanation required? because I don't quite understand, especially seemingly since those Mahonites, are the ones that support Mahon in PP???? I'm only getting more confused by the logic.

But my play time is limited of late and its entirely possible I missed something when it comes to the player done aspects of things, but lore wise, it doesn't seem to work like this?

Live all Politicians he has his own economic interests outside the Office he holds, favoruing Corporations

 

[Schlack]

Id just like to clear a couple of things up. LRN were mis-adivised by one group that it was ok to take Lave, apparently without realising how strongly the other Alliance groups feel about the old worlds. This was done without consultation with and no notification to any other Alliance groups. The first we heard of this matter was when LRN announced the takeover of an alliance system on their radio show. That, naturally, led to a strong reaction to Save Lave on the part of a number of Alliance groups.

We bear no ill will towards LRN. The fault of this matter lies in poor descision making and lack of communication on the part of a particular individual some months ago which has led to this situation.

Negotiations are ongoing between LRN representatives and Alliance groups to come to a long term amicable, agreed outcome & co-existence. While peace is not yet raging, I believe the basis for agreement exists and therefore request that any rhetoric be toned down to facilitate the discussions.

 

[ranix]

Id just like to clear a couple of things up. LRN were mis-adivised by one group that it was ok to take Lave, apparently without realising how strongly the other Allaince groups feel about the old worlds. This was done without consultation with to notification to any other groups. The first we heard of this matter was when LRN announced the takeover of an alliance system on their radio show. That, naturally, led to a strong reaction to Save Lave on the part of a number of Alliance groups.

We bear no ill will towards LRN. Tthe fault of this matter lies in poor descision making and lack of communication on the part of a particular individual some months ago which has led to this situation.

Negotiations are ongoing between LRN representatives and Allaince groups to come to a long term amicable, agreed outcome & co-existence. While peace is not yet raging, I believe the basis for agreement exists and therefore request that any rhetoric be toned down to facilitate the discussions.

if you stand against the Free Radio Network your ship will be destroyed CMDR

 

[Schlack]

if you stand against the Free Radio Network your ship will be destroyed CMDR

Yes, this kind of rhetoric.

 

[XanderVekk]

Considering Alliance players have been trying to take over Earth behind everyone's backs, they really can't complain about Lave.

It's all fun and games until someone comes and takes one of YOUR toys away, the AEDC tears here are delicious.

At least a certain extremely popular Elite radio station had the courtesy to inform everyone ahead of time instead of crooning about it after the fact.

Sounds like a really good war is coming. Best of luck to you all, and cheers!

 

[DaveC]

Agree with most of your post - particularly about the sense of "rights", although to be fair to the radio crew they are at least going about it using the BGS. The bit I would add is the "single trading block", the economic advantages of joining a single market, this is the bit hi-lighted by how Mahone operates at the Powerplay level. Whilst the mutal defence lore wise is important at the founding of the Alliance to stop the Empire or the Feds getting tempted when Allioth kicked them both out, the Alliance is modelled more as a economic power house in ED these days. There is no central navy, or command structure (I think the system take it turns to head up the military if I remember). Lave is a classic example, economically other than a few tuts and letter writing (forum posts) - at the powerplay level there is no insentive for players or player groups to get involved.

I still cannot see why this war is the important one as I thought Workers own the asteroid base, and lave station - and I thought the least important station was won by conflcits started by matching influence. The last Laveradio suggested the opposite.

Simon

It seems very common on these forums to assume that Mahon is the Alliance and the Alliance is Mahon. That's no more accurate than saying that Jean Claude Junker is the EU and the EU is Jean Claude Junker (please no EU bashing and tangential arguments from this ). Mahon "The Power" is an individual's own power base centered around economic strength and favouring Corporate control of star system economies. The Alliance is a rag tag collection of star systems who all agree to internal free-trade, freedom of movement, and mutual defence, but also self-determination and governance. The two entities are connected but significantly different. Generally speaking, the players involved in each entity are very polarised in their view point too. The so-called Mahonites are very much focused on corporate governance, whereas the Alliance groups are more focused on the colour green and a diverse array of government types.

These two different outlooks are the cause of endless friction within "The Alliance" community. So asking the Mahonites for their opinion on turning a star system to independent corporate is going to give you a different response to asking an Alliance group for their opinion on flipping a system from Alliance green to Independent yellow.

Is this a failing of Powerplay?
Many suggest it is.
Personally, I argue that it is actually quite brilliant in concept!

Any fiction writer will tell you about the need for inherent conflict and drama. Powerplay adds internal conflict within the super power groups. Without it you would probably have 3 large communities with no cause for long term internal drama. Just like real-life, our in-game political entities now have different groups within them pulling in meaningful different directions.

Long live Alliance Lave [yesnod]
Long live Lave Radio :x

 

[smiths121]

It seems very common on these forums to assume that Mahon is the Alliance and the Alliance is Mahon. That's no more accurate than saying that Jean Claude Junker is the EU and the EU is Jean Claude Junker (please no EU bashing and tangential arguments from this ). Mahon "The Power" is an individual's own power base centered around economic strength and favouring Corporate control of star system economies. The Alliance is a rag tag collection of star systems who all agree to internal free-trade, freedom of movement, and mutual defence, but also self-determination and governance. The two entities are connected but significantly different. Generally speaking, the players involved in each entity are very polarised in their view point too. The so-called Mahonites are very much focused on corporate governance, whereas the Alliance groups are more focused on the colour green and a diverse array of government types.

These two different outlooks are the cause of endless friction within "The Alliance" community. So asking the Mahonites for their opinion on turning a star system to independent corporate is going to give you a different response to asking an Alliance group for their opinion on flipping a system from Alliance green to Independent yellow.

Is this a failing of Powerplay?
Many suggest it is.
Personally, I argue that it is actually quite brilliant in concept!

Any fiction writer will tell you about the need for inherent conflict and drama. Powerplay adds internal conflict within the super power groups. Without it you would probably have 3 large communities with no cause for long term internal drama. Just like real-life, our in-game political entities now have different groups within them pulling in meaningful different directions.

Long live Alliance Lave [yesnod]
Long live Lave Radio :x

Well I think that is a nice summary of the different views inside the Alliance community of which I am not part, so goingto plead ignorance, of the various groups, but discord within a community, with people pulling in different directions sounds like fun. Point about the different views of the Alliance community conceded, looking into Alliance from the outside, because of the lack of storyline for the Alliance compared to the other 2 powers, I think it is quite hard to seperate the Powerplay part of the community from those supporting the Alliance, so thanks for the description!

When Powerplay cam in, and you had the Fed and Empire, and the smaller - and the Alliance, no ranking (as I pointed out no military as such), smaller than the other 2, I actually thought modelling the Alliance as a power seemed correct. You had your 2 super powers scoring points of of each other through galnet and CGs, and a smaller, albeit important third power modelled as a .... well ..... power.

I personally would like to see power play have higher penalties for systems controlled by non-aligned factions, and better bonuses for systems controlled by aligned factions. There are affects based on allegiance in Powerplay now, again not done Powerplay for a long time, but altering control factions based on the allegiance did not seem to be a thing back in the day, government was more important as it directly affects triggers. I think this is still true. I work out of Mahone exploited systems that tend to be Fed, I hardly notice the Agricultural penalty around these parts. I would like to see more effects, and as I posted earlier, states affecting cc production to better link powerplay to BGS to commodity market to players experience, whether a PP player or not - an excuse to compete (whether PvP or PvE) is a good thing.

Cheers
Simon

 

[xondk]

Live all Politicians he has his own economic interests outside the Office he holds, favoruing Corporations

Players 'claiming' that however does not make it lore wise true.

 

[ranix]

Players 'claiming' that however does not make it lore wise true.

Fake news! He's just trying to discredit the Free Radio. Don't listen to him, the whole Alliance government is run by shapeshifting Thargoids

 

[Aashenfox]

I'm struggling to explain in words my feelings on the hypocrisy going on in here about old worlds and the like after the Alliance totally NINJAed a Fed permit system. Sounds like you don't like the taste of your own medicine. In your own words (or something like it) 'the game gives you these abilities, so you use them'. Have fun, and good luck to LAve Radio, they may not succeed, but they have every right to try, not because they are a player faction, because they are Elite players.

 

[Red Anders]

LIGHTS OUT! GUERILLA RADIO!

[video=youtube;H0kJLW2EwMg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H0kJLW2EwMg[/video]

Turn that err... stuff up.

 

[IamNickMan]

But LRN is a corporation faction which is favourable to Mahon's PP ethos. So I would have thought the Mahonites are in favour of flip and that was what suggested during the last broadcast.

Lol. Pretty much the only "alliance" player group that opposes it as far as I've seen so far is AEDC. Which is no surprise from a group that push patronages in aliance space.

 

[Schlack]

The point seems to be missed that negotiations with LRN are ongoing to reach a peaceful and mutually satisfactory settlement of this issue.

 

[Apos]

Lol. Pretty much the only "alliance" player group that opposes it as far as I've seen so far is AEDC. Which is no surprise from a group that push patronages in aliance space.

You are right. The AEDC only worked for the first ~50 lower triggers of Mahon, long before anyone else even cared about the BGS in general or its connections to PP.

Our main faction is also an alliance corporate spanning across 28 systems, controlling 27. 17 of those systems are within Mahon territory providing reduced triggers across 3 different bubbles.

In contrast, the patronage that we supported long before FD turned some Alliance supporters into corporate slaves with their lazy power ethos implementation, spans across 25 systems, out of which only 8 are within Mahon bubbles and all of them spread out in such a way that they do not cause any increased triggers and thus no damage to Mahon.

Not that there would be anything wrong with them if it was "just alliance space" mind you. Mahon space is not Alliance space. I mean...I assume you know that patronage is among the governments the Alliance factions can be.

So, generally, maybe you should improve your eyesight and information gathering. Also, as much as I would like to gloat that we can decide the fate of Lave alone, the large majority of Alliance groups are there fighting indeed, in a demonstration of rapid cooperation that makes any person enamoured with the lore of the Alliance shed a tear of joy seeing lore materialising into action.