Plus, they're delicious in a fruit salad, lol
Hot Take: Commonness in Zoos as a criteria for upcoming DLC animals
- Thread starter Marvinb
- Start date
Kiwi fits these too, you know.
Plus, the kiwi may be a ratite, but it's so unlike the others it overrules that anywau
My honest answer to that who cares?
Just cause an opinion is popular it doesnt mean its a good opinion.
Everybody can like more what they want, but the kiwi is propaply the most overhyped animal to come to this game since the leopard.
You can ofcourse subjectivly like these animals but the fact that we had a big cat clone at the top of the metawishlist shows more then clearly that popular =/= a good addition.
While the kiwi is much better then the leopard, its still majorly outclassed in every way by other animals who are just simply less popular, which is a shame.
This conversation has basicly been "why do you think the nene is better then the kiwi" actual arguments why i believe that "nah man the kiwi is less popular, people are stupid get your logical thinking out of here"
No it doesnt.
Its a flightless temperate bird without having a strong conservation story connected to zoos.
Meanwhile the nene is on a similar lvl as the prez wild horse.
Its like saying the african penguin fits those requirements
I do. Others do. Your opinion isn't the only one that matters, and having a rude attitude won't change the fact that the kiwi is more popular, more unique, and more loved than the nene
I don't understand this at all
You didn't say it has to be connected to zoos, you just said a conservation section in a zoo. So, yes, it fits. The kiwi was in danger because of settlers and invasive animals
I vote for goose because honk honk
Yes you do not understand.
Im not talking about opinions here, but comparing arguments why these animals should be in the game to explain why the kiwi being uncommon in zoos both matters and does not matter to how good of an addition it is to the game not by popularity or any other subjective metrics but its use cases and additions it does to the game by using a similar animal in the nene as an example to compare it to.
I tried to use arguments to argue why the kiwi while popular would be outclassed in actual use by the nene, why the nene would plain be the better inclusion from a gameplay perspective and that thats a valid reason why the nene outclasses the kiwi without subjective biase.
So using "its more popular, people are stupid so its better" as a counterargumemt just misses the point.
That wasnt what im talking about, ofcourse its more popular im not delusional and pointing out that being popular doesnt make for a good animal doesnt make me rude.
Well, people only vote for animals they know about. More people know about kiwis than Hawaiian Geese. Plus many people are probably okay with just any goose or waterfowl, but it was not possible to vote like that. A spot for "any waterfowl" which a Nene could represent might have gotten more popular than a kiwi.
So I would not say the most popular choice has to be the best choice. People might just not know what they are missing out on. People's knowledge of the animal kingdom should not be in the way for the best choices from a gameplay perspective.
Its a ratite thats smol.
Of course. I'm not saying that if it's more popular it's automatically better. If that's what was understood by what I said, then I apologize as it wasn't my intention.
What I was getting at is that, in the long run, I feel like a kiwi just adds more than a Hawaiian goose.
Any goose could make it into the game and bring
about the same level that the nene brings, minus the conservation story. I mean, bring us a Canadian goose and you can mod it into a nene.
But, you can't easily bring in a kiwi. No other bird on the planet is like it, relatively, and I personally think it's the better choice. It brings us an animal from an island that's even less likely than Hawaii to have rep in the game, it brings us an animal that also had a conservation story, and a perfect nocturnal animal for indoor house and aviaries, too
Counterpoint
If we get the nene that means modding can give us dozens of other species at a higher quality while still representing them and their very psinfully lacking niches in the vsnilla game, why we can still just as easily mod a kiwi, there are high quslity kiwi mods and in the end its just one highly niche animal that is very take it or leave it, even if very popular, while the other is allmost universally useable in every zoo
What im getting from this image is kiwi being as much unique taxonomically as nene.
Wiki says ratites are infraclass of birds just like marsupials are infraclass of mammals.
So saying kiwi is just another ratite would be like saying nene is another fowl or tasmanian devil is marsupial number 5.
I'm one of those weird people who are not interested at all in getting the kiwi 
If we get it, I will be happy for all who wanted it but, tbh, I don't really understand its popularity. I've never seen a kiwi in a zoo and there are so many more common in zoos birds that we need first. I mean, to me, any bird would be better than the kiwi at this point, except maybe the rhea. And hear me out... If you people really want representation for New Zealand, why not the kea? Amazing NZ bird and way more common in zoos than the kiwi. #TeamKea
If we get it, I will be happy for all who wanted it but, tbh, I don't really understand its popularity. I've never seen a kiwi in a zoo and there are so many more common in zoos birds that we need first. I mean, to me, any bird would be better than the kiwi at this point, except maybe the rhea. And hear me out... If you people really want representation for New Zealand, why not the kea? Amazing NZ bird and way more common in zoos than the kiwi. #TeamKea
Personally I'd like both the nene and the kiwi - both are WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY higher on my list than the shetland pony, which I have zero desire for... Even limiting to Scottish domestic animals only, the highland cow would be better (though i don't want it either).
For an island pack, though, if it's between the Kiwi and the Nene, I'd prefer the kiwi - Why? Well, lots of reasons but, if you want an 'objective' one (there is no reason why my preference should be objective), then it's because some other waterfowl (i have no particular desire for the nene above other ducks/geese/ swans etc.), could come in almost any biome, conservation or region pack and, therefore, has many more chances to be included in the game. The kiwi though, if it doesn't come in an islands pack, simply won't be included in the game at all. (also Kiwi are cuter, more interesting and provide an animal for a country that, so far, has no representation. Also their eggs are stupidly out-of-proportion (see below), which is cool.)
For an island pack, though, if it's between the Kiwi and the Nene, I'd prefer the kiwi - Why? Well, lots of reasons but, if you want an 'objective' one (there is no reason why my preference should be objective), then it's because some other waterfowl (i have no particular desire for the nene above other ducks/geese/ swans etc.), could come in almost any biome, conservation or region pack and, therefore, has many more chances to be included in the game. The kiwi though, if it doesn't come in an islands pack, simply won't be included in the game at all. (also Kiwi are cuter, more interesting and provide an animal for a country that, so far, has no representation. Also their eggs are stupidly out-of-proportion (see below), which is cool.)
Maybe a bit of a nitpick, but Hawaii is considered part of Oceania (which again I must stress is just a bunch of unrelated islands) despite politically being part of the USA.
In any case, I don't understand why this has suddenly become the "let's dunk on kiwis" thread. I really want both the kiwi and the nene and I don't see why they're being compared here as if one is going to replace the other - sure, the kiwi is significantly more likely to be added to the game, Islands Pack or otherwise, but that doesn't mean it's "taking the nene's spot". They're completely unrelated birds that fill entirely different niches (both in the wild and in zoos) and both deserve to be added to the game for different reasons. Everyone's opinions on which species should be prioritised is subjective and based on what they consider important for the game.
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I am not a kiwi fan and wouldn’t loose sleep over not getting them but I do want to ask why choose nene amongst geese. Sure it is a tropical goose with a nice conservation story but when the geese are a much more diverse group of animals compared to the kiwi, I can’t help but wonder why not the greylag goose? The Egyptian goose? Or the much superior Canada goose? If one says being more common in captivity warrants an animal being in the game then they can’t argue against the species I just listed over the nene.
I think this is being overlooked.
My suspicion is that builders and zoo nerds have specific species they want to see which are generally commonly kept species, but are essential for realistic zoos. They look at the SEA pack for example and go, "Most of these are unrealistic picks, but the dhole is surprisingly versatile. I guess this pack is fine."
The general public meanwhile goes "What's a bintuwrong? I've never heard of that, but it looks cute so I want. That pig has tusks going through its brain! So gnarly! Why does that monkey have a big nose, so cool!" They want novelty and stuff they haven't seen before.
I think a good pack needs a mix of both. Animals that are familiar and animals which have a spark of novelty.
There is no need for objective arguments to want an animal in game. If you like an animal that is enough. Personally I think a zoo game should offer a lot of common zoo animals but also some more special animals that are not so common or have unique looks or traits. I do think the chosen animals should be succesfully kept at zoos.