You do realize you can still play Elite: Dangerous in solo single player mode, right? The only difference is it updates the factions and changes in the galaxy assuming a persistant galaxy teaming with life.
Shok.
No Single Player Offline Mode then? [Part 2]
- Thread starter Brett C
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You do realize you can still play Elite: Dangerous in solo single player mode, right? The only difference is it updates the factions and changes in the galaxy assuming a persistant galaxy teaming with life.
Shok.
If there was a clear commitment and a date for this, this thread would be done within a day.
But just a statement that they will consider making this sometime in the future is too vague to comfort anyone. And even if they did that, they would probably charge extra.
Attack the idea not the poster!
There are only 2 areas you need to be clear on with regards to this fiasco : the legal side and the moral side.
- We're FD operating within the bounds of the law ? If they were then legally there is nothing you can do. This is a grey area for many as it depends where you live and the local laws in place.
- We're FD operating fairly ? This depends upon your morals and dictates whether you will do business with a company in the future. In this instance, FD may have operated within the bounds of the law (I don't know for sure - just saying) but they may have lacked morals about how they conducted themselves. (That's a personal decision you need to come to yourself)
Quite.
There are numerous citations of FD saying categorically "yes" during the KS.
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I think what has got peoples backs up even more is the fact that FD have obviously got their lawyers involved regarding refunds and concluded that they are not obliged to give a refund to anyone who took part in the Alpha/Beta. In other words, they made a decision purely on the legality of it rather than considering the community who have supported them.
Dear FD, do the right thing and give unhappy backers a partial refund if they want it. Make the decision BEFORE the party in two days time. I am due to go there and I want to be in a happy atmosphere when I get there.
Dear FD, do the right thing and give unhappy backers a partial refund if they want it. Make the decision BEFORE the party in two days time. I am due to go there and I want to be in a happy atmosphere when I get there.
Yeah, when you know that from the start! People thought they were buying a shed they could put in their garden and keep!
Exactly!
In the immortal words of the great Julius Henry Marx, "I don't care to belong to any club that will have me as a member".
For me no offline would have meant backing at a much lower tier, or quite possibly not backing at all.
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Cheers
Allegedly it's 10kbps (again, from the last newsletter), so you could be fine, if connection speed is all you're worried about.
Which, frankly, makes the whole thing stink even more of EA's SimCity and Blizzard's Diablo III fiascos to me.
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3MB/s is a quite high amount for an online game (I play a lot of online games with less than 0.1MB/s)Cheers
Ditto.
I backed to get a "DRM-free collectors edition". That's a pretty pointless pledgelevel now, no?
To be honest, if they had pitched the game back then as what they are going to sell us now, I wouldn't have backed. Rather I would have waited to see IF it would evne happen in the first place, and then if it did, pick it up from a "bargain bin" of around 5 quids. That's a £100 pounds of difference of how I valuate the 2 different products offered.
can we move on please. want to get back to looking forward to the game.
You're buying a license to use their intellectual property in the way they dictate. That's how it's always been (unless you're talking about open source) with software and music on digital and physical media.
"All rights of the producer and owner are reserved". If you dig out your heirloom copy of Elite you will probably find words to that effect, we've never "owned" any of these games just the right to use them.
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Unless your gamedesign revolves around a cloud based system.
How is one thread among the myriads in the forums interfering in any way with that? :S
Can I inject an off the wall left field thought?
In a purely single user game, there would really be no value in having a 400 billion star system universe - even playing continuously 24x7, never visiting any system twice, you'd need multiple lifetimes to visit every system in the galaxy, never mind actually taking the time to get any enjoyable gameplay in while doing it. FD have also talked about giving away the secrets of the galaxy & gameplay not matching the richness of the online experience etc, and the effort required to develop an offline universe that would match expectations...
So... how about harnessing a digital asset they already have in the bank? What about using the FE2 galaxy, procedurally converted like for like, for the offline game? Re-use the FE2 mission generation & NPC seeding code for the bulletin board missions etc & convert the galaxy layout, & use the ED client code, digital assets &c to provide the UI & combat etc... this would provide a coherent offline experience at a comparatively low effort, without spoiling the online multiplayer game in any way. It would kind of be FE2+++. Which would, I suspect, be perfectly fine - look at all the love OOlite gets, and that's basically a slightly jazzed up clone of the original elite!
If even that is too much effort, how about documenting & publishing the solo-online subset of the client-server API and incorporating an option that permits alternative connection to a 'localhost' server for solo play into the client? That server API will probably be documented at some point by a geek with a network sniffer & the patience to reverse engineer it, so get your retaliation in first... how would this help? Well, if the community can learn what the client sends to and expects from the server in solo online play, the community can develop its own local VM based server... can you imagine what the OOlite modding community might build given the opportunity to build an ED client compatible local VM based server for ED?
Pluses for Frontier; demonstrates support for the modding community, ensures that there almost certainly will be an evolving playable completely offline game using the ED client, absolves them of any responsibility for developing & maintaining such a thing if it is launched, or supporting it in any way, defuses a lot of the bitterness & distrust that has emerged recently, puts to bed the idea that this change is a DRM rights grab, and if the seperate offline gameplay that evolves is really rubbish compared with the online solo gameplay, proves ED's point about not being able to develop something good themselves.
Can anybody think of any downsides for Frontier about taking either of these options?
In a purely single user game, there would really be no value in having a 400 billion star system universe - even playing continuously 24x7, never visiting any system twice, you'd need multiple lifetimes to visit every system in the galaxy, never mind actually taking the time to get any enjoyable gameplay in while doing it. FD have also talked about giving away the secrets of the galaxy & gameplay not matching the richness of the online experience etc, and the effort required to develop an offline universe that would match expectations...
So... how about harnessing a digital asset they already have in the bank? What about using the FE2 galaxy, procedurally converted like for like, for the offline game? Re-use the FE2 mission generation & NPC seeding code for the bulletin board missions etc & convert the galaxy layout, & use the ED client code, digital assets &c to provide the UI & combat etc... this would provide a coherent offline experience at a comparatively low effort, without spoiling the online multiplayer game in any way. It would kind of be FE2+++. Which would, I suspect, be perfectly fine - look at all the love OOlite gets, and that's basically a slightly jazzed up clone of the original elite!
If even that is too much effort, how about documenting & publishing the solo-online subset of the client-server API and incorporating an option that permits alternative connection to a 'localhost' server for solo play into the client? That server API will probably be documented at some point by a geek with a network sniffer & the patience to reverse engineer it, so get your retaliation in first... how would this help? Well, if the community can learn what the client sends to and expects from the server in solo online play, the community can develop its own local VM based server... can you imagine what the OOlite modding community might build given the opportunity to build an ED client compatible local VM based server for ED?
Pluses for Frontier; demonstrates support for the modding community, ensures that there almost certainly will be an evolving playable completely offline game using the ED client, absolves them of any responsibility for developing & maintaining such a thing if it is launched, or supporting it in any way, defuses a lot of the bitterness & distrust that has emerged recently, puts to bed the idea that this change is a DRM rights grab, and if the seperate offline gameplay that evolves is really rubbish compared with the online solo gameplay, proves ED's point about not being able to develop something good themselves.
Can anybody think of any downsides for Frontier about taking either of these options?
You mean, aside from the requirement that our game be able to initiate and then maintain a connection with their servers each and every time? It's all well and good for Joe Blow, of course, who plays at home, will only ever play at home, and has ample time to pour into the game, but for those of us who, for whatever reason, don't want to be forced to log in each and every time, it's nothing but a hindrance.
In addition, I don't really see how the benefit of fluctuating market prices and charted missions is going to automatically make this a "persistent galaxy teaming with life" when it's supposedly an empty experience otherwise, but maybe that's just the cynic in me doing the talking.
Erm it's a Kickstarter you a guaranteed nothing - you were risking an investment to get a game made.
Sure there are theoretical inducements to get you to part with money, but nothing is guaranteed.
You basically have stepped into a Nerd version of investments in products and companies.
Sure there are theoretical inducements to get you to part with money, but nothing is guaranteed.
You basically have stepped into a Nerd version of investments in products and companies.
Especially about Kickstarter I'm not so sure they would not be obliged to give a refund:
- The "always online" requirement is clearly a form of DRM unless authentication is not a requirement to access the server or they make private servers available. A DRM-Free version was a promised reward which, from what I understand, Frontier will not deliver.
- It's less clear whether offline can be considered a binding promise they made but their continuous guarantees that it would be available even just 2 weeks ago is clearly a problem since it's obvious they knew for a longer time that the delivery of that feature was uncertain at best. One thing is to fail in delivering something, the other is to guarantee you will deliver when you already know you might not be able to.
Yep completely true, I'm not qualified enough to say whether what and where they said such things have any pertinence towards the actual legal culpability in terms of false advertising and misrepresentation though - like I said the majority of people seem to have bought beta access not the final game - so was the beta misrepresented or was the freebie misrepresented? No idea how that would work out if people pursued it
And yeah I still hope/think that FD will quietly give full or partial refunds as a goodwill gesture to those who are legitimately affected.
I have to disagree. We have wi-fi and even in third world countries they could run this game. When 'hinderance' becomes the focal point of a debate, it's like throwing the dumby out of the pram because "I can't get my own way", this is what it boils down to. Since we're still beta and the rest of the factions or alien races have not even been added yet. They could span hundreds of light years in either direction, far from being empty. Seems many have time to connect to the forums to have a good whinge, why not connect to the game like many of you already have and have fun. Even if it's just to kill me and hunt me down.
Shok.
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